Talk:USS Aphrodite

Complete rewrite needed.

Aside from being completely unsourced later paragraphs appear to be from a biography of the owner and captain rather than the vessel. Those paragraphs also contain much about the personal characteristics and praise for the persons rather than directly with the vessel. A long crew list violates the "ships not people" guidance. Palmeira (talk) 15:16, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

After scanning questionable sections and checking the biographical article Oliver Hazard Payne most of that text belongs in that biography — if properly referenced. And rid of such speculative nonsense as:

"That secret name was Aphrodite, the Greek goddess of Love. Possibly he chose this name because he had not taken a wife during his life and he secretly wished he had the love of a woman. But now in a sense, he did have the love of a woman, one that was 300-feet in length . . ."

Much of that sort of wording appears to be from a biographical sketch or book. Palmeira (talk) 16:41, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Discussion at WikiProject Ships

For reference in cleanup and the source of the bloated biographical text:

Ship mixed with biography. Anyone interested in cleanup?

USS Aphrodite is one for which I added pre-Navy construction background to back in 2014. Since that time a major addition turned the ship article into largely a biographical article properly belonging in the biography Oliver Hazard Payne. There are two problems even with that text being moved there: 1) it is completely unsourced 2) it contains much "flowery" language and praising words not suitable to an encyclopedia. Much has the tone of a praising biography and may be overly extensive direct quote. In my view the questionable material is so intertwined that it is going to need someone with both ship and biography interest to unravel. The other problem is that the DANFS entry contains quite a bit more about naval service than the applicable section in the existing article. I did check to see if any of that "biography" text originated there and it does not. As expected it is a "Naval ship's biography" — not one about Oliver Hazard Payne who is mentioned once. That untangling is not something I am particularly interested in doing and I have no interest in the biography. My inclination would be mass delete, but there may be some good biography that needs saving. Anyone with an interest in both? In doing the division? I have added cleanup tags. If there is no interest I will perhaps take it on at some time but with the qualification that the unsourced biography goes in bloc to a Talk section for preservation if sourced and the remainder is straight ship. Palmeira (talk) 17:07, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

The extensive biographical text added on 13 May 2018 is the same as appears here. This was not the only one which was inappropriately bloated by the same new editor on 13 May 2018. USS Housatonic (SP-1697) has extensive text that also appears here. Both of those were originally written well before the WP articles were posted, but had later revisions, and unfortunately web.archive.org does not have pre-13/5/2018 versions of these to compare). The third was USS President Lincoln (1907), which was quickly identified a copyvio - and then the editor disappeared, at least under that name. Davidships (talk) 18:43, 12 April 2021 (UTC) (sorry, not volunteering as I'm well behind in things already committed)

Yep, he only made a half dozen edits, then booked. Probably best to undo them wholesale, then try to pick them apart. (jmho) - wolf 19:10, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Ah so! Good checking and finding. I'd tried searches on text bits without success. I'd thought perhaps some obscure biographical publication. Seeing it is a genealogy piece, probably self researched and "published," my concern for keeping some whole of that biographical information largely vanishes. Perhaps all true, but of no more use here than my extensive files of findings and personal memories of "my" ships. As I have edited and have a long interest in those ex yacht Section Patrol types I think I can handle a purge, redo of this one sometime soon. Palmeira (talk) 20:20, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Looking at the editor's user page, he's the author of the Coast Artillery Corps site on Rootsweb. His site is the only source I've found for more than the bare facts of existence of the WWI coast artillery regiments, also concisely summarizing the US Army WWI railway artillery programs. Of course, this bio material on persons associated with ships is outside that. He rarely gives any sourcing information, and when he does it's usually a personal recollection/diary/etc. So I'd say his material can be removed. RobDuch (talk·contribs) 01:02, 15 April 2021 (UTC)

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Evaluating best method to restore as a ship article. Palmeira (talk) 13:14, 19 April 2021 (UTC)