Talk:Tigrayans/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Sennaitgebremariam edit, removed Dawit II under Tigrayans, mutiple sources has him listed as Amhara, including his Dawit II father and his son as Amharas.

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Tigrayans&diff=762462900&oldid=761277230 now blocked Sennaitgebremariam added Dawit II back into notable Tigrayans in a shred way by just saying fix. If you don't agree with the removal let's discuss it here. 86.89.46.70 (talk) 03:07, 26 February 2017 (UTC)

Agree remove all non-RS-verified with ethnic linkthru in notable person's article.Bangutoker (talk) 00:38, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

Mulugheta Alula Roma edits, Ethiopian emperors of Amhara background removed, Djibouti source misleading

User: Mulugheta Alula Roma (now blocked) has added three emperors who are not of Tigrayan background into notable Tigrayans section. They are hereby removed, if you don't agree the removal, let discuss it here. 86.89.46.70 (talk) 02:50, 26 February 2017 (UTC)

User: Mulugheta Alula Roma made up a number of 600 for Tigrinyan speakers in Djibouti, except the source used was meant for the Amharic language source not Tigrinya. 86.89.46.70 (talk) 02:57, 26 February 2017 (UTC)

Agree if no ethnic-linkthru in notable person's article, then remove from this article until RS-verified in person's article.Bangutoker (talk) 00:45, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

Removing Sennaitgebremariam edit of Aksumite emperors in notable Tigrayans

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Tigrayans&diff=725921028&oldid=725816595 added by the now blocked Sennaitgebremariam

Sources used are: Sussle.org which is a visual encyclopedia and display the same information from wikipedia.

Jenkins, Dr. Orville Boyd. "Tigrinya People Profile". <a href="orvillejenkins.com" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> Is a profile of the Tigrayan people <a href="https://www.britishmuseum.org/pdf/KingdomOfAksum_StudentsWorksheets.pdf" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> a studentsworksheet

<a href="http://worldcoincatalog.com/AC/C/Aksum/300-310CE-Aphilas/300-310CE-Aphilas.htm" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> a coin catalog,

<a href="http://www.ikuska.com/Africa/Etnologia/Pueblos/tigrinya/index.htm" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> a spanish site, no mention of the individuals being Tigrayans.

<a href="http://www.st-gebriel.org/Styared/gab_yared_music.htm" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> No where does it mention Yared being Tigrayan,

<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tigrayans#cite_note-Antoine_d_1869.2C_p._3-45" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> This book goes over a different timeperiod, 1869 no mention of Aksumites, if so please provide inline citation.

<a href="https://books.google.nl/books?id=YTGRcVLMg6MC&pg=PA157&lpg=PA157&dq=Ouazebas+axum&source=bl&ots=qd0ji6e1Es&sig=jRzAKemdzj_pFW4v-dVhBWckEi4&hl=it&sa=X&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=Ouazebas%20axum&f=false" rel="nofollow">Link text</a> About coins, no relation between individuals and Tigrayans

In all of these sources, there is no mention of Aksumites being ethnic Tigrayans, and no mention of the individuals being Tigrayans. If there's any doubt about the removal lets discuss it here. 86.89.46.70 (talk) 04:45, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

Proposed merge of Tigrinyas with Tigrayans

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of this discussion was to merge of Tigrinyas with Tigrayans Turtlewong (talk) 03:33, 11 July 2018 (UTC)

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Two users who have been banned for sock-puppetry (Uknowofwiki & Soupforone) have invented an ethnic group called Tigrinyas. There is a zero mention of this ethnic group in academic books or research. Tigrinyas are Tigrayans who are living in Eritrea. The term Tigrinya was created by Eritrean nationalists after 1997 in order to distinguish themselves from their brothers and sisters during the Eritrean-Ethiopian border war. There is not a single mention of Tigrinyas in the Encyclopaedia Aethiopica which is the definitive academic reference on Eritrean and Ethiopian studies. This article should be merged into the larger and supported Tigrayans article. This debate has already happened on the talk page but the only users arguing for a Tigrinya article are Uknowofwiki and Soupforone. For those not familiar Tigrinya is the language of Tigrayans. It is complete nonsense to invent an ethnic group. In fact there is more homogenity between Tigrayans on either side of the border than within other ethnic groups in the world and Ethiopia in particular (e.g. Oromos). Turtlewong (talk) 16:06, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

I agree with this request. As an outsider (non-Tigrayan/Tigrinya) Horner I can tell you that most see them as one group. Their difference would be like claiming Somalilanders and Somalians are a separate ethnic group based on late 20th century politics. It's silly. They are the same people.Wadaad (talk) 13:31, 24 June 2018 (UTC)

• i agree with the merger. Khestwol (talk) 14:02, 24 June 2018 (UTC)

This article wasn't created by either of those editors. In April 2006 an earlier article was moved to this title[1] during a discussion here. I'll note that "Codex Sinaitcus" posting as ፈቃደ was a pov editor who was later blocked and then banned. User:Gyrofrog might have something to day about this. The others are no longer after. There are other relevant discussions on the same page - I see User:Amakuru took part in one. Then there was a properly formatted move request[2] to yet another name. It's discouraging to see how many of the names on that page turned out to be socks. At least this isn't as bad as the Zo/Zou/Zomi arguments! I'd certainly like to this this fixed as I was struggling with the distinction myself.

Note that the section heading says merge with Tigirnyas, but @Turtlewong: you've said merge with Tigrayans in your text. Doug Weller talk 10:43, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

I want to merge the smaller Tigrinyas article with the larger Tigrayans article. Can you help in formating this request better since you are more experienced Doug? I thought I did it right. Since this is the talk page of the Tigrayans article to which the Tigrinyas article will be merged to I thought that the header is correct. You are right that the Tigrayan article is old. The Tingrinya article is not and was argued for by the two users I mentioned above. This Tigrinya/Tigrayan stuff gets confusing because one of these is not a real ethnic group (Tigrinya). The main argument of the opposing side, which hasn't been made by anyone in this discussion, was that some urban Eritrean Tigrayans call themselves Kebessa which means highland in Tigrinya. However, this is confusing regional identification with ethnicity since Tigray is also a highland. In fact, Kebessa is used to distinguish from the lowland Eritreans living on the coast which are of different ethnicities. A good regional comparison would be the ethnic group Amharas which is composed of Gonderes, Gojjames, Wollo, Shewa, etc. If you ask a person in Gojjam who they are they would say Gojamme, but they are all part of the ethnicity Amhara. Compared to the diversity among Amharas, Tigrayans are actually very homogenous. The fact that the opposing side was composed entirely of socks (more than just Uknowofwiki & Soupforone. The deeper you go the more you find!) really should say everything about this argument. Like I wrote earlier the fact that Tigrinya as an ethnic group is nowhere to be found in Encyclopaedia Aethiopica (a huge multivolume encyclopaedia written by the foremost scholars on Ethiopia and Eritrea in the world) should be the final nail in the coffin of the Tigrinya article. If you go to either Ethiopia or Eritrea and ask about Tigrinya they will tell you it is a language not an ethnicity. Turtlewong (talk) 12:29, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

