Talk:Thunderbolts Way

End of road

Does this road end at Inverell, Yetman or further up into QLD? Reliable sources for this are hard to find.Cgoodwin (talk) 22:36, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Indeed they are. The promotional site, thunderboltsway.com.au is not particularly reliable. It clearly labels the southern half of Bucketts Way as part of Tunderbolts Way, making me a little dubious about their claim that it ends at Goondiwindi. The Goondiwindi article notably doesn't mention Thunderbolts Way, and neither does Inverell. --Athol Mullen (talk) 06:36, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

The text of the article indicates that the northern end is Inverell, but the distance shown is wrong (should be 306 Km). The Infobox shows Walcha, with the correct distance. Google maps shows Thunderbolts Way ending about 16 Km south of Inverell, where it becomes Tingha Road (which does not lead to Tingha). I think it would be best to settle on Inverell and 306 Km.Downsize43 (talk) 05:29, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

I'd concur with the endpoint. There's obviously some confusion as to where this road actually starts and ends. Walcha Council's website says that it passes through Raymond Terrace and Glen Innes,[1] but the Thunderbolt's Way map linked to from the council's page contradicts that.[2] (I live in Raymond Terrace and it definitely doesn't pass through here!) The map is from maps.com.au, which is a reliable source, and shows Thunderbolt's Way as extending from the Pacific Highway in Twelve Mile Creek, a suburb of Port Stephens Council, to Goondiwindi. The source attributed to the map is the New South Wales Department of Lands, which is authoritative. This map is the same as used by thunderboltsway.com.au and is linked to from the article. That said, I've examined the topographic maps I have and they show Thunderbolt's Way as extending from Gloucester to where it crosses Copes Creek, 16km south of where Tingha Road meets the Gwydir Highway in Inverell. --AussieLegend (talk) 13:33, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

While there has been a proposal to rename the section of Bucketts Way between Twelve Mile and Gloucester to Thunderbolts Way, it hasn't happened. I think that you'll find that the Department of Lands are the copyright holder for the underlying mapping, not for the overlay marking the route. If the Department of Lands published a document marking that section as being named Thunderbolts Way, it'd be a reliable source, even if it's wrong. A second hand map that has been altered by maps.com.au is only as reliable as that web site. I can't find any reliable source that shows the section south of Gloucester as being part of Thunderbolts Way. Conversely, any source that makes that claim is probably not reliable.  :-) --Athol Mullen (talk) 05:36, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

I drove past the signpost indicating Thunderbolts Way at its intersection with the Bruxner Highway near Yetman recently. So, along with Thunderbolts Way map supporting this I guess that this is a fair assumption as to the end of the road? I did not see any evidence that it extended beyond here. Cgoodwin (talk) 03:36, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

There's also a Thunderbolt's Way sign at the end of Clyde St in Inverell. These signs don't officially designate the road names, as strange as that may seem. I'm not sure which Thunderbolts Way map that you mean but the one from http://thunderboltsway.com.au isn't reliable. Official topographic maps are authoritative. The NSW Department of Lands website, which includes 1:100000 topo maps, shows where Thunderbolts Way becomes Bundarra Road, at the bridge over Copes Creek, which is the boundary between Gilgai and Tingha.[3] You'll have to zoom in to get the road names to appear. --AussieLegend (talk) 04:07, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

The map that I used was a Cartoscope map of Thunderbolts Wayy which quoted the Dept of Lands as its source. My computer will not diplay the NSW Department of Lands maps, but if you feel the map and older article is correct, then please revert it. Many roads also have multiple names as they pass though towns and this is leading to much confusion, too.Cgoodwin (talk) 04:25, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I originally referred to the Cartoscope map as well (that's the one used by thunderboltsway.com.au) but it was pointed out that while DOL owns the underlying mapping, not the overlay mapping the route.[4] As it turns out, there is a difference between what DOL and Cartoscope say is Thunderbolts Way. --AussieLegend (talk) 04:39, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I have just been uploading more photos that were recently taken and noticed that the one of Boggabilla, New South Wales has Thunderbolts Way and Inverell pointing along the Bruxner Highway there. All Very confusing!Cgoodwin (talk) 07:11, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

