Talk:Tropical Storm Debra (1978)

Todo

Fix the typos and writing, more info, more sources, find a damage total, add a track map, add categories, and overall some more time and effort. --♬♩ Hurricanehink (talk) 21:05, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

I can't find a damage total. Track map done, typos done, category done, writing being worked on. Otherwise, I was conerned it would not ave enough info to be kept; does it? Juliancolton (talk) 22:43, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

I checked an official list of storms that affected texas in the 1970's from the NHC. It has a damage total for every storm except Debra. Juliancolton (talk) 23:05, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure if there is enough info in the article for it to be kept. Considering there are only 4 sources, all from NHC or HPC, I don't see the need in a separate article. However, if you find another five to ten sources, I'd be more convinced it should stay. Again, the writing could be better; On October 28, it was upgraded to Tropical Storm Debra. It soon reached it's peak intensity of 60 mph (95 km/h). First, the storm was in August, and second, the latter sentence reads "...reached it is peak intensity...". It's is a contraction for it is; please fix it. --♬♩ Hurricanehink (talk) 23:58, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

Ok. I have gotten some positive feedback on it, though. Juliancolton (talk) 00:03, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

OK, but I'd still like to see what I recommended above. --♬♩ Hurricanehink (talk) 00:30, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Sure. I am still looking. Juliancolton (talk) 00:34, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

New todo

Add google news sources! ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:51, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

Will do when I have time! Hurricanefan25 (talk) 20:17, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

Doing...many references added... Hurricanefan25 ^{tropical cyclone} 21:55, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Here is another cache of information. There is a lot of stuff there, and while most of it is probably useless, it should help expand the storm history and impact. --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:55, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Before the article is reviewed for GAN, have all of these links been used? --♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 03:00, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

First paragraph of MH

Debra formed from an upper tropospheric cold low over south Florida on August 25. The low moved towards the Yucatán Peninsula over the next day. The same day, a tropical wave drifted from the western Caribbean Sea in the direction of the Yucatán Peninsula. Around 1200 UTC on August 25, the tropical wave and the low-level vorticy center of the cold low further organized. The wave strengthened the low-level inflow, and a tropical depression formed on August 26, about 400 nautical miles south of New Orleans. – I see several basic meterological omissions/inconsistencies here. First off, you never mention when the upper-level low dropped to the surface; instead, you just throw in that the low-level vorticity center organized. That said, a wave doesn't really "organize", and the prelim report doesn't say anything about it, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Did convection along the wave fire? Did pressures drop? Did the wave close off? "Organize" is vague. Also, you never describe how/when the two disturbances interacted. Did they align vertically, or did the wave simply pass by? And when did the cold-core low start to warm at its center? You go from cold-core vorticity center to TD, which ignores the bulk of tropical cyclogenesis. Let me know if you need any help. Juliancolton (talk) 19:01, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Images for upload

1. [1]
2. [2]
3. [3]

All in public domain, images taken by NOAA. Hurricanefan25 ^{tropical cyclone} 21:28, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Tweaks!

I did a few tweaks (on request); concatenations for fluency and so on. Ideally, the lede shouldn't have inline citations - provided that the citations appear in the main text, for the statements made in the lede, they can be saafely removed from the lede. Nice little article, by the way! Interesting. Pesky (talk …stalk!) 05:07, 8 July 2011 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Tropical Storm Debra (1978)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer:Juliancolton (talk) 15:18, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

HFan, nice work on this. I think it has potential to be listed as a GA in the extremely near future, but there are things I'd like to see improved on in the meantime. Things I see from the get-go:

• The lead is very brief, and does not summarize the whole article in my opinion.
• Tropical Depression Four remained a depression until August 26, when it was upgraded to tropical storm status, and was named as Tropical Storm Debra. - This is extremely clunky wording, as is the following...
• As Debra approached the coast it reached peak intensity, with winds of 60 mph (95 km/h).
• Several tornadoes were spawned as the storm moved ashore. - try to avoid "were" when you know the cause of the action; for example, this could be "The storm spawned several tornadoes, etc."
• You don't need to link dissipation.

Overall, I think the writing needs a lot of work, and the above examples are from the lead alone. Let me know when you've gone through the entire page and I'll reevaluate. For now it's on-hold for around a week to allow these issues to be addressed. Juliancolton (talk) 15:18, 19 July 2011 (UTC)

GOCE copyedit July 2011

Hi

During the copyedit a few things came to light that may need attention:

Lead

• "As Debra approached the coast, it attained ..." - which coast was it approaching?

Meteorological history

• "The low pressure system further organized" - perhaps it was sorting out its bank statements? If this is a meteorological term it should be further explained, if not I suggest amending to "further developed".
• "Observation stations off the coast recorded" - once again off the coast of where?
• "00:00 GMT on August 29" - ensure that this was the morning of Aug 29th, MoS says to use 24:00 for midnight of the 28th and 00:00 for the morning of the 29th. It could also be written as "midnight August 28/29" (Wikipedia:MOS_(dates_and_numbers)#Time_of_day).
• "to the west." - of where?
• "Tropical Storm Debra dissipated over Arkansas." - when? The other details are pretty specific, this one should be also - otherwise it could be a week or a month later.

