Talk:Theatres des Vampires

Incubus

Is Incubus Robert Cufaro or Alex Pallotta?
On The Metal Archives (under former members) it says:
Count Morgoth (aka Incubus) (Roberto Cufaro) - Guitars (Lord Vampyr, VII Arcano, Sepolcrum, 3rd Room)

Incubus IS Alex Pallotta. You can find this info in this albums: Bloody Lunatic Asylum, Iubilaum Anno Dracula and The Vampire Chronicles. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.176.97.110 (talk) 13:22, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Band genre

First demos as Sepolcrum are obiouvsly Doom Metal (as in http://www.metal-archives.com/band.php?id=37565) with death metal referencies (later Sepolcrum evolved in the Death Metal band VII Arcano and in Theatres des Vampires). Sepolcrum is also credited by Rockdetector (http://www.rockdetector.com/artist,41143.sm) as one of the first goth metal bands, but their demoes (other than the doom-metallish "Gather my blood forever" credited to VII Arcano but made by Sepolcrum) are rather impossibile to find, so I can't comment on this. First TdV album (Vampyrisme, Necrophilie...) is rather melo-black (http://www.metal-archives.com/band.php?id=5044). Subsequently, from The Vampire Chronicles they shift torwards a more gothic path. Some people define this "Extreme Gothic Metal" (Goth metal with black influences and extreme attitude) as in http://www.metal-temple.com/interview.asp?id=252 - http://goth.fm/?page_id=14 - http://www.truemetal.it/forum/134131-post64.html - http://killgod. forumcommunity.net/?t=2509331 (this is an old interview for MetalManiacs Magazine). The band itself in an interview in 2002 define the sound of the band in this way:

Strana domanda questa. E’ dal 1998 che i Theatres des Vampires non si definiscono più Black Metal. Avremo detto questo in circa... 45 interviste in italia ed all’estero... forse di più (scusa non riesco ad essere più preciso con il numero... forse ne dimentico qualcuna). A dire il vero considero questo un pregio dei Theatres des Vampires, in quanto non trovo il Black Metal molto stimolante, almeno nella sua forma attuale... noi ci consideriamo quello che ci definiscono all’estero nella quasi totalità dei casi: “Extreme Gothic Metal”... Non ho idea perchè in Italia ogni tanto riesca questa definizione di Black Metal... (molto raramente a dire il vero). (Necros, the keyboardist)

This is a strange question. Is from 1998 that Theatres des Vampires didn't define themselves black metal anymore. We have told this in... 45 interviews in Italy and in the world... maybe more (I'm sorry but I cant' remember the exact number). I consider that a merit of Theatres des Vampires because I think Black metal isn't very challenging in its actual form... we define ourselves something that outside Italy people call "Extreme Gothic Metal". I don't know whay in Italy sometimes (not very often) they call us Black Metal. (It's just a quick attempt of a translation, I'm not very good at English).

The last album isn't easy to define, is very EBM influenced, some reviews compared that to Hocico (but the band refuses the EBM label). Some reviews defined it "Darkwave" o "Goth rock" (http://www.gothtronic.com/?page=23&reviews=4823). It surely isn't goth-metal.

--Der Blutsauger (talk) 12:44, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Note from an external User: Anima Noir it's for sure EBM influenced. But for sure the last Moonlight Waltz it's a 100% Gothic Metal Album. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.45.228.126 (talk) 18:42, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

Band genre and reliable sources (again)

About Blackmetalbaz rollbackings...

"Primary sources, are often difficult to use appropriately. While they can be both reliable and useful in certain situations they must be used with caution": That's it, interview (primary) backed by website(s). How many books do you think exists about Theatres des Vampires? NONE. How many "non-online" resources do you have about Teatres des Vampires? NONE. How many useful edits have you done about Theatres des Vampires? NONE. If you have some interesting reliable sources about TdV I'll be happy to see them. Post some "reliable sources" and we can talk together about useful edits to this page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Der Blutsauger (talk • contribs) 17:02, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

First of all, read WP:CIVIL. Secondly, the situation is far less complex than you make out. Nothing the band says about their genre can be used as a definitive source (but could potentially be included in an "influences" section, if direct quotes are provided). The genre box, and anything in a "genre" subsection must be sourced exlusively from things that pass WP:RS; anything else needs to be purged with extreme prejudice. Finally, if you try and include blatantly fictitious genres ("extreme gothic metal" being an obvious example), they will be removed on sight. A good indication is generally whether a separate article exists for the (sub)genre... hence "melodic death metal" has an article, "brutal death metal" does not. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 17:41, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Extreme gothic metal is a redirect to Gothic black metal. They're the same thing. The problem is that we do not have ANY source that is completely acceptable under WP:RS. Actual genres are unsourced (goth-metal ref is the musicmight page about Sepolcrum, a completely different band from today TDV, blackmetal ref is another musicmight page and musicmight do not pass WP:RS), as most of the page. If we follow strictly WP:RS (no webzines, no websites, no user-made contents) we have no sources at all, that's the truth. The only source I can think is an old number (2006) of Flash (an italian metal magazine) that called TdV a "goth rock band"... probably ignoring what gothic rock is. Der Blutsauger (talk) 11:31, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

"Extreme gothic metal" is indeed a redirect but not because it is a legitimate synonym; it is another case of endless fictitious metal genres being bandied about on Wikipedia. Anything on MusicMight written by Garry Sharpe-Young (username Taniwha) absolutely passes WP:RS as his material (under the site's previous name Rockdetector) has been published in book form by the third-party Cherry Red. I can even probably drag the original books out if you like. You have clearly misunderstood WP:RS; things like Allmusic and Chad Bowar's heavymetal.about.com pages are examples of web content that is perfectly acceptable for sourcing genres, as their work has been print-published elsewhere by a commercial third-party source. All non-professional webzines are worthless, as is the likes of Metal Archives, and anything from the band itself is a definite no-no, or we'd have Cradle of Filth down as "heavy funk" and Leng Tch'e as "razorgrind". Blackmetalbaz (talk) 12:32, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

We are talking about something changing day by day... I've heard talking in everyday life and in magazines of ext-goth as a gothblack synonim, you've not...I like it very much because it's a perfect description of a particular genre, but what matters is substance not words. Have you ever seen allmusic classifications? LOL. But I understand your policies. I'll search some sources and I'll think something... Der Blutsauger (talk) 18:15, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

Allmusic genre classifications are indeed quite comical, but we never use them for sourcing genres as they are not obviously editor-approved; we just use the biogs and reviews. To use "extreme gothic metal", you'd have to find reliable sources talking about it as a legitimate subgenre in detail, and create that article first. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 19:23, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

Theatres Des Vampires Latinoamerica

Theatres Des Vampires Latinoamerica / Fansite & Comunidad oficial en español

www.theatresdesvampires.com.ar

www.theatresdesvampires.forolatin.com

www.myspace.com/tdv_latinoamerica

www.youtube.com/TdvLatinoamerica

www.facebook.com/TheatresDesVampiresLatinoamerica — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.123.211.239 (talk) 08:53, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Band and Album Name

Is there some reason that there's absolutely no mention of the fact that this band's name is a reference to the Théâtre des Vampires in Interview With the Vampire and The Vampire Lestat from the series The Vampire Chronicles (which they also named one of their albums after) by Anne Rice?

If not, I feel it should be added. -Draeth Darkstar (talk) 22:19, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

I agree. Anybody have something we can source so it's not OR? --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 15:12, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

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