Talk:Waltz in A minor (Chopin, rediscovered in 2024)

Wrongly quoted the dimensions of the manuscript.

The source uses mm for the dimensions of the manuscript but the wiki article uses cm. 2607:FEA8:4B6F:5400:40D:9E3B:94FF:2DC7 (talk) 04:59, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Oops, my mistake... shall fix in the next few minutes, Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk) 09:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Did you know nomination

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Manuscript in the Morgan Library & Museum

• ... that the discovery of a new waltz by Chopin (pictured) has been announced by The New York Times?

• Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/27/arts/music/chopin-waltz-discovery.html

• Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/PY Ta 641

Created by Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk). Number of QPQs required: 1. Nominator has 66 past nominations.

Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk) 11:19, 31 October 2024 (UTC).

• Note to DYK reviewer: article was moved per talk page discussion ("Title"). I have tried my best to update the templates; there seems to be no need to move this DYK subpage itself. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 13:11, 1 November 2024 (UTC)
• New enough, long enough and well-written. The hook is good and supported by an inline citation to a reliable source (in fact, the rediscovery has been reported quite widely in civilised media). QPQ has been made and copyright tag of the image is fine. There should be no problems. One thing to watch out for before promoting would perhaps be if there are any major updates to the article between the review and the posting, considering it is a bit of a developing story. Nice article, great piece for DYK. Kind regards, Yakikaki (talk) 15:21, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

"Shifting seconds"

I doubt that the "shifting seconds" accompaniment means shifting by time (seconds) as it does not make sense to me and it is more likely shifting melodies by a second interval. Any comments on this?ChopinChemist^Talk? 17:04, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Agreed (the article currently links "seconds" to Interval (music)#Interval number and quality), Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk) 17:30, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Title

I don't think this title is correct. Every source refers to it as a "waltz", and "valse" is just a tempo indication. It's hard to think of a better title though. Jasper Deng (talk) 00:15, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Maculosae tegmine lyncis, could you link the sources that call the piece fr:Valse? As far as I know, WP:COMMONNAME prefers the name that is most commonly used (as determined by its prevalence in a significant majority of independent, reliable, English-language sources. FWIW, my experience matches Jasper Deng's: the English-language publications I've seen so far call this a "waltz". Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 03:52, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

The top left of the image linked in the article is the source. "Valse" is French—and an English alternative—for "waltz" (the piece is said to date from Chopin's Paris years); you could interpret either as a musical form or tempo indication. Do you have a source stating/proving this is a tempo indication not a title? If you wish to change the title, how do you propose to different the article title from Waltz in A minor (Chopin)? Thank you, Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk) 05:43, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

When sources say it's a "waltz", we use the terminology they use, just like the rook in chess is called that instead of "castle". Concluding that the title in English should be "valse" is patently WP:OR. One alternative is to turn Waltz in A minor (Chopin) into a disambiguation page and title this page Waltz in A minor (Chopin, discovered in 2024) (or something similar and more concise) and the other one Waltz no. 19 (Chopin).--Jasper Deng (talk) 05:49, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Am struggling with the NYT (the source that announced the story) paywall, but per the Google snippet 'The piece was marked "Valse," or waltz'. Marked. Not "a tempo indication". It is announced as a waltz, but has the legend "Valse", Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk) 06:03, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

That doesn't matter. Especially with regard to naming, the governing policy is WP:COMMONNAME, and the opinion of reliable WP:SECONDARY sources matters more than what the primary source says. "Marked" can still mean a tempo indication, such as "this movement is marked allegro", and String Quartet No. 13 (Beethoven) includes a similar sentence about the replacement finale.--Jasper Deng (talk) 06:18, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Feel free to move the page (though, in terms of title, I think it may have been "discovered" by the curatorial staff in 2019, while (from recollection of the NYT article) the previous owner's son knew of it long before, and only just announced to the public), Maculosae tegmine lyncis (talk) 06:26, 1 November 2024 (UTC)