Preparations and impact

• "Many rice stands had been knocked over" - I have added (crops) as an interim measure "Many rice stands (crops) had been knocked over" to disambiguate between a food stand, selling hotdogs etc., and a crop. It seems that the term is not presently covered by Wikipedia or Wiktionary. Other sources seem to use the term "stand of rice" only when talking about wild rice (Encyclopaedia Britannica for example).
• "Tornadoes were spotted in" -> "Tornadoes were reported in" - without being reported we would not know about them. It also disagrees with the first section, where only three states were confirmed.

General

• Perhaps mention of the Shrimp boats that sank and damage to the cotton crops should be mentioned?
• The Meteorological history section mentions three tornadoes, one each in the three states, but the Preparations and impact section mentions "were spotted" in four states (Tennessee, Arkansas, Mississippi, and Louisiana) and more than one per state, with 4 in Mississippi.

Copyedit finished, good luck with the GA! Chaosdruid (talk) 21:33, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Todo

• Can you find a more interesting opening sentence?
• Is the tornado table really needed? There are only five.
  • Done.
• How did the upper-level low move east from Florida toward the Yucatan Peninsula? Did it traverse the entire planet?
  • Fixed.
• "The low pressure system further organized and began to interact with the approaching wave, strengthening the low-level inflow, leading to a tropical depression being formed on August 25, around 460 miles (740 km) south of New Orleans." - that's pretty confusing. Couldn't you just say "the interaction between the upper-level system and the wave led to the formation of a tropical depression on August 25 around 460 miles (740 km) south of New Orleans."? Something simple like that
  • Done.
• You don't ever mention the peak winds (60 mph) in the MH
  • Already done.
• Be sure that when the primary unit is rounded, the converted metric unit is rounded as well
  • Done.
• When did the recon find it was a TS?
  • Fixed.
• The lede is misleading, as it implies both deaths were from tornadoes. That contradicts the offshore death.
  • Hopefully fixed and easily understood.
• "Louisiana had moderate flooding, especially in Rapides Parish,[15] 6 inches (15 cm) of rain fell at Lake Charles and Lafayette, 3 inches (7.6 cm) of rain fell at Shreveport, and 3.5 inches (8.9 cm) at Monroe, Louisiana." - that is a rather long and awkwardly phrased sentence.
• "In the dawn of August 29, all rainwater had receded from the streets and tides were back to normal levels" - so the water receded on August 29? Or just by that time it had receded?
  • Fixed.
• Right after the previous sentence you mention a flash flood warning, but there isn't much context. You talk about Louisiana, and then you go into warnings for a large region
  • Fixed.
• Going with the above, you have one paragraph about Louisiana rainfall and flooding, then one about Texas impact, and then another about Louisiana rainfall. Please combine similar information together (like all of the Louisiana impact)
  • Fixed.
• "Many rice stands (crops) had been knocked over because of the gusts of wind from Tropical Storm Debra." - why did you use the phrase "had been knocked over"? Most of the rest of the article uses a simple past tense for the verb, so this stands out a bit.
  • Done.

--♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 15:35, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Tropical Storm Debra (1978)/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Yellow Evan (talk · contribs · count) 21:43, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

• "It was first known as Tropical Depression Four after its formation on August 25 until August 26, when it was upgraded to Tropical Storm Debra after data collected by aircraft indicated it had strengthened" sounds odd, I suggest changing it to "Fomring on Augst 25, it was upgraded to Tropical Storm Debra based on data from a Hurricane Hunter aircraft.YE ^{Pacific Hurricane}
  • Done.
• Remove all convert templates since it is WPTC policy not to use them for NHC AOR storms. YE ^{Pacific Hurricane} 21:43, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Agree for windspeeds, disagree for all others. Also, could you link to the policy?
    • Here. However, I happen to agree with you that convert templates are needed for NHC AOR storms. Feel free to open a dissucusion on the project talk page.YE ^{Pacific Hurricane} 22:24, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
• Wikilink to GMT in the MH.YE ^{Pacific Hurricane}
  • Done.
• "A flash flood watch was issued in advance of Debra for the whole of Louisiana."link Louisiana. YE ^{Pacific Hurricane}
  • Louisiana is already linked in the lede, so I don't think it needs to be wikilinked.
• "Louisiana had moderate flooding, especially in Rapides Parish;[19] 6 inches (15 cm) of rain fell at Lake Charles and Lafayette, 3 inches (7.6 cm) of rain fell at Shreveport, and 3.5 inches (8.9 cm) at Monroe.[20]" tihs sentence is long, I'd suggest spliting it up. 21:43, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Done.
• Any damage total? YE ^{Pacific Hurricane} 21:43, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
  • I found data for every 1970s storm that impacted the U.S. except Debra.
• Wikilink to season article in see also section. YE ^{Pacific Hurricane} 21:43, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Did that before and got reverted.
    • Odd. YE ^{Pacific Hurricane} 22:24, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

I have six issues, all should be minor, and thus I'm leaving Debra on hold. YE ^{Pacific Hurricane}

Enough issues have been adressed for me to pass the article. Congrats HF25.YE ^{Pacific Hurricane} 22:24, 25 September 2011 (UTC)