@Turtlewong: having tried various things, I decided the best thing was to add some explanatory text at the top of your introductory post. I think a merge would need to be accompanied with something in this article using reliable sources to explain the names. Doug Weller talk 13:09, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

I haven't been on Wikipedia as much so I didn't notice when the separate Tigrinyas article went up. The discussion that I recall participating in was what to name the single article about Ethiopians and Eritreans (and those abroad) who speak the Tigrinya language. Tigray-Tigrinya people was used as a compromise. Tigrinyas was set up as a redirect to this article and then @User:Nummies overwrote that with a new article, with "New page to describe group with individual cultural identities. For example, Andalusians or Aragonese of Spain and Copts of Egypt" as the edit summary (I don't see any further edits from Nummies after the day that edit took place, just over 2 years ago). I agree that the two should be merged but unfortunately I couldn't offer a better suggestion what to name it. I offer this purely anecdotally, but among Ethiopians I hear "Tigre" used as an exonym, but that instead suggests (to me) the Tigre language and its speakers. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 15:53, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

"Tigre" means Tigrayan in Amharic and is different than Tigre people. In Tigrinya, Tigrayans call themselves Tegaru. The problem with Tigray-Tigrinya people is that Tigrinya is not an ethnicity it is a language and Tigray is not an ethnicity it is a geographical area. This whole mixup is because of the English language's mode of naming ethnicities and languages as the same (e.g. A German speak German and lives in Germany). Curiously, in the Tigrinyas article there is no mention in any of the sources of Tigrinya being an ethnicity. There is a plethora of reputable references to support Tigrayans as being the name for the people on both sides of the border. Turtlewong (talk) 23:14, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Name of ethnic group should be changed

I agree with the merge of the Eritrean and Ethiopian pages. They are the same ethnicity separated by political and colonial boundaries, and the Eritrean "Tigrinya" or "Biher-Tigrinya" as a separate ethnicity is a recent invention.

But I think the name is not optimal. The name "Tigrayan", to Eritreans (regardless of whether they consider themselves similar to their Ethiopian brethren or not), is always associated with Ethiopian Tigrinya speakers (inhabitants of Tigray region). Also, as far as I can see, the name used in history books was usually "Tigre", the name also used to refer to Tigrinya speakers by Amhara, rather than Tigrayan.

For this reason, "Tigray-Tigrinya" was a decent compromise, but I can see why that was discarded as it is ahistorical. Tigre people or even Tigreans would be a better fit, but that risks confusion with the related but distinct Tigre people of the Eritrean lowlands. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Troopyl (talk • contribs) 10:02, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

Like I explained in the merger discussion Tigre is the Amharic exonym for Tigrayans. The Tigre ethnic group only resides in Eritrea and is addressed in a different article. So using the terms "Tigre people or even Tigreans" would not make sense. Furthermore, your assertion that Tigrayans "is always associated with Ethiopian Tigrinya speakers (inhabitants of Tigray region)" is false as there are many books, papers, encyclopedias, etc. cited in this very article that use Tigrayans to refer to Eritrean Tigrayans. All of your complaints were addressed in the merger discussion that was held for over a month. You seem to not understand one of the basic premises of Wikipedia per WP:OR. Saying that the "Name of ethnic group should be changed" is very wrong as the members of that ethnic group have called themselves Tigrayans that for hundreds if not thousands of years. Turtlewong (talk) 18:58, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

@Turtlewong: The claim was that it's what all modern-day Eritrean Tigrinya speakers associate "Tigrayans" with, not what was in the literature. Tigre/Tigré is the term I've seen used in historical accounts, e.g. by Europeans when discussing the northern Christian highlanders in "Abyssinia". I am aware it is also the Amharic exonym for Tigrinya speakers and not actually used by Tigrinya speakers themselves. I already acknowledged the problem of confusion with the distinct Eritrean Tigre from the lowlands. And thousands of years is a gross exaggeration even for the existence of this group as that bring us into Axumite or pre-Axumite times, but I digress. Troopyl (talk) 21:57, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

Nowhere in the article nor in the merger discussion was the claim made that "all modern-day Eritrean Tigrinya speakers associate "Tigrayans". However, as explained in the reputable, peer-reviewed, academic references cited in the article, Tigrayans indeed live on both sides of the colonial border. The fantasy that Eritrean Tigrayans are a different ethnicity than Ethiopian Tigrayans is a political product of the 1998-2000 border war. Due to WP:NPV and the plethora of reputable secondary sources that state the contrary to your claim it seems to be beyond a reasonable doubt that this misunderstanding has been resolved with the prior merger discussion. Thank you. Turtlewong (talk) 16:07, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Recent unmerge attempt and blocked IP

I discovered that the IP that undid the merge is an IP that was blocked for a month at for legal threats [3] with a recommendation that they be blocked indefinitely if they returned for this edit.[4] Whoever this is, the legal threat has not been withdrawn and the threat of violence is clearly unacceptable. I've blocked for a year, please let me know if an ip address with details starting with 2001:558:600a:83: returns. Doug Weller talk 10:24, 23 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for your work. It is highly likely, considering the timing and actions, that Editornoir is that very same blocked user. Perhaps Editornoir is using a VPN to get around the IP block. Turtlewong (talk) 00:59, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

You're correct. Doug Weller talk 17:58, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 4 September 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved  — Amakuru (talk) 07:49, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

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Tigrayans → Tigrinyas – The name of this article should be changed from Tigrayans to Tigrinyas as the official nomenclature for the ethnic group is Tigrinyas and not Tigrayans. The article confuses identity with nationality; the two terms are not interchangeable.

The term Tigrayans is strictly used to describe the inhabitants of the Tigray region in Ethiopia, regardless of their ethnic background, and does not include Tigrinyas in Eritrea and elsewhere.

