Talk:ZIP Code/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Mr. Zip

Mention Mr. Zip? --Daniel C. Boyer — Preceding undated comment added 13:47, 12 August 2002

Obviously before my time. Description? Years? In movies? On TV? In school educational films? What? --Brion — Preceding undated comment added 13:53, 12 August 2002

See external link. --Daniel C. Boyer — Preceding undated comment added 08:44, 13 August 2002

Concord

"In general, zip codes have no intrinsic meaning; however, the area around Concord, Massachusetts? has the zip code 01776." -- what is meaningful about the number 01776? -- Tarquin 09:37 Oct 8, 2002 (UTC)

If I'm correct (I'm not an American), Concord's one of the places where the American Revolution began, and in 1776, the Declaration of Independence was signed. Jeronimo — Preceding undated comment added 10:50, 8 October 2002

• • Correct, and noted in article

dml — Preceding undated comment added 13:38, 8 October 2002

Removed the following from article:

• In general, ZIP codes have no intrinsic meaning; however, the area around Concord, Massachusetts has the ZIP code 01776, representing the year of America's Declaration of Independence, as theBattle of Lexington and Concord was one of the opening battles of the American Revolutionary War (though it took place in April 1775).

Actually, Concord's zip is 01742; Sudbury (6 miles away)is 01776 and Wayland (8 miles away) is 01778. However, these predate ZIP codes. Concord's post office was "Boston 42, Mass." or sometimes "Boston 42, Mass." and Sudbury was "Boston 76, Mass." or sometimes "Boston 76, Mass." -- Bcorr 19:58, 1 Oct 2003 (UTC)

I am a resident of Sudbury where the zip code is 01776 and I was brought up being told that Sudbury was awarded the zip code 01776 because more minutemen that fought in the Battle of Concord in the American War of Independence came from Sudbury than any other town. If somebody wishes to add this to the article then they can.--WarrenPorter 01:51, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

"Secret White House ZIP Code"

Source of the "secret White House ZIP Code" bit, anyone? -Penta 04:30, 21 May 2004 (UTC)

• It's mentioned in a deposition from Travelgate: [1] (text search for "zip code"), assuming that transcript is legitimate -- saying that the President is informed of his private zip code upon taking office. There is also the text of a speech by President Clinton ([2]) where he explicitly mentions the special zip code that he has given out to "ordinary people that he grew up with". It was also mentioned in the media, but most of the references I found specifically mentioned President Clinton. These special ZIPs may be specific to each President, and the current President may or may not have one.
  Also, this link at whitehouse.gov[3] states that the USPS can and does create special zip codes for specific government functions, but doesn't state that the President has one.
  Even if the President does have one, there's no reason here to believe that it is a unique 5-digit ZIP; it could just be a special +4 code. Which is about as "special" as having your own post-office box. -KeithTyler 17:42, Oct 11, 2004 (UTC)

Source of abbreviations

Does anyone know the source/reasoning of the two letter state abbrieviations? I've always wondered why Iowa is IA and not IO, for example. --Feitclub 20:38, Sep 6, 2004 (UTC)

Just guessing, but that example would look a lot like the number 10, and might be avoided

for that reason. -- Coneslayer 21:43, 2005 July 13 (UTC)

The abbreviations are a hodgepodge, and in the present example, IA is the "modren" form of Ia,

in the old-style way of doing abrvtns, derived from the (still current) French style ... you use letters from the beginning and the end of the word, just enough for recognition and avoidance of ambiguity. As in "Thos" for Thomas. In normal usage, Iowa is almost too short to abbreviate. I ought to get down and write a section on this like I've been thinking about. I do recall that when these two-letter forms first came out, the Postmaster General said "They're awful. Don't use them." ;Bear 18:33, September 10, 2005 (UTC)

Postal Bar Codes

removed:

These two digits are usually the last two of the street address or box number, though non-numeric points with names or letters are assigned DP numbers by the local post office. However, when house numbers differ only by a letter suffix, e.g., 120 and 120A, the delivery point may be the same.

replaced with:

The Delivery point digits (the last two digits) are calculated based on the primary or secondary number of the address. The USPS publishes the rules for calculating the Delivery point in a document called the CASS Technical Guide.

