Template talk:ADF Leadership

Too many 2 star officers

Currently this template includes deputy chief navy, army and airforce and a number of commanders of forces. The problem is it misses the navy systems commander, commander 1 div, commander special forces command which are all three of equal status as commander forces commander, air commander and commander aus fleet. There are also numerous other 2 star positions not mentioned see Senior Australian_Defence Organisation Positions. Perhaps it should only include 3 and 4 star positions???--TinTin (talk) 06:03, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Actually, the three Forces Commanders hold a higher position (if not rank) than the other two star positions. Limiting this template to the Deputies and the three Forces Commanders provides a good summary of the ADF leadership. It would go on forever if we listed all the Army two star positions! ;) --Oliver Nouther (talk) 06:10, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

I wonder just how many "uniformed" 2 star positions there are?

Stealing from Senior Australian Defence Organisation Positions, see below.

P.S. Please correct the table.

Comments:

• "Senior Australian Defence Organisation Positions" needs updating!
• It looks like there are about 30 two stars (?)
• It's too bloody hard to track them all down!!
• I had thought about adding all of them to the template, BUT a) It's too hard & b) It would be impossible to keep it current.

Well, I guess that means that not only you two, but me third, all agree there are too many.

("So what?" I hear you reply. "We'd already come to that conclusion.") Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:01, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

I'm afraid this is what one lets oneself in for by increasing the scope of this template, however well-intentioned that may be... ;-) When I created it (I think after discussion with Oliver or Pdf or both, it was a long time ago) it was deliberately restricted to CDF and the 3-stars. That kept it stable for quite a while. Now it's got some 2-stars, there's the risk that the flood gates will open... Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 12:09, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

I'm afraid this is what one lets oneself in for - Yes. So it would seem.

I extended it - "it seemed like a good idea at the time". Perhaps now I'm not so sure that it was such a good idea. Pdfpdf (talk) 12:52, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Table of ADF 2 stars @ April 2011

C? = May be a civilian position, not an ADF Joint position

Org	Joint	Navy	Army	Air Force
DMO	Head, Helicopter Systems Division (HHSD) Campbell Program Manager, Collins and Wedgetail (PMCW) Deeble Program Manager, New Air Combat Capability (PMNACC) Osley C? Head, Electronic Systems Division (HESD) Alward C? Head, Explosive Ordnance Division (HEOD) Klenthis C? Program Manager, Air Warfare Destroyer Cawley	Head, Maritime Systems Division (HMSD) Marshall	Head, Land Systems Division (HLSD) Cavenagh	Head, Aerospace Systems Division (HASD) Thorne
Capability Development	Head, Capability Systems (HCS) Plenty Others? - Yes - Jones (position??)
CIO	Head Information and Communications Technology Operations Milford
Intelligence	Director, Defence Intelligence Organisation (DIO) ?? Others??
Operations	Commander, Border Protection Barrett Commander, Joint Logistics (CJLOG) Staib Deputy Commander Joint Operations (DCJOPS) ?? Commander of Australian Forces in the MEAO ??
People Strategies	Head, Defence Personnel Executive (HDPE) ?? Others??
Strategy	Head Military Strategic Commitments Power
Support	Several (e.g. Liz Cosson retired? ) Commander Joint Health Alexander
Training	Commander Joint Education, Training and Warfare Goldrick
VCDF	Adviser to the VCDF on Joint Warfighting Lessons and Concepts - Jim Molan retired. Others??
DJFHQ		Who?	Commander 1Div (i.e. double hatted)	Who?
Navy		Deputy Chief of Navy (DCN) Jones Commander Australian Fleet (COMAUSFLT) Gilmore
Army			Deputy Chief of Army (DCA) Symon Commander Forces Command (CFC) Morrison Special Operations Commander, Australia (Gus Gilmore) Head of Modernisation and Strategic Planning - Army Caligari Commander, 1st Division Commander, 2nd Division
Air Force				Deputy Chief of Air Force (DCAF) Brown Air Commander Australia (ACAUST) Skidmore
Reserves	Assistant CDF (Reserves) and Head Reserve and Employer Support Division Brereton
Others	Judge Advocate General (JAG) (Tracey) Inspector-General ADF (rank?) Inspector-General (rank?)