Talk:The Three Princes of Serendip

Clarity of Logic Behind Allegations

Reading this article, it seems that vital sections of the tale are missing; only a basic explanation of the reasoning behind the definition of serendipity can be extracted. The justification for the punishment of the main characters(I assume the princes are main characters) is not stated. It would be disproportionately beneficial to the usefulness of this article if someone who has some knowledge of The Three Princes of Serendip were to even make the events of the story fit together with something believable that remains slightly consistent with the theme.162.83.57.12 (talk) 04:05, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree with you ("vital sections are missing"). Furthermore, the main article has been horribly revised to the point of being misleading or even incorrect. I have no idea where the reviser got "but they always found something that was irrelevant but needed in reality." I have no idea what "they always found something that was irrelevant" even means, considering that part of their proscribed mission was to "seek out adventure". Furthermore, the unsought rewards were not always "needed in reality": gold, jewels, kingdoms were nice perks heaped upon them after saving a kingdom or princess from a horrible fate, but not "needed".

Even the History section has been badly mangled from earlier versions.

The main article needs to be fixed. AdderUser (talk) 23:39, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

I had a look at the history of the article, and the older seem worse if anything, the ones I chanced upon anyway. So I've done a bit to improve, I hope, the intro and story.--Annielogue (talk) 13:23, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Additional source for Talmudic Version

I type verbatim from a partial photocopy of The Exempla of the Rabbis - Being a Collection of Exempla, Apologues and Tales Culled from Hebrew Manuscripts and Rare Hebrew Books. by Moses Gaster, Ph. D. (Late President Folk Lore Society of Great Britain, Inte Haham of the Sephardic Communities of England, Vice-President Royal Asiatic Society, etc.), Prolegomenon by William G. Braude. KTAV Publishing House, Inc., New York, First published 1924, New Matter Copyright 1968. LC Classification BM 530 G36 1968. LCCN 67-13416.

It seems to be a compendium of short Talmudic tales told in numbered entries. Each entry varies from a sentence or two to a page or so. On page 63-64 of this work are entries "49. A Min and R. Ami disputed about the resurrection of the dead after they are changed into dust. ..." "50. A Min and Gabolia b. Pesisa disputed about the quickening of the dead. ..." and then number 51:

51. Two Jews were carried away captive from Mount Carmel. The captor following them overheard one saying to the other "A she-camel has passed before us, she is blind of one eye and on one side she carries wine and on the other vinegar, and two men lead her the one an heathen and the other a Jew." The captor said "Oh ye sons of a stiffnecked people, whence do ye know that? "They replied: "We recognized a she-camel by the foot-prints, the blindness because she feeds only off the grass on one side of the road, the wine dropping down has soaked into the earth, the vinegar makes bubbles, and the heathen is not so careful in his manners as the Jew." The captor ran after them and found the words true. Walking further they said: "We smell the pots boiling 400 miles off in Judaea." He replied, "you are too clever for me, your God cannot stand you and how can I?" He brought them home and his mother killed a she-lamb and placed it before them and gave them wine to drink. One said to the other "This flesh smells of the dog and the wine of the corpse." The man asked his mother if this was so and she explained that this lamb had been suckled by a bitch and the vine had grown on the grave of his father. After they had eaten the man began to dance and they said "That is an illegitimate child." He frightened his mother and she owned that she had once made a mistake with a dancer and then he came back and said unto them "Blessed is the Lord who has selected the seed of Abraham and has given them of his wisdom. Wherever you go you will be the masters of your master." And he gave them gifts and set them free and they returned to their own country.

Each numbered section has references at the back. On page 195-196 are the references for entry 51.