Kenrus — Preceding undated comment added 18:07, 5 April 2006

I think there should be some mention that the Postnet barcode is obsolete and has been superceded by the Intelligent Mail Barcode (IMb) as in this WP articlehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_Mail_Barcode — Preceding unsigned comment added by64.128.46.210 (talk) 15:54, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

White House ZIP Code

The ZIP Code for the White House is 20500. It's been my understanding that the President's friends are given a special code they write on envelopes that ensures it reaches him and doesn't go into the slush pile. I read this many years ago and it was a plot point in a "West Wing" episode, as well. PedanticallySpeaking 16:49, Oct 11, 2004 (UTC)

Most of the 205xx space is taken up either by the White House or by the DC Post Office. (Oddly, 20500-20502 centers at Pennsylvania Ave, but 20509 centers on E st in the middle of the grounds.) 20528 also centers on the White House grounds. - KeithTyler 18:06, Oct 11, 2004 (UTC)

Change frequency

A new zipcode database is published every month now. I would like to know about how many zipcodes change every month, and what grace periods communities have to respond.

The answer is of interest to those of use who use the data for zipcode-based searches, and need to know how frequently it's necessary to freshen the data.

I'm personally not aware of a case where a location's ZIP codes have changed, but hopefully someone else may know of one. My expectation is that ZIP codes are mostly created for newly developed areas (and sometimes skyscrapers) but not split a la Area codes.

Actually, ZIP codes can be split or renumbered. Both of these things happened in Montgomery County, Maryland, in 1981. The new ZIP codes became effective on the day on which we were notified of them, and we were given a one-year grace period to change over.

In the past year the number of ZIP codes has decreased by about 1,000. Each month there can be hundreds of additions and removals from the ZIP code system.

There are a number of ZIP Codes that are split each year. Look in Postal Bulletins from April for examples. The number is generally a couple dozen annually. Most commonly the reason is that the existing ZIP is projected to run out of ZIP+4 Codes within the next 20 years, as there is a finite number of available values (9999), and it's considered better to split the ZIP before it's absolutely needed so as to minimize the impact on customers.

The USPS is a federally managed agency (or something), so it would seem clear that there is no grace period needed. The post office(s) in the area are aware of the ZIP code, and begin honoring it immediately.

See above. The post offices are aware of the new ZIP code, but the rest of us need time to notify others of the change, use up old stationery, and the like.

I have added a reference showing that there is in fact a grace period needed and giving a reason why. Doctor Whom 13:10, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Keep in mind that the zipcode database also includes +4 codes, which are likely added a lot more often than the base 5-digit codes.

USPS provides a flat file called ZIPMove that provides a list of changes in zip codes; this appears to be a pay service.

Keith D. Tyler [flame] 20:04, Feb 11, 2005 (UTC)

New delivery area (what the article calls "standard") ZIP Codes are implemented only on 1 July of each year, unless there is extreme political pressure brought to bear. New unique or PO Box ZIPs can be added at any time. Whether there is a "grace period" depends on what type of mail we're talking about. Single-piece First Class Mail (the 37 cent stamp) is not required to bear a ZIP Code, and I know that some customers take years to stop using their old ZIP Code. Mailers who do any sort of discount mailing are required to update their lists twice a year, so they'd catch the new ZIP on their normal update cycle.

Also, all new delivery area and PO Box ZIP Codes are announced in the "Post Offices" section of the Postal Bulletin.

ZIPMove is primarily going to report changes to ZIP codes that cause a ZIP code to be moved from one finance number to another. Typically, inter-finance number changes will not be reported in the ZIPMove file. Kenrus 21:32, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

HH?

I've been playing around with Google Earth a lot and there's an option on there to enable Postal Code Boundaries. In places such as east of Wilsonville, OR and west of Wolf Point, MT, there are ZIP code labels that end with the letters 'HH'. Does anybody know what these are or what they mean? These 'HH' numbers also appear in online ZIP infosites like city-data.com and lat-long.com, both of which offer no explaination. - Billdorr 02:20, Jul 31, 2005 (UTC)

What you are looking at are ZCTA code boundaries, not ZIP code boundaries. ZIP codes have no intrinsic geographic meaning. The ZCTA codes ending in HH represent water (Hydrographic) features[4]. 216.231.50.177 13:02, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

questions and comments

During the 1970s, there were TV ads where well-known personalities promoted use of the ZIP code, with slogans like, "Zip up your mail with the right ZIP code".

