Template talk:Committed identity topicon

UI icon

In terms of the aesthetic of the icon, I'm of the opinion that it might be better to use one of the WikimediaUI icons. The basic black one could work fine (File:OOjs UI icon key.svg), but my preference is the blue variant so that it has a bit of color to stand out (File:OOjs UI icon key-progressive.svg). Is there any reason why you went for the image you did, CJDOS? ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 04:36, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Hello, BappleBusiness. First of all, sorry—I haven't been able to attend to things for over a month, so I received your notification late. I have reverted your changes until this has been properly discussed. The brass key was fine as it was; see User:Anomie/Userbox committed identity as another example. The black key does not match the aesthetics of other top icons available for use (see navbox Template:Top icon templates), so I'm not understanding your logic. I don't know about the blue key; to my eye, it doesn't look right, either, but that's why we're discussing this. I'm not against your suggested changes if they're warranted, but I don't see the need. I will ask for more opinions. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 09:00, 8 January 2022 (UTC)

While recently looking for something unrelated, I came across File:Cryptography Barnstar.png, which incorporates Key.png, and has been public domain on Openclipart since 2013. If we ever need to consider a different key design, it is an option. I'm not trying to suggest changes, I'm just making a note here for future reference. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 19:40, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

RfC 8 January 2022

The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of this discussion was that the two editors primarily involved have reached an agreement. The RfC was extended with no further contribution, and unlikely to receive any. Therefore, Nuvola apps password.svg has been selected to be the new image for the top icon template, per voting results. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 10:15, 26 February 2022 (UTC)

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Per the discussion above, what do we think about choosing a different image for this template's top icon? Opinions on the suggested changes? Something different? Thank you for your contributions. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) — Extended. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 19:58, 26 January 2022 (UTC) (original 09:13, 8 January 2022 (UTC))

Extended: This poll has been extended for 30 days to allow time for more editors to join. Legobot will end the RfC after the extension has run out. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 19:58, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

• Question: Not intending to come across as one-sided, would BappleBusiness's proposed changes have anything to do with Wikipedia mobile view? I have become aware that top icons don't display in mobile view. Before taking a temporarily leave from Wikipedia, I had made mention of this regarding user status templates (see Template talk:Statustop#Mobile display for more info). Have there been developments that I'm not at present aware of? — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 09:51, 8 January 2022 (UTC)

  Propose the image(s) you'd recommend. I am not committed to this image. —¿philoserf? (talk) 18:46, 8 January 2022 (UTC)

  I don't think any image change is necessary, unless there has been a change in style/format that I'm not aware of, in which case I would be interested in learning more. As far as the proposed images, I'm not on board with them; I would have to look to see if there are other images before I would propose any alternates myself. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 19:26, 8 January 2022 (UTC)

  Thanks for opening the RfC, CJDOS! The image I previously recommended was File:OOjs UI icon key.svg. I chose that image because it's inline with the Wikimedia Design Style Guide (I'll note that it isn't a guideline or anything, but it is a pretty useful resource for volunteers) and is 20x20px (the top icon convention) unlike the current version. The color doesn't matter; I had previously mentioned a blue version but my personal preference has since shifted to the regular black. My proposal doesn't have anything to do with the mobile view (though I would assume having it be 20x20 would be better if top icons make their way onto mobile?), I just thought my proposed image is more aesthetically pleasing and fits more with Wikipedia's design. ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 21:08, 8 January 2022 (UTC)

  Could you elaborate on "Wikipedia's design"? When you had made the change, I had wondered if Wikipedia was having a redesign of all their top icons, i.e. all of them into simple black, as exampled at Wikimedia Design Style Guide. I'm assuming the answer is 'no'. By the way, does the Wikimedia Design Style Guide have an interwiki link prefix? — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 01:37, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  It does not, but a description of the team and links to their projects (including the icons) is located at MW:Design. The "fitting more with Wikipedia design" is just the 20x20 thing as well as the icon's simplicity (see in-use protection policy padlocks for what I'm thinking). ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 04:05, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

