Talk:Toyota R engine

Stub

This article had a cleanup tag. Some cleanup has been done, but I have replaced the cleanup tag with the automotive-part stub template.

This is due to the fact that the article doesn't provide much information about the technical advances this type of engine have brought in the automotive world, but it's just a collection of data about its versions.

It would be nice to know:

• what new technologies have been used in this engine when compared to previous types?
• any design choice that differentiate this engine from others from the same company and its competitors.
• how does this engine compares with currently available ones?

And I'm sure the list could proceed further. - manu3d 18:16, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Photo requests

This article has a {{reqphoto}} template even though there is already a picture of a Toyota R engine on the page. If there are editors who feel strongly that it needs additional photos, can you clarify what photos are needed by adding an "of=" parameter to the reqphoto template? Thanks! Tim Pierce (talk) 14:03, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

This engine series changed a lot over nearly 40 years. Photos of the following would be nice:

• the existing 3R-C photo covers the early years;
• 4R, 6R, 7R, 12R, 16R, 18R-C covers the mid years;
• 8R-G, 10R, 9R, 18R-G covers the twincam;
• 18R-GEU, covers the twincam EFI;
• 18R-E, 22R-E, 22R-TE covers the EFI single cam
• 19R, 20R, 21R, 22R covers the later years
• 22R-TE covers the turbo. Stepho-wrs (talk) 00:21, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Details

These are all gasoline engines (not diesel) yes? Someone please confirm and add.75.164.225.243 (talk) 04:47, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Yes, they are all petrol/gasoline engines except for the ones explicitly marked as LPG. Feel free to put this in the introduction.  Stepho  (talk) 07:34, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

12R dates

60.240.186.81 contends that the 12R was used in the Australian built Corona starting from 1969. I searched through a lot of reference material and the earliest date I can find for the 12R being used in the Corona is February 1971 in the RT81 sedan, the RT87 van/wagon and the RT91 hardtop. My reference material includes Toyota's Vehicle Identification Manual (covering 1964-1984 for all markets except Japan and America), Japanese parts catalogues, Japanese/Australian/US brochures, magazines articles and 'The Long Run' (history of Toyota in Australia). 'The Long Run' mentions a 1600 cc engine but that could easily match with the 1587 cc 4R or 1591 cc 7R, both of which were used in the 4#/5# Coronas in other countries. At that point, AMI did not have its own engine production line, so the 12R would have to be made in Japan. But no other market used the 12R, so this is also an unlikely scenario. The Gregories Scientific Publications 1971 Corona manual mentions the 12R in the library summary but I don't have a copy myself so I can't verify if that is the 4#/5# model or the RT81 model. I have listed every Corona model I know of here: [1] . It is now up to 60.240.186.81 to give some proof that the 12R was used in Australia in 1969. Cheers.  Stepho  (talk) 22:55, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

File:Toyota 3R-C.jpg Nominated for Deletion

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18R Engine Details Incomplete

Hi, I was chasing up some info on the 18R (i own several) and I noticed some details are missing here-

• The 18R was also used in early versions of the Supra, Hiace Van(commercial and RV), The Hiace Bus (passenger), The Hilux Ute(2wd) (aka pickup truck), and the petrol version of one of the early 4wd Hilux's (Aka the "Surf"). (However  Stepho  points out the supra never went to production with the 18r, so the examples i heard of may have simply been anomalies, customs not factory spec, similar to the rare 8R evaluators that were imported in the 60's and never officially sold in Australia, thus invalid for the purposes of this article)

• Nowhere does it mention the ideal fuel spec for this engine - likely as there is some argument here. It was a Super Era fuel, but there is conflicting reports on which modern day fuel (and octane rating) it should be used with. (This is the info i am after myself) Further confused by the numerous variants of the R series that shared the same block as the 18R, but used different fuel ratings.

• the 18R motor, and the R series in general, particularly the 8R, DOHC and dual carb variants, was a popular amateur rally racing motor, particularly in places like NZ - likely due to its power vs simplicity and reliability of design. (Rs will easily run for over a million KM's of normal use - without a rebuild) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.123.90.144 (talk) 04:28, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

The 18R was in the Celica (exact model/year differs depending on country) but never in the Supra (Supra was always a 6 cylinder M, G or JZ engine). Fuel spec differed depending on year and engine option (18R-G ran on leaded leaded 'super', 18R-GR ran on 'regular' unleaded, 18R-GU ran on 'premium unleaded', single cammers with iron head generally ran on regular unleaded). I ran my 18R-G on super when it was still available, then switched to PULP. It was okay with regular unleaded except power went down a bit. Which 18R engine are you concerned about?  Stepho  talk  06:01, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Hi, Stepho, it is a straight SOHC 113 Horse power 18R (not the C or G) with 163.1 kg/cm^2 compression (well it was a million KMs ago HA!) - I've been chasing up every 18R manual (man there are a lot of variations even just on the 18R manuals) I can find, and what I just found in one today makes me feel like an idiot - (except only one of all the various manuals even mentioned it so not so much an idiot I guess) on the side of the Dizzy is an "octane selector" knob, which apparently lets you set it from anywhere from 90 and up. Still cant find any decent detail on using the knob tho, such as the octane range (is it 90-95 like ford/holden A/B selectors, or 90-98 like others etc etc) other than a recommendation to wind it till the engine sounds funny and adjust up or down as appropriate.. (BTW the supra's i referred to earlier were the poverty spec 1970's or earlier Australian ones, or the cheapo (sub 2.6 litre NZ tax avoiding) ones, however I don't think they were straight R's more likely RT/RG dual carb or side draught setups, and are unlikely to have seen the light of day in any other countries - but this is all 2nd hand speculation - my notes on Hiace RV Van, Surf and Hilux Pickup are correct tho, I have a 1980 pickup 2wd model parked in my yard, I previously had a hiace van, and I considered buying a 2nd hand 4wd hilux/surf pickup, all 18R or 18RC :o) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.123.90.144 (talk) 02:46, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

