Talk:Tony Gwynn/Archive 1

Archive 1

Ted Williams?

This article about Gwynn or Ted Williams? Maybe retitle the whole thing "Ted Williams and his continuing achievements (through Tony Gwynn)"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 116.228.6.74 (talk) 13:16, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

Incosistencies

This article has a few minor inconsistencies. For example, the introduction says that Gwynn never played any position other than right field until interleague play, but in the body of the article it says he split time between right and center in 1989. Also, the intro says he won two gold gloves, while the body text says he won five consecutive gold gloves between 1986 and 1991. I will try to fact check some of this. Motorneuron 19:45, 5 April 2006 (UTC)motorneuron

Illogical

The following passage is illogical: Had the season not been shortened by a strike, Gwynn might have become the first batter to eclipse the magical .400 mark in more than 50 years. In the end, he fell 3 hits short of the .400 mark in the shortened season. Because batting average is an *average*, it is not affected by strike-shortened seasons. Thus, it makes no sense to say "he fell 3 hits short of the .400 mark" while stressing the fact that the season was strike-shortened. maybe he was close, and a few more games and a few more hits, his average would've gone up? is that logical?

To a baseball person, a shortened or lengthened season is very important.

Roger Maris' home record had an asterisk next to it in the record books, for example.

He took longer to reach his record than Babe Ruth did.

A no-hitter in 7 innings, the length of double header games in 2020, means less to a baseball person than one of a full 9 innings. Stormplatter (talk) 18:41, 30 April 2022 (UTC)

Hall of Fame

Are you a member of the Hall upon being voted in or upon being inducted in the summer? Should he and Ripken be designated as Hall of Fame members now, or should the designation be reserved for after they're inducted? The President isn't the President after being voted in in November but after his inaugaration. Same thing? Does the Hall refer to them as "members"? Just a thought. Kinston eagle 01:18, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I had the same question, as well. I'll wait to see what everybody else thinks. Anyway, congratulations to Gwynn on making the HOF. The game needs more superstars like him.The Invisible Man 01:26, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Quote from the Hall's own page: "Two members of baseball’s 3,000-hit club will join another exclusive group this summer in Cooperstown." The point being that becoming a member is in the future (this summer), not now. I'm removing the Hall of Fame box. It can be put back on after their induction.Kinston eagle 01:42, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I was reading this are today, and I noticed the last sentence under the Hall of Fame portion where it was stated that in 1999 there were only 25,000 fans to witness the Induction ceremonies. That statement should have stated 50,000 people for which this year's record of 75,000 is 25,000 more than in 1999. I was present at the Induction ceremonies in both years. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.230.49.250 ([[User talk:{[[User:69.230.49.250}|69.230.49.250}]] ([[User talk:69.230.49.250}|talk]] · [[Special:Contributions/69.230.49.250}|contribs]] · WHOIS)|talk]]) 22:49:51, August 19, 2007 (UTC)

Notable hits

An anon account made a change to a number here today, but without a source, I am reluctant to change it back. This section really needs a source if it is to stay. I am tagging it for sourcing. LonelyBeacon (talk) 04:18, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Yes, reliable sources are needed here. Moreover, nearly half the opposing pitchers on the present list seem to have limited Gwynn to a batting average below his career mark, which speaks against their mention as those he "fared well against". Is this not just a trivial collection of opposing pitchers? D. Brodale (talk) 00:37, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

I agree that this listing is trivial. LonelyBeacon (talk) 00:42, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page restored; previous move was not discussed and does not follow WP:COMMONNAME.  Frank  |  talk  20:52, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

---

Tony Gwynn, Sr. → Tony Gwynn — Move back over disambiguation page. This change was made without any discussion. Gwynn the elder is never referred to as "Senior". Per WP:COMMONNAME, this page should be restored to Tony Gwynn, with a hat note directing to his son's page. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:48, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

• Support. I can't believe that we even need to do this, when the page was just moved the other way without discussion, and now cannt be moved back without an RM. The sources confirm the common name convention in support of Tony Gwynn.--Jojhutton (talk) 20:06, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
  • I see it as a flaw in the process. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:09, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Bold text

Please see WP:MOSBIO#Pseudonyms.2C_stage_names_and_common_names regarding bold face for names. For similar examples, please see Lou Gehrig, Reggie Jackson, Cal Ripken...the list goes on. Bold face is perfectly appropriate for nicknames.  Frank  |  talk  01:19, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