Tigrinyas on the other hand is more neutral and correctly describes all the Tigrinya specking groups regardless of nationality. This change is crucial to avoid further requests to undo the recent merger. Divex 17:46, 4 September 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. bd2412 T 00:43, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose I have added more quality sources to the article which state that the ethnic group Tigrayans live in Ethiopia and Eritrea. For example:

There are more than four million Tigrayans in Ethiopia and nearly two million in Eritrea (Tigrayans are distinct from the Tigre people, most of whom live in Eritrea).
— David H. Shinn, Historical Dictionary of Ethiopia (2004)

Turtlewong (talk) 22:05, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Change this nonsense This is horrible scholarship. The man just decided to name an ethnic group without actual research. This needs to be changed to correctly reflect the actual Tigrigna (Tigrinya) ethnic group name. "Tigrayans" is a demonym for the Tigrigna (Tigrinya) speaking people from the region of Tigray, Ethiopia (Thus the Tigrayan). The Tigrinya speakers who live in Eritrea are NOT called Tigrayan. There is no such thing as a "Tigrayan" ethnic group. That is absolute nonsense. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ጽንዓት (talk • contribs) 01:42, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

• Against Italian colonization and silly lines on a map can't create a new ethnic group.Wadaad (talk) 18:20, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose basic research into scholastic articles state otherwise, and clearly, on the English language nomenclature. Devopam (talk) 12:11, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
• Comment. I have no opinion on the WP:RM. Depending on its result, however, the single-entry DAB page Tigrinya will need to be converted into either a proper DAB page or a redirect. Narky Blert (talk) 11:07, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Tigrayan is not an accurate ethnonym.

Tigrayan means from- or of Tigray, a specific region in Ethiopia. It is not an ethnonym. A native Tigrinya speaker in Eritrea is known as Biher-Tigrigna and Eritreans are therefore NOT Tigrayan. This is like saying Canadians are English. The entire premise of this article is culturally chauvinist, irredentist and above all inaccurate. All references to Eritrea and Eritreans has been removed. zeragito 15:15, 22 February 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zeragito (talk • contribs)

You can analyse it yourself all you want, but here on Wikipedia, we're forced to use what reliable sources say. Multiple refs that are cited in our article include Eritria and treat the topic of this article as an linguistic/ethnic not geopolitical/nationalistic one. Therefore, I have undone the removal of the Eritria content. DMacks (talk) 16:16, 22 February 2019 (UTC)

African

please change ((African)) to ((Africa))n

 Not done: Can you identify the exact sentence you're referring to? Highway 89 (talk) 19:18, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

Further Title Discussion

I would like to begin further conversation on the page title. I have not edited on Wikipedia in some years, however I was heavily involved before that time. That said, I want to understand the following comments in detail because they do not comport with both my understanding and my reading of some of the literature in the matter. I am of course no expert. 1) As previously noted Tigrinya is a language. Tigray is a region in Ethiopia. Tigrayan is the demonymn for a person who is from Tigray (it is coincidental, in part, that they all speak Tigrinya). 2) In Eritrea, Tigrinya speakers are officially referred to as Tigrinya or "Biher Tigrinya" not Tigrayan. Eritrean Tigrinya speakers are more likely to refer to their ethnic identity as i) Tigrinya, ii) Kebessawi (of the Eritrean highlands), or iii) "sub-Kebessa" identity (e.g., Akele Guzay, Seraye, etc.). My understanding of the work that refers to Tigrayans as including Eritrean Tigrinya speakers is that it includes very little research of actual Eritrean Tigrinya speakers. Finally, the references used to note that Eritrean and Ethiopian Tigrinya speakers are referred to as Tigrayan are books about Ethiopians - e.g., "Historical Dictionary of Ethiopia", "The Ethiopians", "Ethiopia: its people, its society, its culture". Some historical context would make clear why that is likely to bias the analysis.

Many sources include some version of: "A special note must be added concerning the spelling of Tigray, Tigre, Tigrayan, and Tigrinya. Throughout this volume Tigray will refer to the Ethiopian province and Tigrayan to its inhabitants ... Tigre will refer to lowland Eritreans who speak the Tigre language, and Tigrinya will refer to highland Eritreans who speak the Tigrinya language (also spoken by the Tigrayans of Ethiopia's Tigray province)." (Historical Dictionary of Eritrea: by Dan Connell, Tom Killion) Notice a similar discussion in "Mai Weini, a Highland Village in Eritrea: A Study of the People and their Livelihood ... Merhawie (talk) 20:47, 18 March 2019 (UTC)

Page needs cleanup and alignment of photos

There are too many photos for the amount of text, given the current format. I attempted to collect some of the photos into a gallery in the relevant sub headings but another editor immediately altered the content, re-instating many of the former issues. In any case, I don't have all that much interest in the topic, I was merely attempting to perform a visual clean up without content changes. The primary editors of this page should attempt to resolve these issues with photo alignment and aesthetics of the page. -Schlanger (talk) 18:09, 4 May 2020 (UTC)

Tigrayans and Tigrinya/Tigrigni

I was going through pending revisions and came upon this article, where there appears to be a long-standing edit conflict about the inclusion of Eritreans and the terminology used. Notably, I saw Leechjoel9's argument that this article already exists for that purpose. Now, it seemed a bit strange to me that this leads to the conclusion that there are 0 "Tigrayans" living in Eritrea because that would automatically make them "Tigrinyas", but regardless of what I think, these two move discussions above seem to have held the consensus that the articles should be united under the title "Tigrayans". Of course, consensus can change, but simply recreating the previously merged "Tigrinyas" article under the name "Tigrigni" and selectively removing mentions of Eritrea and Eritreans from this article is probably not the best way to go about this, especially since much of the article still discusses Eritrean things. Prinsgezinde (talk) 14:12, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

cc @DMacks, Prinsgezinde, Midre bahri, Leechjoel9, Bjorn2006, Jscherer42, Unixandthings, 4thfile4thrank, The Supermind, and Adkemetegeleba:

I agree with you Prinsgezinde. I am also a pending changes reviewer, and I am also concerned that this article had the Tigrinyas (members of this ethnicity that live in Eritrea rather than Ethiopia) deleted without any talk page discussion.

