- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 06:10, 28 March 2017 (UTC)
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Claudia Mahnke
edit- ... that mezzo-soprano Claudia Mahnke appeared as Dido in Les Troyens by Berlioz, and portrayed according to a reviewer in the final 25 minutes all stages from hurt vulnerability to furious despair?
- Comment: review will follow
Created by Gerda Arendt (talk). Self-nominated at 23:02, 23 March 2017 (UTC).
New enough (well, a couple of hours over if we're being really picky but I'll let that slide), long enough (just), AGF-ing that the sources say what they're claimed to say (as I have no idea what the German for "hurt vulnerability" is), and AGF-ing that the appropriate QPQ review will be done (it hasn't been done yet at the time of writing). There are a few things which I'd consider glaring omissions from the article, most significantly her age, (and I'd advise saying where Meerane is given that I doubt most Germans know, let alone the US/UK/Aus readers who make up en-wiki's readership), but DYK isn't peer review. I would strongly suggest rewording it to:
- ALT1 ... that mezzo-soprano Claudia Mahnke appeared as Dido in Les Troyens by Berlioz, and according to a reviewer in the final 25 minutes convincingly portrayed the progression from hurt vulnerability to furious despair?
- as "stages" to me implies a series of steps, rather than gradual deterioration. While I suspect Fram or TRM will turn up to shout at me for approving this, as this is essentially just saying "She did the job she was hired to do", there's no more obviously eye-catching hook jumping out at me. Good to go once the QPQ requirement has been met. ‑ Iridescent 17:35, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Reviewed: Selina Rushbrook. I am not sure if progression is the right term, nor would "steps" be, she is torn back and forth, but that's probably to complicated for a short hook, nor is it sourced to a better source than myself ;) - the original German review is in the source: "Berlioz hat Dido da eine 25minütige Finalszene komponiert, in der sie alle Stufen der schmerzlichen Verletztheit und der wütenden Verzweiflung bis hin zum Selbstmord auf dem Scheiterhaufen durchläuft", including suicide also. Google says "Berlioz has composed a 25-minute finale scene, in which she runs through all the stages of painful hurt and angry despair to suicide on the pyre", but that's a bit harmless, - "schmerzlich" is not "schmerzhaft", it's rather rather the "dolorosa" of the Stabat Mater, "verletzt" means "injured", angry is "ärgerlich", but "wütend" is stronger, "infuriated?" --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:23, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Would "all the emotions from agony to furious despair" work? My only issue with "stages" is that it implies some kind of linear progression ("stage 1: discomfort and irritation, stage 2: pain and anger, stage 3: agony and fury"), which is misleading. (Because the Kübler-Ross model has such a hold in popular culture, in the context of suicide people are immediately going to associate "stages" with it.) ‑ Iridescent 20:34, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Good idea, emotions, but not happy with agony, - any better term for an injured soul= - She has some very introverted moments. Limits of my English reached ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:17, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- "Anguished" or "tormented"? What word you use really depends on how much of an emotional wretchedness/physical torture ratio you want to convey. ‑ Iridescent 21:23, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Thanks, learning. "Tormented" is good, but not in the review. Trying differently, leaving the reviewers wording behind, - the audience agreed:
- ALT2... that mezzo-soprano Claudia Mahnke appeared as Dido in Les Troyens by Berlioz, and portrayed the array of emotions of the tormented woman in the final 25 minutes convincingly?
- Better wording welcome. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:05, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- I'd approve that, but someone might complain that it technically needs an "in the opinion of a reviewer"—but including that would make the hook too long and boring. How about this very minor tweak to ALT1:
- ALT3 ... that mezzo-soprano Claudia Mahnke appeared as Dido in Les Troyens by Berlioz, and according to a reviewer in the final 25 minutes convincingly ranged from hurt vulnerability to furious despair?
- That appears to be in keeping with the original review, and shaves off a few more characters. ‑ Iridescent 22:11, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- I like it, thank you! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:45, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- I'd approve that, but someone might complain that it technically needs an "in the opinion of a reviewer"—but including that would make the hook too long and boring. How about this very minor tweak to ALT1:
- "Anguished" or "tormented"? What word you use really depends on how much of an emotional wretchedness/physical torture ratio you want to convey. ‑ Iridescent 21:23, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Good idea, emotions, but not happy with agony, - any better term for an injured soul= - She has some very introverted moments. Limits of my English reached ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:17, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Would "all the emotions from agony to furious despair" work? My only issue with "stages" is that it implies some kind of linear progression ("stage 1: discomfort and irritation, stage 2: pain and anger, stage 3: agony and fury"), which is misleading. (Because the Kübler-Ross model has such a hold in popular culture, in the context of suicide people are immediately going to associate "stages" with it.) ‑ Iridescent 20:34, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
- Reviewed: Selina Rushbrook. I am not sure if progression is the right term, nor would "steps" be, she is torn back and forth, but that's probably to complicated for a short hook, nor is it sourced to a better source than myself ;) - the original German review is in the source: "Berlioz hat Dido da eine 25minütige Finalszene komponiert, in der sie alle Stufen der schmerzlichen Verletztheit und der wütenden Verzweiflung bis hin zum Selbstmord auf dem Scheiterhaufen durchläuft", including suicide also. Google says "Berlioz has composed a 25-minute finale scene, in which she runs through all the stages of painful hurt and angry despair to suicide on the pyre", but that's a bit harmless, - "schmerzlich" is not "schmerzhaft", it's rather rather the "dolorosa" of the Stabat Mater, "verletzt" means "injured", angry is "ärgerlich", but "wütend" is stronger, "infuriated?" --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:23, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
