Talk:Zoie Palmer/Archive 1

Archive 1

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Entry under 'nationality' states" Canadian. But surely being born in England it would make her nationality, 'English', especially so seeing as one of her parents is English. I would also think this is the case even if Zoie obtains Canadian citizenship and gets a Canadian passport. I was born in Scotland, moved to Canada only recently, got citizenship, but I am still of Scottish nationality. 68.144.89.68 (talk) 05:18, 5 March 2012 (UTC)

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Unless anyone objects, Zoie's nationality is being changed to 'English', and 'Born' to 'England, UK' as putting 'UK', speaking as a Brit, would be akin to putting 'South America' for someone born in Chile. The UK is a union of countries, so putting "UK" isnt really accurate. Cheers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.144.89.68 (talk • contribs) 05:23, 5 March 2012 (UTC)

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When editors don't know the importance of, and purpose for, adding sources to an article, it can create disorder and be counter-productive. For those who are not familiar with citing sources, these are Wikipedia's "why" and "how":

Help:Referencing_for_beginners

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Pyxis Solitary (talk) 10:55, 24 March 2014 (UTC)

Clean-up edits of content and of filmography template

Wikipedia has manuals of style with guidelines that need to be followed. Body content had reference sources appearing twice in different areas when only one citation was sufficient. Reference sources are not included in the template. Finally, it is incorrect to say that Zoie Palmer "came out as LGBT" when it is well known that she has been partners with a woman for many years. Two women together as partners/spouses = lesbian relationship. There is absolutely nothing wrong in recognizing what she is for what it is. Pyxis Solitary (talk) 06:57, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Outness means something different when it pertains to a public figure than it does when it pertains to a private citizen. She may have been well-known to industry insiders and her own family as having been in a relationship with a woman, but her relationship with Alex Lalonde was not general, public knowledge that had been noted on the record in any media coverage of her — no reliable media outlet in existence reported on her relationship with Alex Lalonde prior to the time in 2014 when she explicitly thanked Alex Lalonde in her award acceptance speech. Her private life is a different matter, because a public figure can be completely out in her private life, yet not out in the sense that's relevant to an encyclopedia — until she puts it on the record as a facet of her public life and career in a public forum, she's not "out" in the relevant sense regardless of how she's living her private life behind the scenes. Bearcat (talk) 01:31, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Why punish everyone else for the behavior of a persistent vandal?

Instead of putting an Admin-only protection level on the article you should be putting a block on User:Correctfact. This registered user is a vandal. He has proven by repeated actions that he has no respect for Wikipedia guidelines and the biographical subject. He will return to vandalize the article again after the protection level expires. I am the Admin of the Lost Girl Wiki and I block vandals, registered and anonymous, from having access to the wiki. I don't penalize other registered editors because of the actions of one asshole. Pyxis Solitary (talk) 09:08, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

Correctfact had not been warned sufficiently prior to Bearcat protecting the article, which was done to prevent further violations. Protecting biographies of living persons is more important than editorial convenience so the protection seems justified. Bearcat has warned Correctfact and I've thrown my two cents worth in as well. If he/she edits again without discussing then Bearcat is well justified in blocking Correctfact. --AussieLegend (✉) 10:12, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for responding to this matter. Pyxis Solitary (talk) 22:25, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

Please show me a tertiary reference for where she is the parent of the child? The child has two equally involved parents. End of story. If Zoie and her partner were married then she would have a step son, not being married doesn't make you the parent? I missed all the anger in the messages... so here it is. Base your anger on facts. I find it more outrageous you discredit his actual parents of which he has two. Zoie might be a great role model or step mother figure but the fact is she is not his adoptive mother, his step mother, actual mother etc. So if you can find a label that actually fits then use that. Sorry folks this category doesn't fit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Correctfact (talk • contribs) 10:30, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

We don't use tertiary sources, secondary sources are preferred and there is one in the article confirming the son. There are other sources as well.[1] Your persistent edit-warring over this is inappropriate. . --AussieLegend (✉) 12:28, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

At the time I looked at the article, there are three references that Zoie and Alex have a son called Luca. There are no references in the article or this talk page that Luca has any other "equally involved parents", nor precisely what the legal status of the partner relationship between Zoie and Alex is. --Scott Davis ^Talk 13:18, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

Two suggestions - we should remove the name of the son as he is clearly not notable so the name is not required (I am sure we have guideline on that) and perhaps we should just add a note to say that he is the the child of Alex Lolande by a previous relationship which is what the references say. MilborneOne (talk)

I firmly agree that we should have a rule about not giving the names of an article subject's kids in most cases. And not even just for minors, either — even when a topic's children have actually reached adulthood, we still have no real reason to actually care about their names unless they've also attained enough independent notability for their own separate Wikipedia articles. But the only rule we actually have, at WP:BLPNAME, is that we can't give it if it isn't supported by a reliable source. If it is sourced, however, then there's no prohibition on it.

That said, I have no objection here to not including the kid's name; it's not widely reported, as it wasn't the subject of a "pregnant celebrity" media frenzy. So it's not information anybody needs to know.

