Talk:Whiteboard/Archives/2012

Repeated Vandalism

This article has repeatedly been the target of vandalism, possibly as a result of its title. Semiprotection might be a good idea. --208.71.62.24 (talk) 21:04, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Waste, cost & environmental concerns

I am not familiar with whiteboards myself since my school still used chalkboards, but I was thinking (correct me if I'm wrong) that whiteboards, or rather the pens used with whiteboards, produce much more waste than chalkboards, don't they? The pens are more expensive than chalk, can't be refilled afaik and usually get thrown away after they are used up. Some pens can probably be refilled if you buy special ink from the manufacturer, but that is still much more of a hassle and more expensive than using chalk. Also, what about the environmental issues involved? Disposing of the plastic and chemicals in old pens is probably a factor, isn't it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.15.105.61 (talk) 04:50, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

You are Correct. Most people just throw them away, but they CAN be recycled. Chalk cannot. (slightly off topic but) Pencils (the wood part anyways) ...can be recycled by keeping the shavings from a pencil sharpener. Plastic pencils can be recycled. Pens can. but chalk is more like crayons... is a writing utensil that it would be nearly impossible to recycle the chalk dust and the only thing can be recycled if necessary, is the chalk dispenser. (same goes for the paper and/or plastic dispenser from the crayons) In-Correct (talk) 19:55, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

They should probably enact rules (and would NOT be too difficult for them to do so lol) requiring the markers (and pens and pencils) to be disposed separately and then recycled. It would solve the environmental concerns and it could reduce the cost of manufacturing. In-Correct (talk) 19:52, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

but there are also "Smart Bards" which are like a giant drawing pad or touch screen...which eliminates the cost and environmental concerns of markers. In-Correct (talk) 19:55, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

removing "permanent marker"

I've heard an old wifes tale that you can remove permanent marker from a white board by rubbing over the top of it with a dry erase marker. I don't know if it holds any truth (I don't have any permanent markers to test with) but it might be a good addition.

...if you write on a whiteboard with a permanent marker (eg, a vivid) you can simply remove it by tracing over the writing with an actual whiteboard pen and then erasing it as usual. Good tip since teachers always used to get permanent and whiteboard pens mixed up! --202.154.128.129 12:14, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

This isn't guaranteed, though. Dysprosia 12:59, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

It depends on the type of permanent marker. In-Correct (talk) 19:53, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

Whiteboards stink--literally

The "disadvantages" section needs to be expanded. Not only are whiteboards harder to read and less ecological, but the odor from the markers can be almost unbearable. Chalk dust did give some people problems, but for most it posed little difficulty. A significant percentage of people, on the other hand, suffer from bad reactions to dry ink pens--headaches from the chemicals being the main concern. I wonder how much cancerous stuff lurks within. And the clothing stains are no trifle, either; the old professor might have gotten chalk on his coat, but chalk, unlike dry ink, readily washes out. And the pens run out very quickly, causing both expense and inconvenience. Has anyone actually compared the costs? Just another example of hypocrisy (everyone whining about the environment but rushing out to buy the less environmentally sound junk because it's trendy) and the truism that what's "new and improved" usually isn't. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.27.73.102 (talk) 02:53, 28 April 2007 (UTC).

Funny, but no, a large piece of melamine is absolutely cheaper than a large slab of slate, painted wood, plastic rollers, or porcelain enamelled steel. And two, chalk has to be mined, processed, etc, where plastics are dirt cheap as a byproduct of massive oil production, and the ink is much more efficient by mass than chalk is for drawing. I can understand contrast issues if someone was learning with lights off, but in normal lighting conditions, whiteboards are easier on the eyes to read. How exactly are whiteboards "less ecological"? Maybe you could post some citable sources. Blackboards either use the same materials as whiteboards or materials that have to be mined from the Earth. Not really ecological. And for most people, chalk dust is SIGNIFICANTLY worse than marker smell. You can never trust anyone that claims "headaches" as a side effect, as those are clearly subjective tales. How about asthma? Chalk dust is known to massively provoke it to the point of attacks for most of asthmatics, but marker doesn't produce allergic reactions, period. And what cancer? Children have EATEN ink packs from markers for years and it has never been even linked to cancer and smelling it has also never been shown to be cancerous in anyone. And whiteboard markers DO wash out, that's the reason they use an alcohol/water mixture with erasers to ensure a better cleaning than eraser alone. The ink is water soluble, period. Markers "run out very quickly"? What about chalk?