Clever Jewish Slaves.
Sanhedrin, f. 104b..
Lament. R. I, Chapter 4. (Lamentations Rabba. ed. Buber, Wilna, 1899.)
cf. Lament. R. I Chapter 12.
cf. Lament. Zutta.
cf. Zabara, Book of Delight ch. 53-56, p. 21 note. (Zabara, J. Sefer Shaashuim (Book of Delights) (XII). ed. Davidson. New York. 1914.)
Aboab, Man. Ham. ch 305. (Aboab, I, (XIII), Menorat Hamaor, ed. pr. Venice, 1544.)
Yalk. Sip. IV, p. 87. (Yalkut Shimeoni (XIV). ed. pr. Salonika 1521. ed. Venice 1566.)
Maase Buch No. 153. (ed. pr. Basel, 1602 and Amsterdam, 1725.)
Helvicus, Historien II, ch. XL, p. 124. (Helvicus, C., Judische Historien, 2 vols., Giessen, 1612.)
Perles, Rabbinische Sprachen, p. 65f. (Breslau, 1873.)
Singer in Z. V. Vlksd. II, p. 299. (Zeitschrift. des Vereins fur Volkskunde. Berlin, 1891ff.)
Arsenie II, p. 38ff.
Burton, Supplemental Nights, IV, p. 7f (1888)
Carmoly, Jardin Enchante No. 11, p. 118-123. (Brussels, 1844)
Clouston, Eastern Rom. p. 194 and 511ff. ("A Group of Eastern Romances and Stories," Privately published, 1889.)
Christ. Armeno, Peregrinaggio.
Gaster Anuar p. Is. P 26f.
Habicht, 1001 Nights, XI, Night 458. (Habicht, M. und v.d. Hagen, F.H. und Schall, K. Tausend und Eine Nacht., Breslau, 1877.)
Knowles, Tales of Kashmir, p. 484-496. (London, 1888.)
Legrand, Chansons grecques, p. 258 to 264. (Recueil de Chansons Populaires Grecques. Paris, 1874.)
cf. Legrand, Mon. neo-Hellenique I, No. 19.
Levi, Rev. Et. Juives, No. 22.
Liebrecht to Dunlop, II², p. 44-47.
Mas'oudi, III, ch. 46, p. 228-35.
Olrik in Z.V. Vlksd. IV, 1894, p. 348f.
Ralston, Tib. Tales, No. 8. (Ralston, W.R.S., Tibetan Tales, v. Schiefner.)
Voltaire, Zadig, ch. III.
Saxo Grammaticus III p. 113f. (v. Elton.)
Shakespeare, Hamlet.
Simrock, Quellen d. Shakespeare, I, p. 81 to 85; III, p. 170. (Der gute Gerhard und die dankbaren Toten. Bonn, 1856.)
cf. Vesselovsky, Schachaschi, p. 21 and note 2.
Codd, G.97 (Jerahmeel) f. 752; 184, No. 111.
AdderUser (talk) 02:43, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

No source citation to major source quoted on this page

This article is quoted/paraphrased heavily from the World Heritage Encyclopedia. There is no source citation to the World Heritage Encyclopedia on the page. http://central.gutenberg.org/articles/the_three_princes_of_serendip April61 (talk) 13:23, 10 May 2017 (UTC)

OR, did the World Heritage Encyclopedia copy the Wikipedia article? I am unsure. April61 (talk) 13:51, 10 May 2017 (UTC)

A large part of the current article content was contributed by user Annielogue (see the intro and summary).

I didn't use that article, so presumably they got it from here. The attribution on the page isn't very clear about that. --Annielogue (talk) 12:38, 6 August 2017 (UTC)

This "World Heritage Encyclopedia" and "World Library" is publishing several pages which are copies of Wikipedia articles (see Citing sources for example). This is not a problem when they attribute the content back to Wikipedia and publish it with the correct copyleft license; but in the former page that you linked, that is actually a copyright violation. Diego (talk) 13:58, 10 May 2017 (UTC)

Oh, in fact the "World Heritage Encyclopedia" articles have the correct attribution, license and link back to Wikipedia at the bottom. Never mind then, this is valid reuse of Wikipedia content. Diego (talk) 14:09, 10 May 2017 (UTC)

English (MCB)-5 180.188.249.211 (talk) 06:53, 20 January 2024 (UTC)