I spent about an hour researching this just now, and I do believe there is a decent argument to be made that Tigrinyas are their own ethnicity. The CIA World Factbook recognizes them as an ethnicity.[5][6]

But, as of right now, the Tigrinya ethnicity is completely deleted on Wikipedia. They have no article, and Leechjoel9 deleted them from this article. Leechjoel9 says they have their own article at Tigrinya, but this is not correct, it just redirects to Tigrinya language, which I believe both Tigrayans and Tigrinyas speak. Actually, they do have an article at Tigrigni (different spelling).

I would be in favor of restoring the article to this version that includes Tigrinyas, and THEN discussing (in a different talk page section) how we want to handle fixing this.

I will make another section to discuss how we want to handle below. But for now, is there a consensus to restore the article to the version linked above that includes Tigrinyas? Please reply support, oppose, etc. Thank you. –Novem Linguae (talk) 09:54, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Support. Members of this ethnicity from Eritrea (Tigrinyas) have been completely deleted from Wikipedia. (Found their article at Tigrigni) We should restore this article to the version that includes them, THEN discuss how we want to fix in a new section below. –Novem Linguae (talk) 09:54, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Not supporting The article tigrigni should not be merged with this since Tigrinyas of Eritrea are not Tigrayans, and Tigrayans are not Tigrinyas of Eritrea. At some point in history (15century) they did share some history, so that can be mentioned in the history of this article. But they are considered two seperate ethnic groups with two seperate identeties. Leechjoel9 (talk) 00:58, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Student

Tigrayans are Eritrean ethnic group also but many people change in Wikipedia. Eritrean and Ethiopian Tigrayans are have same language and same tradition.There is a lot of proof. If you don't agree, you can ask the people of Tigray. I'll finish you there. Midre bahri (talk) 19:50, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Emergency Proposition to Change Name of The Article To Prevent Further Vandalism and Confusion

Change name from "Tigrayans" to "Tegaru-Tigrinya" .
The "Tigrigni" article is just a content fork.

The name of this article should be changed from "Tigrayans" (an uncommon exonym that causes confusion making it seem like it only applies to Tigrinya-speakers from modern day Tigray Region,Ethiopia only, to more accurate name "Tegaru-Tigrinya" which combines the two major endonyms used by the ethnic group. The ethnic group has several other endonyms in use some other than legally codified ones (Tegaru is the legal name of the ethnic group in Ethiopia, Tigrinya is the legal name for the same ethnic group in Eritrea) while others are informal and used in sperate contexts, Kebessa is another endonym for the ethnic group but is specifically used for the Tegaru-Tigrinya sub-branch in Eritrea, and in other parts of Ethiopia and Eritrea people who are by law defined as Tegaru and Tigrinya respectively also use other non-codified endonyms generally based on the region they come from or which sub-group of the Tegaru-Tigrinya people they come from.

The name of the page should be changed to "Tegaru-Tigrinya" from the current name "Tigrayans" which causes controversy, confusion, and content forks like the "Tigrigni" article that should be merged to this one. SelamSelam246 (talk) 16:23, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

SelamSelam246. Thanks for your feedback. Do you have a reputable source (newspaper, book, etc.) to support this new name?

One source I've found is the CIA World Factbook, which lists Tigrays and Tigrinyas as separate ethnicities. But if somebody can provide a better source, I think we would all be interested in taking a look. –Novem Linguae (talk) 16:50, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Tigrinyas (known as Biher-Tigrinya) of Eritrea are a different ethnic group than the Tigrayans of Ethiopia. They do not identify as being the same ethnic group, language alone is neither constitutive of culture nor of ethnic identity. The CIA is a good source and there are other academic articles, literature and sources on the subject that confirms that they have been seperate ethnic groups for over 600 years. There are strong arguments to why we should keep the ethnic groups separated on Wikipedia, and use the legal names of the ethnicities, Novem_Linguae. See sources below:

1)CIA - Per above

2)Encyclopedia (academic sources) - On the Tigrinyas of Eritrea [7]

3)Academic paper on Eritrea-[8]

4)Literature-Book on the empiers of Ethiopia & Eritrea- Qoute: ″ Even in those distant times, however, it is clear that the land and people of highland Eritrea were distinct from people of Tigray, even though they spoke the same language-just as the Austrians, Swiss Germans and the Germans of today are very different people (1998, Roy Pateman, P.33).” [9]

5)Literature-History of Portugise influnce during abyssynia. Historian Roy Pateman suggests that Biher-Tigrinya people of Medri-Bahri were “distinct” from people of Tigray-Qoute: ″ The men (of Medri-Bahri) wear different costumes; so also the women who are married or living with men. Here (Tigray), they wear wrapped round them dark coloured woolen stuffs, with large fringes of the same stuff, and they do not wear diadems on their heads like those of the Barnagasi (Midri-Bahri people)". -(1970, Francisco Alvarez, P. 91-2)″ Qoute 2:″ A Portuguese map of 1660 shows Medri Bahri as covering most of the three highland provinces of Eritrea and distinct from Ethiopia. (1998, Roy Pateman, p. 36)″ [10]

6)Literature-History of Abyssinia by James Bruce. In 1770, the Scottish researcher James Bruce even gives the boundary of Tigray, which does not include the Biher-Tigrinya (Kebessa) people. According to Bruce, Tigray’s border with Medri Bahri (or BahrNegash) was indeed the Mereb river. Qoute:″ The greatest length of Tigre (Tigray) is two hundred miles, and the greatest breadth one hundred and twenty. It lies between the territory of the BaharNagash (which reaches to the river Mareb) on the east, and the river Tacazze on the west." (1860, James Bruce, p.83)″[11]

7) Literature- More on James Bruce in Abyssinia- James Bruce also reported Medri Bahri and Abyssinia were two “distinctly separate political entities who were constantly at war with each other. This shows us without a doubt that the Bhier-Tigrinya people of Medri-Bahri had a different political process from Tigray and Abyssinia all together. Qoute 2: In 1770 the Scottish traveler James Bruce also reported that Medri-Bahri and Abyssinia were two distinctly separate political entities constantly at war with each other." (1991, Okbazghi Yohannes, P. 31 [12]

8) Literature- Book Abyssina by John Miles. In 1838, the traveler John R Miles describes the Mereb river as being the border between Tigray and the Kingdom of Medri-Bahri. Qoute: ″the Mareb, which forms the boundary between Tigre (sic, Tigray) and the Kingdom of Baharnagash.” (1846, John R. Miles, P. 131)″ [13].

