Template:Did you know nominations/Ernest Graves Jr.
- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 02:23, 30 October 2019 (UTC)
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Ernest Graves Jr.
- ... that Ernest Graves Jr. was one of four generations of his family to go to West Point, all of whom graduated first or second in their class? Source: [1] (p. 276)
5x expanded by Hawkeye7 (talk). Self-nominated at 20:28, 3 October 2019 (UTC).
This is a fivefold expansion and is new enough and long enough. The hook facts are cited inline, the article is neutral and I detected no copyright or plagiarism issues. A QPQ has been done. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:24, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
- @Cwmhiraeth:@Hawkeye7: Actually, the sourcing of the hook supporting sentences in the article was somewhat problematic. Page 276 in Graves (the source originally cited and given in the nomination above) has 4 photos, with their names and West Point graduation dates, but does not explain how these people are related to the subject of the article, Ernest Graves Jr. His father, Ernest, and his son, Ralph, are mentioned in various other places in the same source, e.g. on p. ix there. But Rogers Birnie is not mentioned anywhere else in the source, and there is no explanation there of how Birnie was related to the subject. In particular, the source does not support the statement in the article "... and his maternal grandfather, Rogers Birnie ..." I have added an extra citation to that sentence, to a different source, [2], which explains in detail who Birnie was in relation to Ernest Graves Jr. I also see that Hawkeye7 rearranged the citations slightly. I think now the citations in the article do properly support the hook, but whomever promotes this nomination might want to double-check. I am also pinging the nominator and the reviewer, in case they have any extra comments. Nsk92 (talk) 20:57, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
- The hook said only that four generations of his family went to West Point, all of whom graduated first or second in their class. That is fully supported by the source I supplied in the nomination. Rogers Birnie is mentioned in the same source, on p. 243: "I have to tell you this story about my grandfather, my mother’s father, who was Colonel Rogers Birnie, a very eminent ordnance officer in his time and one of the people involved in the original concept and design of built-up guns." Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:33, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
- OK, thanks. Somehow, when I was searching through Graves, my search missed the mention of Birnie on p. 243. You are correct that the hook just says that foour generations of the family graduated from West Point as 1st or 2nd in their class. However, the hook supporting sentence in the article is more specific and says that Birnie was Graves' maternal grandfather; that sentence needed better sourcing. In any case, I think the sourcing is in good order now. Nsk92 (talk) 21:49, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
- The hook said only that four generations of his family went to West Point, all of whom graduated first or second in their class. That is fully supported by the source I supplied in the nomination. Rogers Birnie is mentioned in the same source, on p. 243: "I have to tell you this story about my grandfather, my mother’s father, who was Colonel Rogers Birnie, a very eminent ordnance officer in his time and one of the people involved in the original concept and design of built-up guns." Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:33, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
- @Cwmhiraeth:@Hawkeye7: Actually, the sourcing of the hook supporting sentences in the article was somewhat problematic. Page 276 in Graves (the source originally cited and given in the nomination above) has 4 photos, with their names and West Point graduation dates, but does not explain how these people are related to the subject of the article, Ernest Graves Jr. His father, Ernest, and his son, Ralph, are mentioned in various other places in the same source, e.g. on p. ix there. But Rogers Birnie is not mentioned anywhere else in the source, and there is no explanation there of how Birnie was related to the subject. In particular, the source does not support the statement in the article "... and his maternal grandfather, Rogers Birnie ..." I have added an extra citation to that sentence, to a different source, [2], which explains in detail who Birnie was in relation to Ernest Graves Jr. I also see that Hawkeye7 rearranged the citations slightly. I think now the citations in the article do properly support the hook, but whomever promotes this nomination might want to double-check. I am also pinging the nominator and the reviewer, in case they have any extra comments. Nsk92 (talk) 20:57, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
- Repeating the tick to clarify that the matter has been sorted. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:34, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