And if the sources do say that the kid is Alex's child by a previous relationship, then I have no objection to acknoweldging that either. Bearcat (talk) 15:30, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

The biographical subject herself said her son's name, on stage, before a national and international television audience:
"…to my incredible partner, Alex, and my beautiful son, Luca."
Zoie Palmer thanks partner and son at the Canadian Screen Awards
http://www.afterellen.com/tv/211987-zoie-palmer-thanks-partner-and-son-at-the-canadian-screen-actors-awards
AnnaSilk & ZoiePalmer Present @ Canadian Screen Awards 2014
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5Aqc5ZMfak
Pyxis Solitary (talk) 05:52, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

I'm a tad confused about this edit by Nomoskedasticity where he/she says "I think the source says that the son is from *Palmer's* previous relationship". There are 3 sources:

1. they have a son, Luca, who is thought to be Alex’s from a previous relationship - Clearly, this implies that the boy is from Alex Lalonde's previous relationship.
2. thanked, among others, her incredible partner Alex and beautiful son Luca - This doesn't imply either way
3. The son, Luca, is Lalonde's son from a previous marriage. - That fairly clearly states that the son is from Lalonde's previous relationship as well.

This being the case I'm unsure as to which source Nomoskedasticity is referring to. --AussieLegend (✉) 14:00, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, yes, you're right -- Lalonde's from a previous relationship. So, that reinforces the question originally raised about this issue: who is the child's mother, and on what basis would we write that the child is Zoie's, implying that Zoie is the child's mother? Nomoskedasticity (talk) 14:44, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Nothing wrong with the current statment "They have a son (from Lalonde's previous marriage" which doesnt imply anything and matches the sources given, probably time we can close this now. MilborneOne (talk) 15:41, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Can we keep the personal bias (acknowledged or not) out of this? Zoie Palmer stated in public that she has a son. She revealed his name in a public setting. Articles about Alex Lalonde & Zoie Palmer DO NOT corroborate the allegation that Alex Lalonde was "married" when she became pregnant and gave birth to her son. Lalonde could have become pregnant through artificial insemination (as many lesbians have chosen to do). Lalonde and Palmer could have already been together when Lalonde became pregnant. Palmer calling Lalonde her "partner" does not translate into their not being formally married. They are Canadians and Canada legalized same-sex marriage in 2005. Zoie Palmer and Alex Lalonde were a couple before Palmer became popular for her work on Lost Girl. If Zoie Palmer says she has a son ... then Zoie Palmer has a son. The "father" of their son, if it was more than a sperm donor, is immaterial. Pyxis Solitary (talk) 23:42, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 May 2016

Add {{Pp-semi}} template.

--186.84.46.227 (talk) 20:37, 21 May 2016 (UTC)

Done clpo13_(talk) 20:47, 21 May 2016 (UTC)

Infobox image added October 29

It's one thing to change the photo in a biographical infobox for a new one, but it's entirely another story to exchange it for one that is obviously unflattering. Wikipedia is not a supermarket tabloid. It's not The National Enquirer and The Sun were celebrities are mocked with photography. I think we need to reach consensus about the acceptability of the new photo: Revision as of 23:02, October 29, 2017. Pyxis Solitary talk 13:04, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

I agree it should be removed. Don't think good intention was behind it. 2001:4B98:DC0:47:216:3EFF:FE3D:888C (talk) 00:01, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 August 2020

Now she is single and asked me to edit her page. Roudy1966 (talk) 05:29, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. – Thjarkur (talk) 08:57, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 October 2020

Change Zoie's status to single. She is now separated from Alex Lalonde and is single. Zeeepers (talk) 01:16, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 02:12, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Inclusion of disputed content regarding sexuality

{{BLP noticeboard}}

Specifically, the discussion entails retaining the content about Palmer and Alex Lalonde and, thus, her sexual orientation. Pyxis Solitary (yak). L not Q. 20:53, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

Podcast interview from May, 2017 with Zoie Palmer that may provide clarification

https://www.firecrackerdepartment.com/firecrackerdepartment/2017/5/16/zoie-palmer

I'm providing this information as an FYI only. It's up to the expert contributors here at Wikipedia to decide what information should or should not be included in Zoie Palmer's page.

I'm sure a lot of celebrities/actors request material be changed on their page they perceive as being negative (e.g., drunk driving conviction, details about why they were removed from a production, etc.) as well as positive events (details about personal life such as marriage, children being born, productions they may be attached to, awards they've won, etc.). And I'm sure Wikipedia has a policy regarding who can dictate content and entries in this area.

I know for a fact that as a scientist in a specific academic field I cannot personally make changes to a page that includes references to my own scientific work as I'm seen as a "biased" source. I’ve never requested changes to be made either. I get why, this is how it works and I accept that.

The actual interview with Zoie starts at about 7:30 minutes in, I think her daughter is first mentioned by name at 8:15 (and that she's never spoken publicly about her) and her daughter is mentioned again around the 15:30 mark. Zoie refers to her female partner at about 16:00 minutes in. Around 29:00 minutes Zoie states she was born in England, at 32:00 minutes in she provides background information (e.g., career) about father, mother, sister, and around 48:30 she mentions that she first met Alex (female partner) at an awards ceremony.

At about the 51:20 mark she discusses being out publicly, that is, she's never spoken about it and she struggles with assumptions regarding her sexuality. At about 52:20 she states she may or may not be gay. She does not go on further to clarify or identify (e.g., by stating she's bisexual). At the 54:10 mark she says she may end up with with a guy in the future.

With respect to the statement that she made at the CSA Awards thanking Alex she notes that the straight community basically did not pay attention but the LGBTQ community immediately announced she'd come out (55:10 mark). She describes this as the LGBTQ community basically "shooting itself in the foot" (I believe) by making this declaration.

I hope you find this information to be of use.

SugarScientist (talk) 20:08, 7 November 2020 (UTC)