9) Literature-Another book of the history on Abyssinia. Ploweden, the 19th century contemporary British observer, also stated in the 1870s that Tigrayans did not regard the Tigrinya people as being the same as them.″ The people of Hamazain and Serowee, since the time of Ras Michael, though speaking the same language, are still scarcely (hardly) considered by the people of Teegray as a portion of that country whose governors, since that period, have made war on them….” (1868, Walter Chichele Plowden, P. 39)″ [14]

10) Academic article - On Eritrea prior to the Italian Eritrea colony. According to professor Richard M. Trivelli, 'separate' ethnic identities were already there between the Biher-Tigrinya and Tigray people long before the Italians entered the region. Qoute:″ Separate regional identities began to emerge in the 18th century, a development accentuated by the establishment of colonial borders and the social and economic differentiation under Italian rule. Social differences between the populations of both areas were concurrent with the development of negative stereotypes about the respective other group. (1998, Richard M. Trivelli, p. 257-8)″[15]Leechjoel9 (talk) 23:00, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

11) The government of Eritrea also describes it's largest ethnic group as Tigrinya or Biher-Tigrinya and not as Tigrayans. [16].Leechjoel9 (talk) 23:34, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

That's pretty convincing. Thanks for typing all that.

Also, I went ahead and added a hatnote to the Tigrinya language article that says ""Tigrinya" redirects here. For the ethnicity based in Eritrea, see Tigrigni." –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:42, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

Why does someone change, Tigrayans are haven't in Eritrea?

Tigrayans are Eritrean ethnic group also but many people change in Wikipedia. Eritrean and Ethiopian Tigrayans are have same language and same tradition.There is a lot of proof. If you don't agree, you can ask the people of Tigray. I'll finish you there. Midre bahri (talk) 19:59, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

@Midre bahri and Leechjoel9:, The CIA World Factbook mentions Tigrinyas as their own ethnicity [17][18]. And also Tigrinyas currently have their own article at Tigrigni.

Does anybody have additional sources besides CIA factbook? What do they say?

If CIA factbook ends up being our best source, I would be in favor of saying the Tigrayans are different than Tigrinyas. But I am open to additional opinions. –Novem Linguae (talk) 02:47, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

The CIA World Factbook itself reports that Eritrean and Tigrinya speakers are one. Midre bahri (talk) 11:55, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

Are Tigrinyas their own ethnicity? How should we fix this article?

I spent a lot of time researching this today. Here is a summary of what I've found. Correct me if I'm wrong.

• Tigrayans (Tigray People)
  • live in northern Ethiopia
  • speak Tigrinya language
• Tigrinyas (Tigrinya People)
  • live in Eritrea
  • speak Tigrinya language
• Tigreans (Tigre People)
  • live in Eritrea and Sudan
  • speak Tigre language
  • I mention them because they have a similar sounding name

Currently, Tigrinyas do not have their own article. Tigrinya redirects to Tigrinya language. Tigrinya article discovered at alternative spelling Tigrigni.

The CIA World Factbook mentions Tigrinyas as their own ethnicity [19][20], so I think there is a strong case to make that we need to at least mention this somewhere in Wikipedia.

Further reading: [21][22]

Here are some ideas for fixing this. We may want to do multiple.

• Create an article at Tigrinya, and begin splitting them out of this article.
• Add a section to this article called Tigrinya, and explain the difference. Also mention it in the lead paragraph.
• Redirect Tigrinya to Tigrigni
• Move Tigrigni to Tigrinya
• Rename this article to Tigray-Tigrinya people
• Other ideas?

Thanks for your time. –Novem Linguae (talk) 10:01, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Comment: The somewhat hard to find article Tigrigni was created several months ago from the ashes of the previously merged "Tigrinya" article, and seems to cover the same subject as the previous one. That article is probably of concern here. Prinsgezinde (talk) 10:31, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Great find. I've updated my comments accordingly. –Novem Linguae (talk) 10:45, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Lets elaborate the answer for Novem Linguae:

Tigre people indigenous to Eritrea and north Sudan

Tigrayans are synonymous to Tigre people, they originally inhabit in Ethiopia (the northern part), although some Tigrayans live to Eritrea.

Tigrinya is the language spoken by both people.

I think the term Tigre encompasses the Tigrayans (descendant) and large amount. The Supermind (talk) 14:35, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Tigrinya people (Also known as Biher-Tigrinya people) are indigenous to Eritrea. To merge the articles would be misleading since they are considered two seperate ethnic groups with two different identities. The Tigrigni article should be renamed to Tigrigni people, Tigrinya people or Biher-Tigrinya people. Leechjoel9 (talk) 01:19, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

This Articles are very confusing for someone out of any of this Ethnic groups and political matter make the issue worse. I am Eritrean from the Tigrinya Ethnic side:

1, Tigrinya or Tigrigna is a language in both Eritrea and Ethiopia. The Tigrinya speakers in Eritrea are called by the language they speak as Tigrinya/Tigrigna or historically Tigrigni. The correct way of writing of the language Tigrinya is Tigrina but English speakers called it as Tigrinya and Italian colonizers in Eritrea called it Tigrigna. 2, Tigre people or shortly Tigre are Muslim Eritreans who spoke the Tigre language. 2, Tigray is name of a place/ a province in Ethiopia and people living at this place have Three names i,e Tegaru in Tigrinya , Tgree in Amharic(wrongly) and Tigrayans in English.

N.B1There are some informations that all three of the Ethnic groups Tigre,Tigrinya/Tigrigni and Tegaru/Tigrayans was one Ethnic untill the 7th century and diverted from then. N.B2, There are individuals whom thier work is mixing this Ethnic groups for political agenda. And The Tigrinya Ethnic group in Eritrea never had any connection with the name Tigray so as to the Tigrayan Ethnic group and as i am from the Tigrinya ethnic group i am telling you personally that I am Tigrinya/Tigrigni not Tigrayan. N.B3 there was a political agenda to create a country by merging the Tigrinya land with that of Tigray land and the name of this political map was Tigray-Tigrigni(Tigray and Tigrigni/Tigrinya/Bihere-Tigrinya) and this also simply implied Tigrayan and Tigrinya's are diferent.

