Talk:Trail running

Push to improve quality

I'm going to try to improve this page a bit. Took out a lot of odd bits and pieces that (questionably) don't belong in this article. Most of the race descriptions should sit in their own pages. Ultimately, we probably want a "list of trail races" page. Right now, I'm going to aim to write some new content about races in general. Biozinc (talk) 20:45, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

Title

It is Wikipedia custom to make the title bold on the first line :-) Will => talk 18:46, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Re-addition of statement regarding risks

An anon removed two sentences describing the risks taken by trail runners, saying

deletion of two sentences that seem biased and somewhat derogatory, and are definitely extraneous to the subject of the article/section. Prescriptive, not descriptive

I re-added a more descriptive statement of the dangers of the sport. In my experience, this editor is representative of a frighteningly large segment of the trail running community, who have no conception of the dangers they face. Most trail runners come from a running background, not a wilderness background so it is understandable that they are naive to these risks.

Last summer I was on an alpine backpacking trip in Colorado. We were a day's hike from civilization lugging 60-pound packs, and were overtaken by lone trail runners with nothing but 2-liter camelbaks, cotton clothing, and probably a few power bars. Their timing also showed total disregard for the sudden weather they could encounter in the afternoons. I was half expecting to come across a shivering runner who broke his ankle the day before. Fortunately, I didn't.

There needs to be some cautioning statement in this article, perhaps stronger than the one I added. ⇝Casito⇝Talk 22:53, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Quite the contrary. I agree with the IP who removed this, and am removing it myself. See the official policy at Wikipedia is not a manual, guidebook, or textbook, "Wikipedia articles should not include instructions, advice (legal, medical, or otherwise) or suggestions" (bold text mine). --DeLarge 20:55, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Ten Essentials

I disagree with your reasoning. Describing hazards associated with an activity is encyclopedic (regardless of the author's motivation for doing so). In comparison, no one would dispute that an article about a drug should discuss its side effects. Additionally, other articles, Hiking for example, have entire sections devoted to the safety aspects of the sport (an extreme example would be an article like Motorcycle safety clothing).

In the place of the previous statement about wilderness carelessness, I added a sentence about the Ten Essentials and the Hazards of outdoor activities. I doubt anyone will have a problem with it, and I would be slightly worried if they did.

As this article evolves and grows, a safety or hazards section will no doubt be added. Runner's World Complete Guide to Trail Running by Dagny Scott Barrios devotes two chapters to the matter. I would enjoy working with any author to ensure NPOV and expand the article by adding such a section.

⇝Casito⇝Talk 22:36, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

The races

How does a race that is "trail runnning" differ from a cross country race? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Runningguy (talk • contribs) 01:39, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Spam

User:Stevelikesapint, please read WP:EL prior to reinserting the weblinks in the article's text. Thanks. Location (talk) 21:46, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

As you've probably noticed, I'm new to Wikipedea. I don't understand tildes or code like that yet, not the rules. I will read them when I have time, but my heavy workload at work won't permit that presently. Apologies. My edit / revert has been described as hyperbole. That description comes across as hyperbolic in itself, everying I added to the article was factual and I can back it up with runners blogs (including Dr Ron Hills own blog). I am an experienced trail/fell/cross country/track/road runner, and have organised many such races, including free road races. While I don't claim to be a global authority on it, inthink it is right and fair that shorter, low key, not for profit trail running ventures get a mention, hence I included Hit The Trail. Basically, if high margin, high attendance trail runs are included, I think small ones should, in the interests of balance and fairness. Many thanks for reading, if I've not done this in the proper way, I hope you recognise that I'm new to this and am acting in the best interest of the sport at grassroots level. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stevelikesapint (talk • contribs) 22:06, 12 June 2012 (UTC) Additional - in response to messages that i dont appearm to be able to respond to - as explained earlier - im new to this. II understand the need to prevent spamming. If I was the only one putting externalmlinks to pages, I would see the fairness in that. But there are links to plenty of races, including The Lakeland Trails. So why is my link classified as spam when the Lakeland trail website isn't? Ps I've saught wpel for clarification but don't feel that this applies more to the link I inserted than to existing links. Thank you for reading— Preceding unsigned comment added by Stevelikesapint (talk • contribs) 22:20, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

Given that notability hinges on secondary and tertiary sources, non-notable events (i.e. those that do not already have Wikipedia articles) should be backed-up by secondary or tertiary sources. The website for a particular event is a primary source. There is a lot of other stuff that should be stripped from this article because of that. (Relevant reading here is WP:N, WP:RS, and WP:PSTS.)

