Talk:Thomas Telford School

Untitled

TTelford is a well known CTC Victuallers 16:12, 24 March 2007 (UTC) I have removed the following from this article as they appear to be malicious, un-sourced and biased. If someone wishes they could find sources for any of the following and replace them in the article. I also have my doubts about some of the positive comments so any references there would also be useful. - Alexx16x 20070215

To be honest, while some of the below is obviously malicious, your edits have left the school looking like it is not in the slightest controversial, which anyone in the education industry would tell you is wrong. The article could probably do with a re-write, in order to mention the pre-selection issues (parents being interviewed before admission, no appeal against headmasters decisions, students being dropped from subjects etc). It is also widely known that TTS's 5 A-C results were almost entirely due to their GNVQ ICT course which they ran themselves. The problem is that Sir Kevin is notoriously litigious, which is why I am logged out now! SO if anyone's brave enough....

Due to the schools over-hyped success, it is heavily oversubscribed by Daily Mail readers.

-Who says it is over-hyped?

-Only daily mail readers apply to the school!?

Controversy In the local area, it is widely believed that the school pre-selects all of its pupils, thus not really earning its 'top Comprehensive' status.

-Can anyone provide a source where this is stated? Has this been claimed by the press for instance?

All sane people view the system as elitist, finding it hard to believe that a school in an area containing some of the worst performing schools in the country could achieve such high levels of success just through a 'different' style of teaching.

-All sane people believe this???

-The DfE provides 'Value Added' scores for all schools (based on their improvement from KS2 (before secondary) to KS4 (GCSE)). Thomas Telford was ranked 58th in the country on this score which is designed to rate what the school has added and would negate any selective entrance. These results are on the BBC website.

However, the school lies that it pre-selects absolutely none of its pupils. This is said by pupils being selected because of sporting abilities (thtat could be trained at Idsall School) and if they are gifted in other areas or have parents in the teaching sector.

-This paragraph has exceptionally poor gramar.

-If it is a fact the school lied about this then provide sufficient evidence such as a court case won against the school on this subject. If not, this is just an opinion and has no place in an encyclopedia.

In 2005 there was more controversy as the Times 'school league tables' changed how they ranked schools up and down the country. Schools were now ranked according to the percentage of pupils achieving 5 or more A*-C GCSEs/GNVQs including English and Mathematics and Thomas Telford lost its perfect score of 100%. The school was accused, in some quarters, of using GNVQs to increase the amount of passes at A*-C standard. However, the school freely admits that GNVQs 'help the school' and most schools' scores dropped considerably after the scoring system change. Guardian Article

-The article linked does not state that the School is at the centre of the contreversey, but that the exam itself is (GNVQ)

-I have replaced the above text which appears to manipulate the article sourced to appear negative for the school with the following:

In 2006 the scoring system for Secondary Schools league tables was adjusted to stipulate that GCSE Mathematics and English must be included in pupils performance. The measure used remains % of students achieving 5 or more passes at Grade A*-C in GCSE or Equivalent. As a result, most schools performance declined in 2006 when compared to 2005 results using the previous measure. Thomas Telford achieved 95% 5 or more top grade passes under the new system compared to 100% in 2005 under the old system. Using the new measure retrospectively, Thomas Telford's results would have been 94%, 92% and 96% for 2003 through 2005 respectively.

Within the first five years of its life, the school was often known to simply 'drop' underachieving GCSE pupils from subjects they knew wouldn't be able to pass. These pupils would then be forced into GNVQ subjects at sixth form, which greatly decreased their chances of continuing on to university. This practice kept the school's GCSE fail record down, but left many pupils without GCSEs in core subjects.

-Known by who? This seems again to be opinion rather than fact.

There have been rumours of Sir Kevin deciding to make football a compulsory subject for all students throughout all years to create an elitist football team, he has been heard to say that football is and always will be his first love, and he will always hold it above all other education. However these remain unfounded, and his Knighthood for Education seems to dispel any myths there might be as to his disdain for educational subjects other than Physical Education.

-Rumours said by who? He has been heard Where? by Who?

Famous Sons of Thomas Telford School

• Kenny Swain (footballer) - European Cup Winner with Aston Villa

Perhaps someone could enlighten me as to how a man born in 1952 is a "Famous Son" of a school founded in 1991?

- Ebtx

I have removed this sentence about the list of former students. This is sort of statement should not be contained in an encyclopedia article:

"Feel free to add to this list if you know of any others, bearing in mind all additions will be checked for authenticity."

- WH

The heading is a little misogynistic, too, given that one of the "sons" is female.

Re: Kenny Swain, he was formally football director at the school. I suppose you could say that since the heading does not specify "famous alumni", he can be included as a former member of staff.

- Kyops

Pre-selection

Here is how the pre-selection process works:

Students that have applied for a place at the school are invited to attend an admission day. During the course of this day each student takes an exam. The students are graded and placed in an ability "band", depending upon their performance. An equal number of students from each band are then selected.

However, having worked at the school, I can say that the selection process does seem biased in favour of students with higher academic and/or sporting performance. In addition, the socio-economic make-up of the students is widely skewed towards those from the middle to upper income bracket, despite the fact that students are supposed to be taken from deprived areas of Telford and Wolverhampton.

This is still my own subjective observation, though. It's unlikely that anyone will ever conclusively prove or disprove whether the selection process is biased.

In the school's defence one should not belittle the work of the staff who work very hard to ensure that pupils attain the high standards for which the school is known.

In terms of the article as it is now, it has obviously been heavily edited by someone from the school, as it reads more like a promotional brochure than an encyclopedia entry. Considering the amount of (largely superfluous) information on the IT infrastructure, it's likely to be someone from the IT/Media Services department.

-Kyops

Gut the article?

Anyone else think this article needs to be SERIOUSLY chopped down. It seems overtly POV to me, as stated by the above, probably written by a biased staff memeber. Also, what is going on with that infobox? why is it yellow? surely a normal school/college infobox would be sufficient? 84.67.223.234 21:50, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Notable Alumni

The attendance of all the people, but for one, listed in this section was not appropriately referenced. User Velella made a piecemeal expungement of some of them, but left many that remained without citations. A notice for improvement was added in May 2009, but given the dearth of referencing since then, I have cleaned up this section.

-lordrsb — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lordrsb (talk • contribs) 17:00, 14 April 2012 (UTC)

After revision 534408252 reinstated the allegedly "notable" alumni which were uncited, I added 'citation needed' flags in my revision 541249798. There have been no citations provided in over a year, so I have again (justifiably) removed references to these persons. To allow other users to provide citation in a fair amount of time, I have reinstated an uncited alumnus (with a appropriate flagging), and added a citation notice for three alleged alumni currently present without citations. I would ask that users abide by the principles of Wikipedia regarding citations, and do not let their own opinions on personal notability guide their editorial practices. Regards, Rob - added by Lordrsb 13:08, 2 May 2014 (GMT)

this article, despite much competition must win the award for most partial page on wikinonsense

Ah, the uncited footballers return. 'Citation needed' marks have been added, again. All sources of information provided need to be appropriated cited, rather than based on hazy memories, conjecture or outright falsehoods. - added by Lordrsb 11:02 22/01/2015 (GMT)

Deleted suspected POV/advertising

No offense intended to the school, but I have deleted "This is why they achieve what they say" from the end of the section "Achievements and school life" as a suspected POV. It is more appropriate for use in a school prospectus than an encyclopedic article unless in the context of a quoted statement.Cloptonson (talk) 20:19, 2 January 2015 (UTC)