Talk:University of Dayton Ghetto

Attention request

This article has been an ongoing project of mine for quite a while now, and I'd like to have it reassessed by an outside editor. If it hasn't yet reached GA status, I would appreciate feedback on how it can be improved. I've exhausted the earlier suggestions in the peer review, and I think I've got it up to GA. Thanks. Newsboy85 (talk) 07:25, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Not the GA review you're looking for, but you might want to convert the references to use citation templates. The auto-review picked up:"As done in WP:FOOTNOTE, footnotes usually are located right after a punctuation mark (as recommended by the CMS, but not mandatory), such that there is no space in between." as well. §hep • ^Talk 01:13, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

I couldn't find any instances of the footnotes thing. As for the formatting on the references, I'll take a look. Newsboy85 (talk) 01:28, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

"Oakwood neighborhood" links to an article about the city, not a neighborhood. Is it north of a neighborhood in Oakwood? Or is it just a bad link? §hep • ^Talk 01:38, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Oakwood is a suburb of Dayton - it is contiguous to the city proper. "Neighborhood" may not have been the best word choice. City of Oakwood is fine. Thanks for the extra set of eyes on the entry. Newsboy85 (talk) 01:53, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

If the commas follow British English, then the article should use British spelling as well. §hep • ^Talk 02:29, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Also, would it be best to use hectares in the acre conversion over meters? §hep • ^Talk 02:32, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

The commas, and the article, follow American English. Commas should always go inside the quotes in American Engish, in all circumstances. One of your edits moved them outside. 64.123.246.100 (talk) 03:31, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

That must be a script error I'll have to reprt then. I could have sworn when editing that section I clicked AE. I didn't check to see what your edit did (or in all honesty the original change) so I assumed it was back to ", which means my last edit to the article was FUBAR. Now that that's out of the way (sorry), what do you think about using hectares? §hep • ^Talk 03:41, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

The conversions were bot-added a while back. Honestly, I'm a fan of the metric system, and I don't know how many people think in hectares anymore. Newsboy85 (talk) 03:54, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

I always thought of the meter as more of a length measurement and hectare the metric equivalent to acre. Either way, I guess it's not a very pressing matter. §hep • ^Talk 04:01, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

• You also might want to consider archiving the ELs with WebCite; if you decide to use citation templates. §hep^Talk 22:21, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:University of Dayton Ghetto/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

This is how the article, as of February 13, 2009, compares against the six good article criteria:

1. Well written?: (Pending) Pass

• You only need citations in the lead for controversial facts (see WP:LEADCITE)—the actual citation should follow in the body somewhere when the fact is repeated, since the lead is a summary of the body of the article.

• Unnecessary citation removed. Second paragrah was moved lower in the text, as it didn't fit this definition of a lead. I wrote a new summary paragraph to replace it.

• "...included only four streets – Lowes..." → "...included only four streets: Lowes..."

• Done.

• Not sure "endowed" is the best word here: "Some houses in the neighborhood have been informally endowed with nicknames..."

• Done.

• See also section is not needed since the two links are already linked in the text of the article

• Done.

This isn't necessary for GAN, but the references would be readable if rendered in consistent format (e.g., {{cite web}}).

• Cite web has been applied. I hadn't used it before, so it was good to learn anyway.

2. Factually accurate?: --Eustress (talk) 23:17, 19 February 2009 (UTC)(Pending) Pass

• A couple of the citations have the same titles even though they direct to different websites. Be sure to use precise titles; e.g., Ref#11 is titled "UD Housing website" when the actual website title is "Junior/Senior Lottery Position."

• Done. The references for sepcific houses in the university search system have been collapsed together because the system doesn't allow linking to a specific result. The references are included because the pictures of those houses include signs on which the names are visible.

3. Broad in coverage?: Pass

4. Neutral point of view?: (Pending) Pass

• ALL information relies on UDayton sources, which is unacceptable in ensuring NPOV via reliable sources.

• Flyer News is not controlled by the university, though it is a university organization. While USA Today, The Dayton Daily News and The Miami Student have all done articles about various aspects of the Ghetto, none of them are directly applicable to the article. There was discussion about this in the past (now archived). Still, I'll throw in the citation from USA Today, which at least establishes some of the basic facts in an article about a specific incident in the Ghetto.

• Okay, but more heterogeneity of sources is preferred to help establish notability too. --Eustress (talk) 23:18, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

5. Article stability? Pass

6. Images?: (Pending) Pass

• Per WP:CAP, captions only terminate with a period if a complete sentence.