That page says nothing about bold facing random nicknames. It shows the bolding of "Dr. Drew", but that's because it is a pseudonym, in a sense. In that sense, I'd agree with bolding Mr. October and probably with The Iron Horse, but again Iron Man fails that as it was a random nickname and not a pseudonym. This is probably delving too far into semantics. – Muboshgu (talk) 01:35, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Style guidelines cannot cover every conceivable situation, so it's up to editors to interpret and apply guidelines. Since different editors may interpret things differently, we have the policy that decisions are made by WP:CONSENSUS. Let's get some opinions here and see what the consensus is on that text. I agree in general that bold text is not especially encyclopedic, but I do think it's appropriate for nicknames. As for "random nicknames" - I really don't know about Gwynn's nicknames, but if they are "random" perhaps they should be removed altogether. If the are not random, but you feel they are, perhaps someone else should provide references for them. (But that part of the discussion is separate from whether or not to put them in bold text.)  Frank  |  talk  13:14, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Infobox content

The Wikipedia Manual of Style for infoboxes states,"the purpose of an infobox: to summarize key facts about the article in which it appears. The less information it contains, the more effectively it serves that purpose, allowing readers to identify key facts at a glance". In my opinion, Tony Gwynn's eight batting titles would be the key fact about his career. How this statistic doesn't merit placement in the infobox is a severe oversight. Surely one batting championship, let alone eight, is more important than a Branch Rickey Award.Orsoni (talk) 10:54, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Need to rework 1990 paragraph

The first paragraph in the 1990-1992 section is not phrased or organized well. Scattered throughout the paragraph are a number of statements regarding Jack Clark's criticisms of Gwynn. I'm going to try to work on it when I can find the time, but if anyone else wants to fix these, feel free.

• In one place it is stated that Gwynn "was further upset that neither management nor other teammates came to his defense," yet two sentences later is a quote from teammate Joe Carter in Gwynn's defense.
• Gwynn's own response to Clark's criticism is placed immediately after Carter's statement, giving the impression that Gwynn is replying to Carter.
• The sentence, "Stung by the criticism, Gwynn was miserable the rest of the season and became an introvert with his teammates," has a couple of problems.
  • This statement appears immediately following a quote from former manager Dick Williams, saying, "I don't think I've ever had a player who worked harder, cared more and was more deserving of his awards." This cannot be the criticism that stung Gwynn.
  • The word "introvert" is not appropriate in this context. Introversion is a core personality trait, and not a behavioral display. Perhaps "withdrawn" would be a better choice here.

There may be other problems as well, but these stood out to me. Aardvark92 (talk) 16:39, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

I was expanding this artilce for a while, but have taken a break. All points seem valid. Note that Carter's quote came the following season after he left San Diego. Still, transitioning in the sentences can be enhanced. Feel free to improve.—Bagumba (talk) 20:05, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Head coaching records table

Muboshgu, could you flesh out your argument not to include a table of Gwynn's yearly records as SDSU coach? To me, it seems that Gwynn's college coaching is essential to a good section on his post-playing career, and I feel justified going into some detail given the excellent, detailed prose in the rest of the article. It also seems to me that the best way to let the reader draw conclusions as to Gwynn's coaching career is to provide a clean, concise list of yearly records, conference finishes, and postseason appearances. (giving only overall record wouldn't allow the reader to judge the trajectory of his career; MWC Tournament appearances would be misleading, given that nearly every team makes it; saying only something about Strasburg and 2009 would give undue weight) Furthermore, there's mountains of precedent across college sports WikiProjects for including yearly records on coach pages, and not simply on team pages (see, for example, Nick Saban, Bill Self, and Jack Parker; Kevin Ollie is an example of doing so even when the coach played professionally). I'm not about to revert an editor of your stature, but could you make a more detailed argument? Cheers, Kithira (talk) 15:58, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

Past consensus at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Baseball/Archive_27#Statistics_sections_in_bios was to not include list of season-by-season stats in bios. I think I've softened on it since; all NBA bios have them and I admit something seems missing in baseball bios. WP:CCC, so feel free to take it WP:BASEBALL.—Bagumba (talk) 18:01, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

It's past consensus, but there's no harm in opening a new conversation. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:16, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

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