Talk:The Hardy Boys/GA1

GA Review

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As with Nancy Drew, this is a comprehensive and well-written article. Before I pass this for GA, I just want to sort out some of the sourcing issues.

• What makes this site reliable?

It's not ... I just couldn't find anything that talked about the Casefiles, and I didn't want the article to ignore them completely. Do you have any suggestions? I'll try Lexis Nexus one more time.... Ricardiana (talk) 00:03, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, I found one lone article in LexisNexis (which apparently I can't spell), which I added, and I removed this source. Ricardiana (talk) 02:48, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

A Google News search seems to turn up some newspaper sources. Awadewit (talk) 01:22, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

WOW - thank you! I didn't know Google News indexed that far.... Ricardiana (talk) 02:49, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Hmm - well, it turns out the Google sources are pay-to-view, but I did find some of them through the Access World News database, as well as others, so I added another newspaper source (many just parrot each other and appear to be based either on each other or on a press release). Ricardiana (talk) 03:07, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

You can use Google to find the sources and then use News Bank and ProQuest to access them. I assume you have access, since you have access to LexisNexis. If you don't, let me know. I have access to all of those databases and can get you whatever you need. Awadewit (talk) 03:09, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the kind offer, Awadewit ... I was able to access most of the articles, and I think the two I found are enough, given that, as I said, most of the articles repeat each other. The only ones I couldn't access were: "Grandma's adventures with the Hardy Boys" and "Adventures entering the '80s with series." If you have the time, and they turn out to have anything worth adding, that would be wonderful and very kind of you. Ricardiana (talk) 03:34, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

I emailed you one of them - it has a different example than the article. You can decide if you like the "Black Widow" example better. :) Awadewit (talk) 03:46, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Much appreciated, Awadewit! (How do you send an email, by the way?) -- Please let me know what I can do to return the favor. Ricardiana (talk) 16:04, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

I just clicked on "Email this user" from your userpage. Welcome to the wiki, btw - we do little things like this all of time for each other. Isn't it wonderful? Awadewit (talk) 12:59, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

I never noticed that, thank you. This is wonderful! Ricardiana (talk) 02:07, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Replaced. Ricardiana (talk) 02:44, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

• What makes this site reliable?

Replaced with an article from the Wireless News of the London Financial Times (I think that's what the database said). Ricardiana (talk) 02:07, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

• What makes Keeline's essay reliable?

Keeline is indexed in the MLA Directory of Periodicals, not for this work, but for close to a dozen others; his most recent is an essay in Nancy Drew and Her Sister Sleuths, ed. Michael Cornelius. Also, his research is mostly based on the archives of the Stratemeyer Syndicate at the New Public Library and, I believe, Yale.

Sounds good. Awadewit (talk) 01:29, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

• What makes this site reliable?

Replaced with news source. Ricardiana (talk) 03:34, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

• What makes this site reliable?

Replaced. Ricardiana (talk) 02:44, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

• Grant, Tracy - How did you access this article? The Washington Post site or a database?

LexisNexis - added that info. Ricardiana (talk) 03:34, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

• Hill, Jason - How did you access this article? The Washington Post site or a database?

Actually, I was wrong below - this is from the Sydney Morning Herald's website. Ricardiana (talk) 03:34, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

• Woolnough, Damien - How did you access this article? The Advertiser site or a database?

I accessed all of these through LexisNexis. I'm not sure where to add that information in the "cite news" template, though - under Publisher?? Ricardiana (talk) 02:48, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

That is one reason I don't use the templates. I have no idea how to fit that information in there, but it is essential. I have found that LexisNexis' information sometimes differs from that I find at the newspaper itself, so it is crucial to say that you got the info from the database. You might ask at Template talk:Cite news. The editors there may even be alter the template. :) Awadewit (talk) 03:16, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

I see. I will ask over there, and hopefully they will modify the template. In the meantime, I've re-done those references without a template to indicate where I found them. Ricardiana (talk) 03:34, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

• The listing under the "Further reading" is missing the publication date.

Fixed. Ricardiana (talk) 02:48, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Beyond GA, here are some things to think about:

• As with the Nancy Drew article, I would include more information on the economics of the series and the ghostwriting. How much did the books cost and different times and how much were the writers paid? How much money have the series made? Etc.

Will add some info on this ... sadly, as with Nancy Drew, little info is available except for the early years of the Syndicate and nothing about the Mega-Books / post-Syndicate years. Ricardiana (talk) 02:50, 12 May 2009 (UTC)  Done

• I assume that the Hardy Boys have not undergone the same kind of physical transformation as Nancy? Have they changed at all?

They have, quite a lot, but I can't find any sources that talk about it - at least not reliable ones. The closest any source comes to a discussion of the Hardys' physical portrayal is to mention that their outfits are updated over the years ... I would love a section that talks about this, but the sources just aren't helping. Ricardiana (talk) 02:50, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

You should publish something and then you can quote yourself! :) Awadewit (talk) 02:28, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

• This image of Leslie McFarlane might be in the PD. You might write to McMaster and see if they can provide with details regarding the image.

• File:Stratemeyeredward.jpg - One of the books about the Stratemeyer Syndicate should have information about this photo. Once we add the info, we could add it to the article.

I uploaded a picture of Stratemeyer which should be in the public domain; the source and date info, etc., I took from Connelly's The Hardy Boys Mysteries. Ricardiana (talk) 03:30, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

• Such, at least, was McFarlane's intention: "It seemed to me the Hardy Boys deserved something better than the slapdash treatment Dave Fearless had been getting ... I opted for Quality." - This quotation is a bit difficult to understand - I don't think readers will know who Dave Fearless is.

Added a footnote. Ricardiana (talk) 02:50, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

• The "Evolution of the characters" and the "Cultural impact" sections have quite a few quotations. I would try to cut down on them. It makes it hard to read, as the writing style changes abruptly.

Will do.... Ricardiana (talk) 02:50, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Went through and pruned. Ricardiana (talk) 01:25, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

• Since there aren't very many images in this article, you might think about adding some quote boxes with quotes from the novels or from critics.

I like that idea a lot ... will try to think of / find some good quotations. Ricardiana (talk) 02:50, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Added one; will look for more to add. Ricardiana (talk) 01:25, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

Added a couple more. Ricardiana (talk) 03:30, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

• It would be best if you added the publication location to the references.

Agreed ... I'm not sure how to do that in the templates, though, and I must confess my heart quails at the thought of re-doing all those references. I guess it wouldn't be the end of the world.... Ricardiana (talk) 03:30, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

I think it is location=. I reiterate my loathing of templates. :) Awadewit (talk) 03:52, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

Ah, well, they do have their limitations. In any case, I think I've fixed this finally. Ricardiana (talk) 01:44, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

• Some of the ISBNs have dashes and some do not - they should be standardized.  Done

• If you take this to FAC, you will need to fix the ending punctuation of the quotations. See WP:PUNC and WP:MOSQUOTE.

Went through the whole article. I think it's OK now. Ricardiana (talk) 01:25, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

I hope these suggestions are helpful. Awadewit (talk) 23:22, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

Hi -- thanks, Awadewit, for your thorough review and helpful suggestions. I'll start working on them soon. Best, Ricardiana (talk) 23:58, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

I'm going to pass this for GA now. As I said, these other issues are things to work on beyond GA. Thanks for writing such a wonderful article! Awadewit (talk) 02:28, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Nominating for Featured Article status

I've nominated this article for Featured Article status. Please leave comments by clicking the link at the top of this page. Ricardiana (talk) 01:56, 3 June 2009 (UTC)