Thank you. Adkemetegeleba (talk) 23:25, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

Tigrayans are one ethnic groups found in two different countries with two different endonyms

• Tigrayans are also found in Eritrea - not only in Ethiopia. The people group that Anglophones call "Tigrayan" are an ethnic group that has two endonyms. Tigrayans in Ethiopia refer to the ethnic group in both countries as Tegaru, while Tigrayans in Eritrea refer to the whole ethnic group as Tigrinya. The Tigrayan is just the English name for the Tegaru-Tigrinya ethnic group.
• The page named Tigrigni is just a page someone created to push an agenda that claims that they are two different ethnic groups with seperate histories when they are actually one ethnic groups. The reason why there is a difference in endonyms is that most Horn African ethnic groups started to look at themselves as solid ethnic groups only recently. Ethnicity used to be fluid in that the cultural practices of bordering ethnic groups bled into each other in that that people from the same region but of different ethnic groups identified with each other more than they did with other people of other regions in what would later legally become their ethnic groups. So, new names for ethnic groups were invented by the time of Eritrean independence, the people that would become Tigrayans in Ethiopia took the name Tegaru while Tigrayans in Eritrea took the name Tigrinya (or used the phrase "Tigrinya-speaker") which is namesake taken form the Tigrinya language spoken by the people who would later become known as Tigrayans or Tegaru/Tigrinya. The Tigrinya language existed prior to the advent of Tigrayan (Tegaru/Tigrinya) ethnic identity (other ethnic groups in the Horn of Africa especially the ones in Ethiopian went through something like this). They are the same ethnic group but the population split among the two countries had different names codified in the laws of their specific countries.
• Recommendations: Merge the Tigrigni page into Tigrayans page. Then either keep the name "Tigrayans" for this page (its a neutral English exonym, its better than choosing one of the endonyms but still may cause more controversies as seen throughout this talk page and article because of its direct etymological decent form the term "Tigray" from Tigray Province/Tigray Region in Ethiopia making it seem like its only about Ethiopian Tigrayans), or the article's title can be changed to "Tegaru-Tigrinya" hyphenating the two endonyms used by the ethnic group which will limit confusion that may cause people to thing its excluding Eritrean Tigrayans. What ever you do do not confuse the Tegaru-Tigrinya people with the Tigre people who are a separate ethnic group from the Tegaru-Tigrinya people. Tigre people are only found in Eritrea, have similar names, they speak a different language, and many people (even Horn Africans) get them mixed up with the Tegaru-Tigrinya people.

2601:14D:8581:2C70:80E1:E741:375D:4A88 (talk) 00:54, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

1, Tigrinya or Tigrigna is a language in both Eritrea and Ethiopia. The Tigrinya speakers in Eritrea are called by the language they speak as Tigrinya/Tigrigna or historically Tigrigni And locally Bihere-Tigrinya. Though not known well The correct way of writing of the language Tigrinya is Tigrina but English speakers called it as Tigrinya and Italian colonizers in Eritrea called it Tigrigna. 2, Tigre people or shortly Tigre are Muslim Eritreans who spoke the Tigre language. 3, Tigray is name of a place/ a province in Ethiopia and people living at this place have Three names i,e Tegaru in Tigrinya , Tgree in Amharic(wrongly) and Tigrayans in English.

N.B1There are some informations that all three of the Ethnic groups Tigre,Tigrinya/Tigrigni and Tegaru/Tigrayans was one Ethnic untill the 7th century and diverted from then. N.B2, There are individuals whom thier work is mixing this Ethnic groups for political agenda. And The Tigrinya Ethnic group in Eritrea never had any connection with the name Tigray so as to the Tigrayan Ethnic group and as i am from the Tigrinya ethnic group i am telling you personally that I am Tigrinya/Tigrigni not Tigrayan. N.B3 there was a political agenda to create a country by merging the Tigrinya land with that of Tigray land and the name of this political map was Tigray-Tigrigni(Tigray and Tigrigni/Tigrinya/Bihere-Tigrinya) and this also simply implied Tigrayan and Tigrinya's are diferent. Adkemetegeleba (talk) 23:35, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

Tigrinya merger with Tigrayans

This article should be split. People from Eritrea simply do not identify as Tigrayan. Putting all Tigrinya speakers (in both Eritrea and Ethiopia) under the same name and flag as the province of Tigray is highly misleading. Mesfin (talk) 20:14, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Political split between the two countries doesn't necessarily mean that the Tigrayans living there are different ethnically. Flag of the Ethiopian province removed; it was wrong because many Tigrayans are from Eritrea. Khestwol (talk) 07:48, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

Agree They are ethnically the same but not politically the same people as agreed upon the month long merger discussion and the many cited sources. It was inappropriate to have the Tigray region flag. Turtlewong (talk) 17:05, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

"Tigrayan,"" Tigrean," and "Tegaru" are not used except exclusively as a label for people from Tigray; Tigrinya speakers in Eritrea are simply called "Tigrinya." Feel free to verify this via google, and from citations from the Eritrean government [23], [24]. Putting all Tigrinya speakers (in both Eritrea and Ethiopia) under the same "Tigrayan banner" is HIGHLY controversial and factually misleading (this simply isn't a reflection of reality). Ignoring the longstanding and prominent Eritrea/Tigray differentiation (of Tigrinya speakers) is not merely offensive, but it's also politically suspect; this article reflects a controversial AGAZIAN political agenda. It should be split or drastically overhauled. Mesfin (talk) 17:07, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

Unfortunately, your source is a blog of the Eritrean Ministry of Information which (due the political reasons which I am certain that you are well aware of) has a clear political bias against admitting the reality that there are indeed ethnicities which live on both sides of the colonial border. Pursuing the creation of a new ethnicity on Wikipedia falls under WP:OR. Nowhere in the article nor in the merger discussion was the claim made that "all Tigrinya speakers (in both Eritrea and Ethiopia)" are Tigrayans. However, as explained in the reputable, peer-reviewed, academic references cited in the article, Tigrayans indeed live on both sides of the colonial border. The fantasy that Eritrean Tigrayans are a different ethnicity than Ethiopian Tigrayans is a political product of the 1998-2000 border war. Due to WP:NPV and the plethora of reputable secondary sources that state the contrary to your claim it seems to be beyond a reasonable doubt that this misunderstanding has been resolved with the prior merger discussion. Thank you. Turtlewong (talk) 03:47, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