It can be confusing, which is why it's a good idea to take a lot of these things with a grain of salt and see what the really authoritative references say. Just north of the Hexham bridges, which are actually in Tarro, not Hexham there is a sign saying "Welcome to the Mid North Coast", despite being well inside the Hunter Region. On the other side of the road, heading south, is a "Welcome to the Hunter" sign. They're there because of an economic decision by Port Stephens Council to joing some Mid-North Coast based group. At One Mile, there are road signs incorrectly calling the suburb "One Mile Beach". Fortunately, the Department of Lands and Geographical Names Board have it right. Of course, supposedly reliable sources don't always get it right. My parents have been living in the same street since 1949, a year after it was dedicated as as street. An ABS rep visited my mother last year and had the street incorrectly listed as "avenue". That's when it gets really confusing. --AussieLegend (talk) 08:48, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

If it is called "One Mile" now, then they changed it. It was called "One Mile Beach" in the 1950's, 1960's and 1970's.Eregli bob (talk) 15:04, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Considering the map and expensive signs and the unlikelihood of the TW ending at Copes Creek I visited the Armidale Lands office regarding the terminus of this road and they said the shires handle the numbering of roadside properties etc. We actually own one on Thunderbolts Way and know that this is correct. The Lands Dept. does handle the sale, closures and transfers of old roads. Following on I contacted the Inverell shire and the Inverell tourist Centre and they have assured me that this road does indeed end in Goondiwindi, after it was extended several years ago. Checking the RTA map at [5] it seems clear that TW does at the very least pass to Inverell as route 73. Bearing in mind that roads often have multiple names on shared routes there would not seem to be any reason to doubt the info that I was given today.Cgoodwin (talk) 05:17, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

The cost of a sign in no way is an indicator of its credibility. See my comments about the expensive Port Stephens "Welcome to the Mid North Coast" sign above. I wouldn't consider a tourist information centre to be a reliable source. I have no doubt that the people there believe Thunderbolts Way extends that far. People believe that the Hexham bridges are in Hexham. Again see above. There have been proposals to rename sections of roads but I can't find a reliable source that confirms what the tourist information centre people believe. The RTA may produce a route map that shows route 73 extending to Inverell but it doesn't name that route at all so that's no good as a source. The most authoritative source we have is the Department of Lands and its data clearly shows that Thunderbolts Way doesn't exist north of Copes Creek, in its online information,[6] and in the topo maps generated from DoL data.[7][8] The maps clearly identify Thunderbolts Way periodically south of Copes Creek, but there's not a mention of it north of that point. This is far more credible information than any of the other sources that have been presented. --AussieLegend (talk) 09:41, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

The Geographical Names Board does not have any involvement regarding road names and their extent, this responsibility rests with the Roads and Traffic Authority for main roads or the local Council for other roads. The Roads and Traffic Authority have now confirmed that TW does indeed terminate at the Inverell intersection with the Gwydir Hwy.Cgoodwin (talk) 05:58, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

Nobody said anything about the GNB and roads. The example above was to show how the RTA doesn't always get things right. ie the RTA sign identifies the suburb incorrectly as One Mile Beach when the name of the suburb is actually One Mile, as shown in both DoL and GNB documentation. As for this edit, the source is clearly original research. --AussieLegend (talk) 06:19, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

Based on the edits today, I'll reiterate what I said earlier, the most authoritative source we have is the Department of Lands and its data clearly shows that Thunderbolts Way doesn't exist north of Copes Creek, in its online information,[9] and in the topo maps generated from DoL data.[10][11] The maps clearly identify Thunderbolts Way periodically south of Copes Creek, but there's not a mention of it north of that point. This is far more credible information than any of the other sources that have been presented, including the sources added today. Word of mouth information[12] constitutes original research. Hobby sites such as ozroads,[13] are self-published sources which are not reliable. They can't be used to disprove authoritative, reliable sources such as the DoL website or topographic maps. --07:18, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

70 kilometres shorter ?

70 kilometres shorter , between Newcastle and Brisbane, than what ?? Shorter than taking the New England highway via Murrurundi and Tamworth, maybe. Compared to the Pacific Highway, Thunderbolts Way is not shorter. Even if you switch to the New England Highway at Uralla, it is not shorter. And if you go to Bundarra or Boggabilla, forget about it.Eregli bob (talk) 15:03, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

I guess we'll never know what the ip who added this to the article when he/she created it in 2005 meant. More than 6 years later, most sources seem to mirror this article. --AussieLegend (talk) 15:41, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Cartoscope map of Thunderbolts Way

Unfortunately this map shows TW as running from the Pacific Hwy to Goondiwindi, therefore not an accurate ref for the text as is. Cheers! Downsize43 (talk) 11:11, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

Yes, you're quite correct. --AussieLegend (✉) 12:13, 14 November 2012 (UTC)