• Done.

• Per WP:CAP, all captions should be more succinct

• Done.

In its current condition, I will put the article on hold for seven days. Please notify me on my talk page when the article is ready for another look-through, and please respond directly to each bulleted item to aid me in reappraising the article. Best regards --Eustress (talk) 01:18, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the review. I'm out of town right now but will take care of these ASAP, within the seven-day period. Newsboy85 (talk) 07:27, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for your help on this! Newsboy85 (talk) 21:20, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

With the references now formatted correctly, a few other issues stood out, as noted above. --Eustress (talk) 21:44, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm on it. Give me a little bit. Newsboy85 (talk) 22:02, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Done and done. Newsboy85 (talk) 22:53, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for you work on the issues above. The result of this GAN is pass. Congratulations! --Eustress (talk) 23:17, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for your time and your help! Newsboy85 (talk) 23:22, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Notability

This article exclusively cites university press releases and the student paper. Does it have actual coverage outside of the local vicinity? Moreover, is the title a phrase widely used by all media sources? It appears blatantly POV if only the student papers use the name and we use it for an encyclopedia article. czar ♔ 00:14, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

Requested move 11 May 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: No consensus (non-admin closure) Mdann52 (talk) 20:36, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

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University of Dayton Ghetto → University of Dayton South Student Neighborhood – The title of this article is pejorative and does not meet the Wikipedia standards for article titles. Let's discuss a better title below. Libroman2 (talk) 20:37, 11 May 2016 (UTC) -- Relisting. Anarchyte (work | talk) 07:21, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

• http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/news/news/debate-rages-about-uds-ghetto/npStt/
• https://flyernews.com/stop-calling-our-neighborhood-the-ghetto/
• The use of the "ghetto" is also not supported by local vowed religious. https://flyernews.com/marianist-response-to-the-ghetto/— Preceding comment added by Libroman2 (talk • contribs) 20:47, 11 May 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose – the current title is the WP:COMMONNAME for the topic. SSTflyer 13:41, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

• University of Dayton Student Neighborhood Map.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 14:37, 5 September 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 1 February 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: No consensus to move (non-admin closure) (t · c) buidhe 14:18, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

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University of Dayton Ghetto → University of Dayton Student Neighborhood – The Student Neighborhood is no longer called "the Ghetto" officially, and most students no longer use this term either due to its historical connotations for minorities. Additionally, references to "the Darkside" are recommended to be changed to North Student Neighborhood, its official name, except where discussion of the student nickname is relevant. I believe these changes will bring these articles closer to the reality of the Student Neighborhood and its discussion by students and faculty. Proper naming will also improve ease of access and search for visitors to Wikipedia. ItsNeighborhood (talk) 20:26, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

• Oppose - It is important to note, per WP:COMMONNAME, that "Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's 'official' name as an article title; it generally prefers the name that is most commonly used (as determined by its prevalence in a significant majority of independent, reliable English-language sources) as such names will usually best fit" the criteria of recognizability, naturalness, precision, conciseness, and consistency.

It is also worth noting that the Ghetto is not on university property, and does not belong to the university.

In addition, Wikipedia "is not a soapbox or means of promotion", per WP:SOAPBOX. If the university and a handful of students don't like the name "Ghetto", then they are welcome to change the name on university-published maps and denounce its use in the school newspaper.

These are some sources which support that "Ghetto" is the generally preferred name for this off-campus community:

• [1] - A 2018 blog post which suggests "Ghetto" is still widely used to refer to this neighborhood.
• [2] - This 2020 article in the campus newspaper which suggests many students still call this "the Ghetto".
• [3] - A 2020 article in the campus newspaper which says, "The 'ghetto' is how many UD students refer to the South Student Neighborhood".
• [4] - This 2020 article in Sports Illustrated which refers to the student housing in several places as "the Ghetto", writing, "If you come to Dayton for the First Four or at any point during basketball season, you must visit the Ghetto".
• [5] - Here is another article calling it the Ghetto.
• [6] - Here is a transmission repair service "conveniently located just down the street from the University of Dayton and UD ghetto".
• [7] - A private housing service called "UD Ghetto Student Housing".
• [8] - This article in the Dayton Daily News suggests "Ghetto" is widely used, despite recent efforts by the university to change it.
• [9] - A lovely home for rent "In the 'Dark Side' of the Ghetto".
• [10] - Ghetto drinking hat. Magnolia677 (talk) 00:00, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.