For the record, the Celica Supra (aka Celica XX in Japan) was always 6 cylinder (various M, G and JZ engines). The Celica (without Supra and without XX) was always 4 cylinder. The octane selector knob is just a fine adjustment of the distributor timing (retarding the timing allows using lower quality fuel at the expense of worse fuel economy and worse power). But it sounds like you want details for fixing your particular engine. Follow these links for more explanations.

http://members.iinet.net.au/~stepho/celprod.htm

http://members.iinet.net.au/~stepho/eng18r.htm

This Wikipedia talk page is for talking about improving the article but not for asking for help for fixing your personal car. But the linked pages have my email address, so you can ask me detailed questions privately.  Stepho  talk  05:04, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Yer my original posting was to point out the article lacked a few details, and lacked details on equivalent octane.. the rest got outta control! If you like you can remove all my subsequent TALK posts after my original pointing out the lacking info - i have updated my original comment to reflect your points on the Supra VS my comment. I would delete it all but I am not a big fan of random wiki deletions without all involved' permission. Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.123.90.144 (talk) 4 January 2012 (UTC)

No problems, I received your email and will reply to you by email.  Stepho  talk  13:29, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

Timing chain

@"Designed for longitudinal use in such vehicles as the Celica and Hilux and in production from 1953 through 1995, use faded out as many of Toyota's mainstream models moved to front-wheel drive. OHC versions featured a chain-driven camshaft, mitigating the danger of internal damage from interference as in belt-driven engines."

It doesn't "mitigate" the problem of engine damage having a timing chain, merely it increases the service interval for replacement. In any case the chain tensioner has to be replaced at the same interval as a timing belt anyway. Given that the OHV versions also had a timing chain (I assume they didn't use a timing gear ?), I'm not sure how to change this sentence. Maybe it should be simply deleted.203.39.81.92 (talk) 01:32, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

I think you are right. Toyota changed to timing belts at the same time that it changed to interference engines. But the use of a timing chain or timing belt is independent of it being an interference or non-interference engine. I'd delete the second half of the last sentence - from "mitigating" onwards".  Stepho  talk  04:16, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Stepho, you changed your signature! I like it.  ⊂| Mr.choppers |⊃  (talk) 04:45, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, been staring at too much CSS at work lately :) Thanks for the nice word.  Stepho  talk  08:32, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

out of curiosity of the timing chain subject the 5R engine has two main versions timing chain and timing gears and is rated 97 and 106hp. is this done in other OHV R engines such as the 3R, as little between the two versions of 5R engine are interchangeable and there dose not seem to be a timeline between applications. the sumps/oil pans are not interchangeable, nor are the heads or water pumps and replacement gasket kits contain both styles of gaskets. personally the easiest way i have found to tell the difference between them quickly is to feel the PCV under the exhaust manifold, something that can be done without even seeing the engine and if where the PCV enters the crank casing if it bolts on it is timing chain, if no bolts are found and presses in like a core plug it is timing gear. which engine is the 97hp and which one is the 106hp version?Whysmee (talk) 10:28, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Off the top of my head - I don't know. But give me some time to trawl through some manuals and I can give an answer. I can tell you that the Crown RS50 had a petrol 5R with 93 PS (92 bhp) and an LPG 5R with 85 PS (84 bhp). Both had timing gears.  Stepho  talk  13:04, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Ah, found an answer quicker than I thought I would. The Crown RS60 series also used the 5R but this time had a timing chain. The Crown changed from the S40/50 series to the S60/70 series in Feb 1971, so I expect the 5R changed about then too. I don't have performance figures for the S60/70 series 5R.  Stepho  talk  13:36, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

my 1969 RU12 dyna had a factory timing chain and i have a timing gear version out of an alleged 83 coaster (a so called 109hp square inlet and exhaust port version). yet while searching for a head for a timing chain version i was told that they were random and how i figured the easiest way to tell the difference was with the dyna, it was to kneel down and feel the PCV from underneath and they are random from my experience. oh as well the owners manual out of my RU12 said there was a J 2.2l diesel option, the only other place i have seen an engine that looked like it was in a 1960 toyopet stout that was for sale from chile...Whysmee (talk) 02:54, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

Looking at the Corona MkII and the Hiace, they changed from the timing gear 1500cc 2R to the timing chain 1600cc 12R in Feb 1971. The spot checking I've done so far agrees that the change from timing gear to timing chain happened in Feb 1971. But I can't check my Dyna parts catalogues until late tonight, so hopefully I can pin it down then.  Stepho  talk  04:21, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

drifting through some other manuals, a lot of Toyotas changed from the 2R (1500cc, timing gear) to the 12R (1600cc, timing chain) in Feb 1971. But the clincher was this pic

http://members.iinet.net.au/~stepho/manuals/Toyota/5R-cam.png

Before Oct 1970 the 5R had timing gears. After Oct 1970 the 5R had a timing chain. Nothing random about it - you can tell purely by date.  Stepho  talk  14:51, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

22RE

I have a 1986 Toyota Corona (Australian production) with this engine, which is not listed here. The model was designated "Avante" for the manual and undesignated for the automatic with "Super Responsive" decals on the exterior and in the engine bay. The standard model used a 2.0L engine. The same year the front wheel drive Camry was released with a different engine.203.39.81.92 (talk) 01:42, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

I added the 22R-E Corona RT142 for you.  Stepho  talk  03:38, 20 March 2014 (UTC)