Talk:Three Angels' Messages

Having found that there was a link to this where no article yet existed, I've created this page.

I've attempted to make the article free from bias, especially in the upper half, where I directly quoted from a Bible version that was not copyrighted in order to be even more free from bias.

I've added the Adventist interpretation, because that's what I'm familiar with. I welcome people with knowledge of other interpretations to add what they know to the list, under the interpretations heading.

And if anyone knows how to get "The Great Controversy" to link to the proper page, which is "The Great Controversy (book)" without having the ugly "(book)" showing up on the page, it would be appreciated if you would fix that.

(NorthernFalcon 23:25, 31 March 2007 (UTC))

cleanup template

Apparently, my passive voice writing style is a bad thing, something which I do all the time. Perhaps it's the weak point in my writing style. At any rate, I've had to make the Seventh-day Adventist section sound a little more biased in order to dump the passive voice warning. Feel free to rewrite if you're better at it than I apparently am.

(NorthernFalcon 00:24, 1 April 2007 (UTC))

I'm rather prone to the same problem, actually. Please don't let my edit suggestion dissuade you from further work, as this article was far better written than the vast majority of new articles. Keep up the good work, MrZaius^talk 00:34, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Strunk and White win again. (NorthernFalcon 01:24, 1 April 2007 (UTC))

Remnant church

The article states that the Seventh-day Adventist Church believes it is the remnant church. I would like to discuss this point. This belief does not appear in the 28 Fundamentals, although some believe that it is indirectly/implicitly implied. It is certainly the standard traditional interpretation. Is the current wording as accurate as it could be? Colin MacLaurin 17:07, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, I'll change that. In my mind SDA church = remnant comes automatically because of the baptismal vow. Tonicthebrown 03:06, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Historic vs traditional view

Okay, here's my understanding of the difference. The pioneers thought that the first 2 messages were preached prior to October 22 1844 through the Millerite movement. This is reflected in Ellen White's writings:

To William Miller and his colaborers it was given to preach the warning in America. This country became the center of the great advent movement. It was here that the prophecy of the first angel's message had its most direct fulfillment. The writings of Miller and his associates were carried to distant lands. Wherever missionaries had penetrated in all the world, were sent the glad tidings of Christ's speedy return. Far and wide spread the message of the everlasting gospel: "Fear God, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come."

The second angel's message of Revelation 14 was first preached in the summer of 1844, and it then had a more direct application to the churches of the United States, where the warning of the judgment had been most widely proclaimed and most generally rejected, and where the declension in the churches had been most rapid. But the message of the second angel did not reach its complete fulfillment in 1844. The churches then experienced a moral fall, in consequence of their refusal of the light of the advent message; but that fall was not complete. As they have continued to reject the special truths for this time they have fallen lower and lower. Not yet, however, can it be said that "Babylon is fallen,... because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication." She has not yet made all nations do this. The spirit of world conforming and indifference to the testing truths for our time exists and has been gaining ground in churches of the Protestant faith in all the countries of Christendom; and these churches are included in the solemn and terrible denunciation of the second angel. But the work of apostasy has not yet reached its culmination.

But after Jesus did not return in 1844, they believed that all 3 of the messages had to be proclaimed again. Am I correct? Tonicthebrown 03:54, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Don't know, but I was interested to notice "most direct fulfillment", "more direct application", and 2nd message "did not reach its complete fulfillment in 1844". So Ellen White seems to talk about primary fulfillments, but not a single, exclusive fulfillment. Colin MacLaurin 11:25, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

"The first message is to be repeated … The second angels' message is to be repeated… This prophecy will be fulfilled" {16MR 40} "It is this work of judgment, immediately preceding the second advent, that is announced in the first angel's message." {GC88 352} "given in 1843 and 1844 … but all three of the messages are still to be proclaimed. …they shall be repeated to those who are seeking for the truth. … showing … the things that have been, and the things that will be." --Manuscript 32, 1896. These quotes show that the 3 angels message must be repeated, and will be strengthened by the 4th Angel of Rev18, when the Latter rain in its fullness, is 10 times the early rain, or Pentecost. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.8.251.250 (talk) 09:00, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Progressive views

Good idea adding this section! I am very interested to know what progressive scholars think about the 3 angels' messages. Tonicthebrown 03:07, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Old church logo

Surely someone out there has a copy of the old SDA church logo which we can scan in and include in this article? I've have a look through my own old stuff and my parents' belongings.

Oh, check out [1]!! It appears even the new logo contains symbolism of the 3 angels messages! Tonicthebrown 03:11, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Other Churches?

What do other churches think of the 3 Angels' Messages? Surely it's got to be in those Left Behind books, right? (NorthernFalcon 19:58, 4 April 2007 (UTC))

I agree. Since Revelation 14:6-12 is in the Bible, it is worthwhile to explore what other churches thing of the text. And, if other churches have no thought on the text, that's worth exploring as well, since it is in the Bible and speaks to the urgency with which Adventists treat the text.

What is surprising is that, to date, there is no rush from mainstream Christian contributors/editors to build up the article with general, non-SDA content and commentary. --76.69.37.102 (talk) 17:34, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Alot of junk

"The messages have special significance for the Seventh-day Adventist Church, which considers them to be a summary of its mission to the world."

Right off the bat. That is not the best description of how Revelation 14 should be presented.

It looks like someone that doesn't like the SDA church added a bunch of comments that point out how the SDA church thinks it's the remnant.

This makes the SDA church look like a cult. That's the kind of things cults go around saying.

I'll mess with this next, I guess.. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rush4hire (talk • contribs) 11:05, 26 April 2007 (UTC).

I actually somewhat agree with this. I would like to see the Lead summarize the article and briefly the three angel's message. Then, as a minor thing, add the significance to the Adventist Church. This would never be a good article because the Lead is not doing what it is supposed to. If I have some time, I may help, but for now, anyone who wants to jump on it...go for it. --Maniwar (talk) 15:14, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Alot of work

This one really needs alot of work. I move to seperate each of the 3 angels into their own page, and this page can be a summary.

Then you have all these other wonderful subjects to deal with.

I removed any line that said something like: "traditionally the Seventh Day Adventist church believes it is the remnant church of bible prophecy"

Every church thinks it's the remnant church, so this is a redundant and a weak statement. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rush4hire (talk • contribs) 18:02, 26 April 2007 (UTC).

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