To be honest, the main problems with whiteboards is not the whiteboards but the people who use them. Markers aren't meant to be stabbed, left without the cap, etc, and most people are just too dumb to remember to do basic things. Just like blackboards, if someone uses an abrasive cloth it's possible to ruin the perfectly smooth finish, making it impossible to clean out every little scratch that forms, making those letters etc you can still see after using liquid cleaner. But the truth is, most whiteboards are not enamel coated on steel, so it's like apples to oranges, the actually comparison of what they sell to what you get. Sure, slate might be great for blackboards, but it has to be in one piece, perfectly crafted, etc. Most blackboards they sell now are of cheaper material, not the stuff from 50s colleges. I have gone down to my local Home Depot and gotten a 8'x4' whiteboard for $12. Normal places can't even be arsed to stock the blackboards because they're just not convienent for easy application, both in terms of stuff like portability or ease of installation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.205.97.220 (talk) 22:36, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Ah yes. So chalk dust is SIGNIFICANTLY worse than marker inks. Kids have EATEN marker pens for years, which of course makes them absolutely safe. I don't suppose you have any citable sources for *your* claims? All whiteboards that I have used *stink*, the markers never work, can never be cleanly erased and I end up with stained clothes (I don't have laundry facilities in my office, do you?) Sure, I'm probably simply to dumb to use them. But a product that cannot be used by the average academic is not fit for the market. I wonder how long the fad lasts.213.160.108.26 (talk) 16:01, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Based on your own description, and to answer your question with honesty, ... yes you probably are "simply to dumb" to use the markers. (and notice your In-Correct use of "to"...you should have used "too") I mean... Stained Clothes?! Really?! Keep a bottle of alcohol, a bottle of Windex, and cleaning cloths handy. Dry Erase markers are NOT that hard to use! "Fad"?! They are here to stay in comparrison to chalk boards. Their only threat is Smart Boards. In-Correct (talk) 20:05, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

Harder to read?

The statement that whiteboards can be harder to read or can pose problems to people with vision impairments puzzles me. I have very poor vision and find whiteboards far easier to read than chalkboards due to the sharp contrast between the dark ink and white background. The contrast of chalkboards is horrid by comparison. ::Travis Evans 07:57, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

There is a difference in contrast between white-on-black and black-on-white? How come? --Tango 16:23, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

The reason is in bright light, whiteboards are easier to read because the black/dark ink contrasts with the bright surroundings. For blackboards, it goes from room brightness, to black/gray to lighter again. From a distance, you eyes adjust (dilate) to the dark board you're staring it, with the result being the rest of the room is brighter, making a sharper brightness difference. However, if you're up close, there's no problem, most of your vision is dark. I think the "ease of reading" issues (for whiteboards) is not by the people who are actually forced to read them but by the people who have to write on them. (whiteboards are one of the purest forms of white, they're highly reflective, etc) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.205.97.220 (talk) 22:43, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I don't know about anyone else, but whiteboards especially when used with low-quality/low ink and the use of multiple colors is very hard to read. Blackboards are much easier on my eyes although I have mainly seen the green style boards. This is just my observation while I have used the boards which is on a daily basis, and my eye sight isn't the greatest either. Jinothius (talk) 10:19, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

White boards are much easier to read, whether the lights are on or off. On the other hand. Chalk Boards, especially dusty ones, are VERY difficult to read, and almost impossible to read with the lights turned off. In-Correct (talk) 20:07, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

Using solvents (like lacquer thinner) will damage whiteboard surface (urban myth?)

We regularly use lacquer thinner to clean our whiteboards. There are some people who strongly believe that using a solvent like that will dammage the glossy surface of the board and make it harder to erase new marks.

My observation or theory is that markings left on a white board over time (days, weeks, etc) are always hard to remove - even when using the proper marker type (dry erase or white-board specific markers) regardless if the board has been previously cleaned with a solvent like lacquer thinner.

Does anyone know the truth?

Is there a time-limit after which dry-erase markings are know to be hard to remove from a white-board?

Is the surface of a white-board irreversably damaged or changed if a solvent like lacquer thinner is used to clean it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.10.130.47 (talk) 17:25, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

The whiteboard is probably fine, but lacquer thinner is likely damaging to the health of your audience. Typically these things are only to be used in well ventilated areas. Not that that matters.213.160.108.26 (talk) 16:05, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

You are taking the sheen off the board and in turn if it is a melamine board, making the board more porous. In turn, you will get more ghosting.--208.124.214.194 (talk) 22:02, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Lacquer Thinner?! Why would you ever need to use Lacquer Thinner?! The markers are non-toxic now, but Laquer Thinner is not. And even on lowest quality marker boards it is true you can't leave writing on the boards for extended amounts of time. I recommend blue markers instead of black ones because black markers are usually much lower quality and much more difficult to clean. Alcohol, and Windex ...are sufficient to clean. and are much less toxic than laquer thinner. In-Correct (talk) 20:11, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

Mary Tyler Moore, Murphy Brown

Doubt there is any place in the article for this right now... but if there are any questions of when whiteboards came into existence, all they have to do is watch Murphy Brown, dating them back to 1988. Even more shocking... there is an "assignments" whiteboard that is on Mary Tyler Moore!! This dates them back to 1970. This whiteboard is to the right of the coffee machine of the newsroom. In other words it is usually off screen, but it is there. Look for it in several episodes, such as "Sue Ann Gets The Ax". In-Correct (talk) 20:15, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

History Section

If it was created by a Korean War veteran, how did the first whiteboards "begin to appear on the market" in the "mid-1920's?" I'm sure that's a mistake, but not sure what the correct date is. --98.211.24.255 (talk)

Whiteboard paint

In the 'surface materials' section, how about a mention of whiteboard paint, such as IdeaPaint? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IdeaPaint) They can be used to turn any smooth surface into a whiteboard. 152.51.56.1 (talk) 14:42, 31 December 2012 (UTC)