Talk:Vietnamese numerals
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 | This article contains a translation of 越南语数字 from zh.wikipedia. |
Nam above 10
editIn Hanoi, When speaking, "15" is "nam muoi lam". You say lam instead of nam for 5, for any number above ten that ends in 5.
55 years is = nam muoi lam nam
Because you often say "25" meaning "25 years old" you say "hai muoi lam" not "hai muoi nam" ... Because "hai muoi nam" would sound like "20 years"
"hai muoi nam nam" would sound like you stuttered at "years"
202.92.35.71 (talk) 03:35, 4 October 2010 (UTC)
Picture version of font
editThe Quoc Ngu font is not very common on computers. What are the chances that someone who actually has a hold of it to make a picture of the basic characters involved for upload. It'd be interesting to see. Steewi (talk) 02:21, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
- Pictures for what—the names of all the numbers? I think there are too many to make pictures for each. For pictures of what quoc ngu looks like in general, I think that would be more appropriate at the quoc ngu and Vietnamese language articles. rʨanaɢ talk/contribs 02:33, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
- I don't know what you might be after, but if you were looking for help regarding what Quoc Ngu is supposed to appear like, however do not have display support on your PC, there is File:越南語字符測試.jpg taken from Help:Multilingual support (East Asian). Hope that helps. -- 李博杰 | —Talk contribs email 06:19, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
Article is confusing and garbles concepts
editThis article is confusingly written, and is written from what might be called a rather 'strained' viewpoint.
For instance:
In the Vietnamese language there are two sets of numeric systems, based on the Native Vietnamese and Sino-Vietnamese names of numbers.
This sets the stage for the confusion that follows by presenting what appear to be two rigidly separated, mutually exclusive systems, one of which is "in everyday use", one of which is not. If it's not in "everyday use", exactly when is it used? No coherent explanation is given.
Numbers from 1 to 1000 are still usually expressed in the Vietnamese system, and only a few numbers (such as 1,000,000, triệu) are expressed in the Chinese system.
The rigid division into systems is what causes the problems here. Why rigidly present Vietnamese numbers as two systems? In fact, if you look at the so-called "Han-Nom column", you'll find the mixed form một triệu, instead of the correct nhất triệu. Why not simply say that borrowed Chinese terms are used as part of the modern numbering system for numbers one million and above? It's the rigid insistence on creating two mutually exclusive systems (even though the tables fail to follow them correctly!) that makes the article so strained. Unless you know Vietnamese it's impossible to tell exactly what's going on here.
In the Vietnamese writing system, numbers from each system may be written in two ways.
This is totally inaccurate. Numbers from each "system" may NOT be written in two ways. Han-Nom is essentially dead in modern Vietnamese. The Han-Nom should be relegated to a less conspicuous position. It shouldn't occupy pride of place in the article, as it does now. This kind of revivalism really makes it difficult to write an article that reflects modern usage.
The different meaning of 兆 in Vietnamese and Chinese hinges on the use of Han-Nom as a pivot. Why not simply say, for instance, that the Vietnamese word triệu was borrowed from Chinese and reflects the ancient Chinese meaning. In modern Chinese, the word 兆 (zhào), which is the source of the Vietnamese term, is now used for xxx in Taiwan and xxx in Mainland China"?
Since Vietnamese is not written with Han-Nom any more, the confusion (which is described in a very confusing manner here) largely goes away. Instead of equating Han-Nom 兆 to Chinese 兆, why not equate triệu to 百万 (million)? That's how it really works. The article presents the historical background (written in Han-Nom!) as though it were the modern language. If the modern Vietnamese system were presented as a blend of the two systems, with Han-Nom presented for reference purposes, much of the current confusion could have been averted.
The Sino-Viet "bách／百" is commonly used as a morpheme (in compound words), and is rarely used in the field of mathematics as a digit.
This is garbled nonsense. What is a "morpheme" in a compound word? Digits are also "morphemes". The distinction between "morpheme in compound words" and "digits" is linguistically invalid and makes no sense to anyone who doesn't know Vietnamese.