Talk:Ugly (Slowthai album)

Requested move 5 March 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (non-admin closure) Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 01:59, 14 March 2023 (UTC)

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Ugly (Slowthai album) → UGLY (album) – Title is an acronym as sourced in the lead. QuietHere (talk) 22:10, 4 March 2023 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). Steel1943 (talk) 16:13, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

(The following discussion thread was initiated at WP:RMTR.) Steel1943 (talk) 16:13, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

Not contesting the request, but I suggest that you consider opening a RM because there are several albums named Ugly (I.e. those at Ugly#Music) that may make this request controversial. There could be an argument for WP:DIFFCAPS that applies to this, but I would prefer outside input at least. The Night Watch (talk) 23:32, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

...Well, I'm contesting this because someone could reasonably believe either the current tile or UGLY (Slowthai album) could be preferred choices. Start a WP:RM. Steel1943 (talk) 02:48, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

@QuietHere and The Night Watch: Ping participants. Steel1943 (talk) 16:14, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose and close. See Ugly (disambiguation) with Ugly (Life of Agony album), 1995 and Ugly (Screaming Females album), 2012 In ictu oculi (talk) 17:18, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

And I notice that the cover art of the Screaming Females album has "UGLY" in all-caps. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 06:07, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

At the very least it should be moved to UGLY (Slowthai album), but I do think DIFFCAPS should apply here. QuietHere (talk) 20:11, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

• Weak oppose: It seems like more of a backronym than an acronym. I strongly doubt it is pronounced letter-by-letter. The same probably goes for track #7 on the album, "HAPPY". Wikipedia tends to be pretty averse to all-caps (MOS:ALLCAPS / WP:TITLETM / MOS:TM). Some of the cited sources, such as Slant and The Telegraph, don't use the all-caps. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 05:03, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

  I will give you the point on inconsistent capitalization and honestly I would be willing to withdraw on that alone, but I don't get what your point about backronyms is for. Is that not just a type of acronym? I don't see anything in MOS:ACROTITLE that would imply that makes a difference. QuietHere (talk) 14:15, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

  A backronym as a justification for an all-caps title has been successfully argued before with NSYNC. See here. 162 etc. (talk) 17:09, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

  For NSYNC, I do not see any alternative available that was less artificial than NSYNC. "Ugly" is obviously a word, but "Nsync" isn't. Also, much of that NSYNC discussion was about punctuation marks, and about what sources do. Being formed from the last letter of each band member's last name seems a bit less artificial to me than this one, and NSYNC has gotten a lot more coverage in sources than this topic. And I don't see the word "backronym" anywhere in that NSYNC discussion. In addition to the two sources above, The Guardian also doesn't use all-caps for it. If the spelled-out form is a backronym to the degree that its all-caps is ignored by a significant portion of the sources, then I argue the all-caps should be treated as just superfluous styling. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 19:05, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose. I concur with BarrelProof's reasoning, especially the fact that sources are not near-consistently rendering it as "UGLY" (MOS:CAPS / WP:NCCAPS). Agree also with In ictu oculi that better disambiguation would be required than just "(album)" anyway.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  01:31, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
• Weak oppose as well. Sources are not consistent with the all-caps rendering, and this seems like a case of Slowthai wanting to call an album "Ugly" or "UGLY" in all caps then finding individual words for each of the letters. Same with what BarrelProof said, I don't think Slowthai intends anybody to pronounce it "U-G-L-Y" (like that Daphne & Celeste song). Ss112 19:07, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.