The TV series "Batman" with Adam West emphasized the ZIP code in one episode for identifying a crime location, as if the ZIP code would be relevant to visiting a location. It was a seven-digit ZIP code: 9999979!! Perhaps they were doing their bit to interest the viewing public in the ZIP code!

Does the Postal Service have a long-term proposal for expansion of the ZIP code upon exhaustion of the first three digits?

GBC 17:36, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

I don't think an exhaustion of that sort could happen unless the United Snakes were to annex more terriroty ( ;Bear 18:37, September 10, 2005 (UTC)

ZIP codes and municipal boundaries

The article includes the following:

ZIP codes and municipality boundaries may fail to match either because the ZIP code system was formed before the municipality was founded or because voters or governments have elected to move a municipal border.

I can think of situations in which both of the proffered reasons are plainly inapplicable. Does anyone have a source for all of the reasons why the boundaries do not match? Otherwise, we're just engaging in speculation, which does not belong in the article. Thanks. Doctor Whom 20:49, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Right. Probably more common than either is when areas outside the city limits of any incorporated community use a ZIP code (and town/city name) from a nearby community. My parents' house in Cedar Mill (unincorporated suburb of Portland, Oregon, more than a mile outside Portland city limits but well within the metropolitan area) has a mailing address ending in "Portland OR 97229". Not sure what to do about the article... DanielCristofani 08:48, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

The reason why the boundaries don't always match is simple. ZIP Codes are mail routes. The post office doesn't care where the city and county starts and ends. It wants to deliver the mail efficiently.Jon Miles 10:50, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Jon is right - but the implications are much greater than efficient mail delivery. The USPS assigns a single "default" place name to each ZIP code. This has three consequences:

1) That place name is elevated to the status of "city" or "town", even if it is neither. When people see "Place Name, ST 12345" in an address, the automatic assumption is that "Place Name" is an entity with a mayor, etc. If the USPS had designated "Cedar Mill" as the default place name for 97229, people would assume that is is an actual city or town - when, as Daniel points out, it is not.

2) It is readily assumed that an address is within the city limits of "Place Name" - which is problematic, because so much development in the U.S. lies outside municipal boundaries in unincorporated county areas. Again, from Daniel's example, most people will assume his parents live "in Portland" because that is what appears in their address, although they live at least a mile outside of Portland.

3) Any city or town that must share the same ZIP code with "Place Name" has second-class status. The USPS may deem other city or town names as "acceptable", but there is only one "default" place name. Since databases used by businesses associate the default place names with ZIP codes, any other place names - which may be "acceptable" - may not be recognized, and thus, for practical purposes, do not exist. For instance, you may have noticed that when giving your address to a business, they simply ask for the street address and your ZIP code, and do not ask for your city or town. The agent will simply enter the ZIP code you provide into a database, which will provide the "default" place name - which may or may not be the city or town that your address is actually in. So, if Cedar Mill were to incorporate and become an actual city, the USPS may or may not add "Cedar Mill" as an "acceptable" place name for 97229 (it currently is not acceptable). But even if it did, since "Portland" would remain the "default" place name, people would continue to use "Portland" and would assume that the address is in that city, even though it would actually be in the new city of Cedar Mill. People making a point to write "Cedar Mill, OR 97229" as their address would be going against the grain and would encounter difficulties - some businesses, calling up "97229" in their database, would ask, "that's in Portland, right?" If one replied "no, it's in Cedar Mill", s/he might get the response, "there's no 'Cedar Mill' here, are you sure that's right?" A possible solution would be to make "Cedar Mill" the "default" place name for 97229 - but the USPS rarely changes the "default" place names - and would not in this case if part of 97229 and the 97229 post office does lie within the Portland city limits. As a result, the City of Cedar Mill would have little "legitimacy" and most people would have no idea that it exists.