Also, if you check the article's history, you will see that the comment of "hyperbole" in the edit summary was not in reference to your edits. Location (talk) 23:56, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

so there is bias in censoring the information I am providing? It appears that my contribution is being singled out for no reason. I do feel that this article needs balance - so we need to include more low key events, from various geographical locations. Tell me, what's your involvement in trail running? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stevelikesapint (talk • contribs) 05:40, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

You have not been singled out, nor are you the victim of any bias. I've given you the reasons why your material cannot be included, but you have admitted that you don't have the time to read the rules. Events that do not appear to be notable by Wikipedia standards or are not backed by secondary reliable sources have been stripped per this edit. Location (talk) 15:28, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Your reasons contradict this statement, "There is a lot of stuff that should be stripped from this article" which I am a bit confused about.I can provide secondary sources including Runners World Magazine, and mentioned former commonwealth marathon champion, Ron Hill's blog, there are other places that the event (and similar ones) are mentioned. I assume that you are not a runner? Forgive me if I'm wrong.

I have a proposition - I provide the reputable website links that back this race up, then we agree on some wording that objectively mentions low key races at the grass roots level of trail running.

As a runner, I am passionate about ensuring that readers of this article are exposed to a balanced sample of races. I have seen this on other Wikipedia pages so if we can come to a rational agreement, I don't see a problem? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stevelikesapint (talk • contribs) 21:29, 13 June 2012 (UTC) edit - trying the signature tool (new to this, sorry!) 21:37, 13 June 2012 (UTC)--Stevelikesapint (talk) 21:37, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

I have no objection to mentioning the low-key aspect to trail running provided the material meets Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Regarding content, a general discussion about smaller events would be in line with Wikipedia:Neutral point of view. Unfortunately, a discussion about a specific smaller race would likely violate the section pertaining to undue weight. I am more familiar with road racing in the United States in which there are literally hundreds of low-key road races each weekend, but I could likely pick from two or three trail events in my area each Saturday or Sunday if I desired. Disregarding for a moment Wikipedia's rules regarding notability, weight, and sourcing, the problem of picking one event and citing the hosting club's website as a source opens the door for the next person to claim "bias" and cite his or her club or event for "balance". Regarding sourcing, Runner's World would be considered a reliable secondary source for running-related topics. Self-published material, such as blogs, are generally not (see WP:SPS). When in doubt, run it by Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard. It sounds like you have a lot to contribute, so don't let any of this scare you off. You'll get the hang of it. Location (talk) 04:37, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Lack of citations

These are just three sentences where inline citations are needed: "This research shows a particularly heavy following in the Mountain States, the Western US, and California./ Because of the natural or serene setting, trail running is viewed as a more spiritual activity than roadside running or jogging. Another reason for growth and popularity is the continual acknowledgment of environmentalism". Rwood128 (talk) 14:12, 12 December 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia's verifiability policy requires inline citations for any material challenged or likely to be challenged (WP:CS).

Trek and Trail

How is it different from trek running and expand upon difference with mountain running. This sentence "Mountain running only differs from trail running when the route includes paving." is ambiguous. Does trail running route include paving or is it mountain running route? I find it hard to believe that it's the only reason because there are World championships in mountain running and trail running.213.149.62.127 (talk) 21:58, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. I've revised that sentence. If you know more please edit–my knowledge is limited on this topic. Rwood128 (talk) 22:35, 16 December 2018 (UTC)