Tigrinya is a language not an ethnicity, yes I'm aware Eritreans use Tigrinya like a tribe but thats just shows the failed effort to distinct ourselves. Countries are manmade ethnicity is not, country boarders don't define tribes. They are one tribe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Weldanse (talk • contribs) 11:41, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Countries are manmade ethnicity is not, country boarders do not define tribes. Tigrinya is not a tribe it is a language. Tigrayans is the ethnicity to all those who speak Tigrinya as a mothers tongue, like those who speak Amharic are called Amhara. However to distinct ourselves, us Eritreans call ourselves biher-tigrinya which literally means "nation of Tigrinya speakers", and the Ethiopian Tigrinyas are called Tigrayans. The term Biher Tigrinya can easily apply to the Ethiopian Tigrays but for distinction purposes only it is referred to as the Eritrean Tigrinyas. This need to distinct ourselves is mainly a political ideology, that mainly stems from the 1998-2000 war between the two groups. Both groups however are one tribe, many can argue that there are slight differences, but that also goes for people within the Tigray land, for example the way agames dance is different to tenben and same goes to Akkelle guzay and Hamasien in Eritrea. Our clothes, food, music, language is all similiar. Even within Oromo itself there are different traditional clothes but yet they are called one tribe, same goes for Gondar and Gojam, there both called Amhara. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Weldanse (talk • contribs) 11:45, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Against, Eritrean Tigrayans are simple that: Tigrayans under a different political jurisdiction, not a separate ethnic group. Wadaad (talk) 16:30, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Should not Merged, wikipedias mandate is to write things as it is not to merge different things.

Close Tigrayans are one ethnic groups found in two different countries with two different endonyms Tigrayans are also found in Eritrea - not only in Ethiopia. The people group that Anglophones call "Tigrayan" are an ethnic group that has two endonyms. Tigrayans in Ethiopia refer to the ethnic group in both countries as Tegaru, while Tigrayans in Eritrea refer to the whole ethnic group as Tigrinya. The Tigrayan is just the English name for the Tegaru-Tigrinya ethnic group. The page named Tigrigni is just a page someone created to push an agenda that claims that they are two different ethnic groups with seperate histories when they are actually one ethnic groups. The reason why there is a difference in endonyms is that most Horn African ethnic groups started to look at themselves as solid ethnic groups only recently. Ethnicity used to be fluid in that the cultural practices of bordering ethnic groups bled into each other in that that people from the same region but of different ethnic groups identified with each other more than they did with other people of other regions in what would later legally become their ethnic groups. So, new names for ethnic groups were invented by the time of Eritrean independence, the people that would become Tigrayans in Ethiopia took the name Tegaru while Tigrayans in Eritrea took the name Tigrinya (or used the phrase "Tigrinya-speaker") which is namesake taken form the Tigrinya language spoken by the people who would later become known as Tigrayans or Tegaru/Tigrinya. The Tigrinya language existed prior to the advent of Tigrayan (Tegaru/Tigrinya) ethnic identity (other ethnic groups in the Horn of Africa especially the ones in Ethiopian went through something like this). They are the same ethnic group but the population split among the two countries had different names codified in the laws of their specific countries. Recommendations: Merge the Tigrigni page into Tigrayans page. Then either keep the name "Tigrayans" for this page (its a neutral English exonym, its better than choosing one of the endonyms but still may cause more controversies as seen throughout this talk page and article because of its direct etymological decent form the term "Tigray" from Tigray Province/Tigray Region in Ethiopia making it seem like its only about Ethiopian Tigrayans), or the article's title can be changed to "Tegaru-Tigrinya" hyphenating the two endonyms used by the ethnic group which will limit confusion that may cause people to thing its excluding Eritrean Tigrayans. What ever you do do not confuse the Tegaru-Tigrinya people with the Tigre people who are a separate ethnic group from the Tegaru-Tigrinya people. Tigre people are only found in Eritrea, have similar names, they speak a different language, and many people (even Horn Africans) get them mixed up with the Tegaru-Tigrinya people.

2601:14D:8581:2C70:80E1:E741:375D:4A88 (talk) 00:54, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

1, Tigrinya or Tigrigna is a language in both Eritrea and Ethiopia. The Tigrinya speakers in Eritrea are called by the language they speak as Tigrinya/Tigrigna or historically Tigrigni And locally Bihere-Tigrinya. Though not known well The correct way of writing of the language Tigrinya is Tigrina but English speakers called it as Tigrinya and Italian colonizers in Eritrea called it Tigrigna. 2, Tigre people or shortly Tigre are Muslim Eritreans who spoke the Tigre language. 3, Tigray is name of a place/ a province in Ethiopia and people living at this place have Three names i,e Tegaru in Tigrinya , Tgree in Amharic(wrongly) and Tigrayans in English.

N.B1There are some informations that all three of the Ethnic groups Tigre,Tigrinya/Tigrigni and Tegaru/Tigrayans was one Ethnic untill the 7th century and diverted from then. N.B2, There are individuals whom thier work is mixing this Ethnic groups for political agenda. And The Tigrinya Ethnic group in Eritrea never had any connection with the name Tigray so as to the Tigrayan Ethnic group and as i am from the Tigrinya ethnic group i am telling you personally that I am Tigrinya/Tigrigni not Tigrayan. N.B3 there was a political agenda to create a country by merging the Tigrinya land with that of Tigray land and the name of this political map was Tigray-Tigrigni(Tigray and Tigrigni/Tigrinya/Bihere-Tigrinya) and this also simply implied Tigrayan and Tigrinya's are diferent Adkemetegeleba (talk) 23:39, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

Should not Merged, wikipedias mandate is to write things as it is not to merge different things.

1, Tigrinya or Tigrigna is a language in both Eritrea and Ethiopia. The Tigrinya speakers in Eritrea are called by the language they speak as Tigrinya/Tigrigna or historically Tigrigni And locally Bihere-Tigrinya. Though not known well The correct way of writing of the language Tigrinya is Tigrina but English speakers called it as Tigrinya and Italian colonizers in Eritrea called it Tigrigna. 2, Tigre people or shortly Tigre are Muslim Eritreans who spoke the Tigre language. 3, Tigray is name of a place/ a province in Ethiopia and people living at this place have Three names i,e Tegaru in Tigrinya , Tgree in Amharic(wrongly) and Tigrayans in English.