This situation is one of my pet peeves - the USPS should not have the power to define boundaries and political entities, but de facto, it does. Citizens should decide how local government should be set up, and postal designations should reflect them - not the other way around. With today's technology, GIS, and nine-digit ZIP codes, we should not have these problems. The "default" place name for an address should always be the actual place the address is in.

I edited the article a few weeks ago raising some of these issues. An entire article could be written with examples from around the country where the USPS ZIP code boundaries and designations create confusion and distort how things really are.

Denvoran 18:59, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Just to add some information.

Override City Name - A ZIP+4 record on the USPS database is associated with a specific last line (Place Name/State). If this association is different than the general association with the 5 digit ZIP, then this is deemed an override and is suppossed to take precedence.

So, if the default city name for the ZIP 11111 is "BIG CITY", but "1 MAIN ST" has a ZIP+4 of "11111-0001" and this is actually in "LITTLE SUBURB", then software is suppossed to use "LITTLE SUBURB" as the printed name on the mail piece.

Ofcourse this all depends on the local AMS office coding the specific ZIP+4 records with the override city name. Kenrus 21:27, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

What about advertisements. Some advertisers use the discrepencies between zip code addresses and geographical areas to lie to their audience in order to gain an advantagein their bottom line. Example #1: A radio advertisement in San Diego County, CA says "New homes for sale in beautiful Pine Valley." In fact, these homes are located in Live Oak Springs which is 20 miles and 4 towns away from Pine Valley. Many locals consider Pine Valley a desireable place to live, with barely an acceptable commute time average of about 45 minutes to the San Diego area and Live Oak Springs is 20 miles farther out of town. The prices advertised would be a great deal in Pine Valley, but not in Live Oak Springs. You can't convince me that these developers actually think that the properties they are selling are located in Pine Valley. These developers are falsely advertising their product and the USPS is enabling them to do so as the ZIP Code says Pine Valley. The mailing address would be the only thing the developers could point to in their defense. Example #2: When reading the local classified ads for rentals, I find a common practice is to list homes in the area known locally as Paradise Hills (higher crime/lower property value area of the city of San Diego) as Bonita (lower crime/ higher property value unincorporated area of San Diego County. These are just 2 small examples of what is going on all over the San Diego area. The USPS enables this by giving both areas a common ZIP Code and the name of one area. I believe most, if not all of the property owners and devlopers know exactly what city their property is located in. These people just play dumb to increase their profit by increasing the numbers of responses they get to an ad which is a lie that gets a little help from the USPS. If the USPS just looks at the Zip Code, then the name of the city should be allowed to be accurate. This practice by the USPS serves to confuse many people. There are many out there that don't even know what city they even live in. Property owners should not be confused as property deeds don't reflect an abstract mailing address, but a real, accurate, legal location. It seems to me that the ZIP Code tells the USPS the default city name that they have designated. To also require that default city's name in the address would seem to be redundant. If the Zip tells the city, then why do we even write a city in the address? The only explanation I can think of is that there is more to a ZIP Code than mail. I'm not really a conspiracy theorist, but something tells me there is more going on with ZIP Codes than sorting the mail. Someone, somewhere is or has gained in money, power or politics because of the needless confusion created by the USPS ZIP Code system. Typical government. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.244.42.49 (talk) 18:05, 17 February 2007

Well, I suspect the prospective property owner eventually finds out where his property is, and not too late to back out of the deal. What you mention has little to do with ZIP codes, but has been a real estate practice for many years. And as you say, the city and state are unnecessary, but they are a useful doublecheck in case of error in the ZIP code, so they remain in the mailing standards. To test this, when the ZIP+4 came in, Linn's Stamp News sent mail from across the country to its unique ZIP+4 addressing it without city or state, and most, if not all, got through just fine.--Wehwalt 18:20, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Trademark

"ZIP Code was originally registered as a trademark by the U.S. Postal Service, but its registration has since expired." Cite for this? My understanding is that trademarks don't expire; many have been in use for far longer than this, e.g. Coca-Cola or Bass Ale. —Michael Shields 00:56, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

U.S. trademark registrations have to be renewed periodically (15 U.S.C. § 1059). The status of trademark registrations can be searched here. Doctor Whom 16:53, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

I have confirmed this, USPS allowed its registration of "Zip Code®" as a trademark to expire.. I placed the link to the Patent & Trademark Office record for the Postal Service's registration of Zip Code in the article where this has been mentioned; PTO has the record as "DEAD", i.e. expired. Paul Robinson 18:22, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Removed:

Unusually, localities are assigned ZIP Codes which do not match the rest of their state's. This is when a locality is so isolated that it is served from a sectional center in another state. For example, Fishers Island, NY bears the ZIP Code 06390 and is served from Connecticut--all other New York ZIP Codes (excepting those at Holtsville for the IRS begin with "1".

This paragraph appeared twice. I removed one instance of it (left it in where it better fits)

Jefs 18:07, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

SCF?

Should this article talk about SCF -- "Section Center Facilities" -- Codes? They are the first 3 digits in a Zip code, and I believe that every SCF has a routing office. -- Ben M — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.128.179.20 (talk) 17:16, 30 May 2006

Good Article nomination has failed

The Good article nomination for ZIP Code/Archive 1 has failed, for the following reason:

(No references) SeizureDog 13:58, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Lowest ZIP code?

I can find references to a series of ZIP codes, 00210 through 00215, that were/are used in Portsmouth, NH, for the annual immmigrant visa lottery. But all the web references to this are from several years ago, and I suspect the program may be conducted electronically now. Does anyone know whether those ZIP codes still exist? If they do, they'd be the lowest ZIP codes, instead of the IRS one that's currently listed. -- JustSayin 20:18, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

The USPS online database doesn't list them, so I gather that they no longer exist. Doctor Whom 01:36, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

It appears to me that federal lands such as National Parks and Wildlife Refuges have (at least nominally speaking) ZIP codes beginning from the very beginning - i.e. 00001 - The North Dillingham Census Area, Alaska; 00002 - Yukon Flats National Wildlife Refuge; 00003 - Alaska Peninsula National Wildlife Refuge; etc. I'm guessing however that perhaps these are only for unpopulated areas: Yosemite National Park has a "real" ZIP of 95389, but also a degenerate ZIP 00058. See This Map derived from The US Census Bureau's Tiger Database.User:Middleforkmaps — Preceding undated comment added 06:22, 26 January 2007

REPLY: I believe the lowest ZIP code is 01001 in Agawam, MA (I used to live there). And the highest 99950 is Ketchikan, AK (I was curious). — Precedingunsigned comment added by 108.12.227.200 (talk) 07:38, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

State ZIP code lists

Wouldn't it be more helpful if the State links in this article pointed to the lists of ZIP codes in the states? I.e. if I click the "Illinois" link next to the map, I should be directed to a list of ZIP codes in Illinois, and not the general article on Illinois? Mtford 09:21, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

ZIP+4 lookup

Does anyone know some web service where people can search ZIP+4 codes (that means including information which is determined by last four digits)? Link to that service would be fine there... Jakub Horky62.24.71.47 10:28, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

This section on Zip+4 should be moved to later in the article after explaining how zip itself is described. —Preceding unsigned comment added byDaqingzhao (talk • contribs) 21:03, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Pop culture

Which zip code has the most people living it in? I mean receiving mail through it. I would rule out institutions, military zip codes, etc.

I've removed the following from the pop-culture section:

• The lowest numerical ZIP code (for destinations within the 50 US states, excluding unique ZIP codes) is 01001 for Agawam, Massachusetts.
• The lowest numerical ZIP code anywhere in the United States is 00601 for Adjuntas, Puerto Rico.
• The highest numerical ZIP code (for destinations within the 50 US states) is 99950 for Ketchikan, Alaska.
• To honor the tradition of the number 44 at Syracuse University, the zip code for all academic buildings was changed to 13244.{{fact}}
• The zip code for the main campus of the Ohio State University in Columbus, Ohio is 43210
• The ZIP+4 code for Dodger Stadium in Los Angeles, CA is 90090-1112

These aren't related to pop culture, and not all of them are even accurate. Doctor Whom 01:40, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Soooooooooooooooooooo WHAT?!66.97.207.39

The Zip code 99950 is for Edna Bay AK on Kosciusko Island. Ketchikan's zip code is 99901 — Preceding unsigned comment added by158.145.240.100 (talk) 00:38, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Archive 1

Archive 2