N.B1There are some informations that all three of the Ethnic groups Tigre,Tigrinya/Tigrigni and Tegaru/Tigrayans was one Ethnic untill the 7th century and diverted from then. N.B2, There are individuals whom thier work is mixing this Ethnic groups for political agenda. And The Tigrinya Ethnic group in Eritrea never had any connection with the name Tigray so as to the Tigrayan Ethnic group and as i am from the Tigrinya ethnic group i am telling you personally that I am Tigrinya/Tigrigni not Tigrayan. N.B3 there was a political agenda to create a country by merging the Tigrinya land with that of Tigray land and the name of this political map was Tigray-Tigrigni(Tigray and Tigrigni/Tigrinya/Bihere-Tigrinya) and this also simply implied Tigrayan and Tigrinya's are diferent Adkemetegeleba (talk) 23:42, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

Pending changes

Hi, going through the pending changes backlog I noticed that there is a revision thats 28 hours old. Could someone who knows what they are talking about (i. e. not me) accept or revert it? thanks (not watching, please ping)  Darth Flappy ^«Talk» 18:05, 26 December 2020 (UTC)

DarthFlappy, in the future, you can probably just approve any pending changes to this page. PC reviewers are only supposed to check for vandalism, copyvio, and BLP. In my opinion, figuring out who is right in a complex edit war is outside of our mandate. –Novem Linguae (talk) 06:24, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Idea for adding notable Tigrayans

Hi , first of all this is just an idea, so please be nice. Nevertheless, a lot of Tigrayans rather have a strong tie to their region rather to their ethnicity (regionalism), hence would it be fine to change the section "notable tigrayans" to "notable tigrayans and people from this region"? Besides that, can we also add notable persons, whose only a part of their ancestory were from tigray and therefore have a tigrayan background? . — Preceding unsigned comment added by Loveandpeacemaker (talk • contribs) 11:51, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

Protected edit request on 25 February 2021

Greetings and felicitations. At the top of the article, per MOS:SECTIONORDER, please move the {{pp|small=yes}} to below the "short description" and the hatnote(s), and immediately above the infobox.

Also, I recommend combining the two "Template:Distinguish" hatnotes into one:

Not to be confused with Tigre people or Tigrinya people.

I.e.: {{Distinguish|Tigre people|Tigrinya people}}. —DocWatson42 (talk) 13:55, 25 February 2021 (UTC) DocWatson42 (talk) 13:55, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

 Done, thanks. — The Earwig (talk) 06:57, 27 February 2021 (UTC)

Let's change this article to Tigray and Tigrinya people.

We, the Eritrean Tigrayans and the Ethiopian Tigrayayans, are the same ethnic groups, but any person can't find a difference between us, but a lot of people try to separate us, but we are a same people in two countries. If we change this article to (Tigray and Tigrinya people) it would be good and better. If we change it, it is also fair; it is respect for these tribe. Thanks. Midre bahri (talk) 10:52, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Souk bel ants sahsah Agame wedishrmuuta woyane! Shilho nay Fano wahato Gohaf Agame! Hasawti resah aliet mis Biher Tigrinya ket hiwosena! Agame komakuum hasawti ekhoum! Keed wedikelbi shrmuuta agame!~ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Clownshking (talk • contribs) 18:09, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

'Biher-Tigrinya' redirecting to this page is wrong.

The hyperlink for Biher-Tigrinya erroneously redirects to this page, but the Tigrinya speakers in Eritrea (the Biher-Tigrinya) do not identify as Tigrayans. A Tigrayan is a person from Tigray, not from Eritrea. zeragito 16:43, 4 March 2021 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zeragito (talk • contribs)

Proof about Eritrean Tigrayans!

I have brought one assurance about the people of Tigray in Eritrea. These people in Eritrea, known as highlands or ethnic Tigrinya, are the same people as Tigrayans. The people are the total people who come out of the clan people. Here is a source https://www.britannica.com/topic/Tigray-central-Eritrean-people/ about those people. I myself am a Eritrean Tigrinya or Tigrayan man, but no one really responds attentively. And in this Tigray text, no one is able to negotiate. This is not fair. Midre bahri (talk) 22:39, 13 March 2021 (UTC)

Notable tigrayans to province

Can we convert these tigrayans named under notable "tigrayans" to the page "Tigray Province" due to my intention that it would be more correct historically? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Myl1ttleswetts (talk • contribs) 09:41, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Tigrinya/Tigrigni and Tigrayans

The Tigrinya/Tigrigna language speakers in Eritrea never consider themselves as Tigrayans and they are called Tigrinya/Tigrigna or historically Tigrigni and calling this people Tigrayans might make them angry. Tigray is name of a place in North Ethiopia and The people inhibiting the place are called Tegaru locally and Tigrayans (Tigray'ans) in English. But there are individuals including wikipedians who are mixing the two articles for political matter. Adkemetegeleba (talk) 22:43, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

The Tigrinya we have in Eritrea are one ethnic group with Tigray. This is a fact. I am a Eritrean Tigrayan or Tigrinya person, but most Tigrinya people in Eritrea who have praised my Tigray as its own ethnicity are not all. Most of Eritrea 's people are governed by a dictatorship, so no one can know the truth. Midre bahri (talk) 06:31, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

About Eritrean Tigrayans and Ethiopian Tigrayans(Tigray )

Hello ! We need to discuss the Eritrean Tigrayans. The Eritrean and Ethiopian Tigreans are one tribe because they have one language, one culture, one religion, one identity. They different only in country and citizens . The CIA reported on its website (Tigrinya). Midre bahri (talk) 10:46, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

These two peoples do not share the same identity, this is plainly untrue. Tigrayans don't view the Eritrean Tigrinya-speaking population as Tigrayans nor does the Eritrean Tigrinya people view itself as such. Tigrayans refer to the Tigrinya-speakers in the Tigray region - hence the term "Tigrayan". There is reliable evidence, including oral tradition, pointing to seperate identities for at least hundreds of years. If Austrians can be considered a seperate ethnic group from Germans and have their own Wikipage, there is absolutely no reason for the Tigrinya people in Eritrea to not have their own as well. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.73.47.101 (talk) 00:08, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

It's not fair to divide one ethnic groups or one people into two pages. I'm from the Eritrean Tigrayan. How can you say to us that you don't belong to us? This separation of these two peoples that you are doing is assuming that you are fighting for us and committing crimes against the same people.History, culture, language, are one, but those of us in Eritrea are separated from our Tigray because we are subjected to Italy's rule, and this is where the cause of the separation begins. Therefore, please don't try to separate us, our real name is Tigrayans. There was no ruler or power that separated Germany and Austria. But we Eritrean Tigrayans and the Tigrayans of Tigray are divided by another foreign ruler. So this issue has nothing to do with Germany and Austria. Midre bahri (talk) 21:08, 24 July 2021 (UTC)