• A smaller key or something? The issue with the current icon is it's about twice as wide as other topicons. A diagonal key would probably work best. Or some other iconography entirely. I don't care much.  :-) PS: See File:OOjs UI icon key.svg mentioned elsewhere. That would work.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  23:11, 8 January 2022 (UTC); rev'd. 05:12, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  Size: That's understandable. Some editors have a long string of top icons. I don't think we can use a smaller size for the current key, because reducing its width will also reduce its height. Suggestion: If the key was rotated 90° (shaft down), it would fit nicely. The current image, Crypto key.svg, is not in a format I can manipulate. If someone can upload File:Crypto key topicon.svg to Commons, I think that may be satisfactory. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 01:15, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  Is there a reason why you prefer Crypto key.svg? Just trying to understand what your concerns are. ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 01:41, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  Why should any top icons be represented as UI icons? There are more than 100 top icons that currently don't follow the UI aesthetic. Do you feel the key top icon should be less complex (would this apply to other top icons)? — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 02:53, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

• Question: Let me check to make sure I'm looking at this matter correctly. When I created this template, I had the size of the top icon adjustable. However, I removed that option because I noticed that when it was being used on other editor's pages, they were making the key so small (or too large) as to be barely discernible what the image was. The current size, 35 px, is appropriate in height when compared to the WP:RIGHTS top icons. I could reinstate the optional size parameter if it is requested. However, a concern has been raised that as a top icon, the current image is horizontally too long. OOjs UI icon key.svg was suggested, not because it looks plain, but because of its diagonal orientation, would allow it to match with the size of most other top icons without being too long in any direction. The color of the key is entirely arbitrary, which could be made to look like Crypto key.svg (simple design, colored like a brass key, and doesn't get lost against the white background). Does this describe the matter concerned? — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 03:29, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  I think you described the situation pretty well. I think the simplicity of the icon is a virtue, but the main issue is the horizontal size. We could make it brass-- I'd actually prefer that color now that you mention it. ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 04:11, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  Agreed: I believe that most physical keys are made of brass, so that would be considered globally recognizable. If that is the plan—to design a diagonal key, or rotate the existing key so it's diagonal—then I'm on board. That may work better than my suggestion of rotating Crypto key.svg 90° shaft down, because a diagonal key would have square dimensions. As mentioned, I don't have the setup necessary for creating svg files; I'm working on getting a new computer. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 05:05, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

  I was able to recolor the icon to a brass, let me know if you think any changes should be made. See File:OOjs UI icon key brass.svg. ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 22:49, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

• Opinion: OOjs UI icon key brass.svg is presently 20 x 20 px. It's not necessary to limit the actual image to this size. As mentioned previously, Template:Top icon defaults larger images like Wikipedia extended confirmed new.svg down to 20 px unless the template specifies otherwise (see Template:Extended confirmed topicon). With that in mind, I think Crypto key.svg still looks nicer, but it would have to get rotated in order to fit within the 20 px constraints, as per the concern raised. Recommendation: I suggest further development of OOjs UI icon key brass.svg (including a new file name), but if the new image is applied to Template:Committed identity topicon now, I won't revert the change. What I will do right now, is reinstate the optional size parameter and adjust the documentation. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 10:49, 10 January 2022 (UTC)

  What further development do you suggest for File:OOjs UI icon key brass.svg? The size isn't an issue: because it's an svg, it can be scaled up without loss of quality. As for the file name, why do you suggest it be changed? ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 13:27, 10 January 2022 (UTC)

  What I'm saying is that Crypto key.svg is fine, other than it being longer than it is taller—no need to change the design, just the orientation, to fit closer to the 20 px default. OOjs UI icon key brass.svg looks okay, but I think that as a top icon it could look better, thus a redesigned image would necessitate a new file name. My intention is to obtain more images, and then we can vote on them as a community. As these are not article-related images, I believe we can display them in a gallery (H:GT) below, and then vote on which one will be the new image. It would be beneficial to have more than two options to vote on. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 14:21, 10 January 2022 (UTC)

  Which images should be included in the vote? I think both File:OOjs UI icon key brass.svg and File:OOjs UI icon key.svg should be included. I don't know how to rotate svgs myself, but we should include a rotated File:Crypto key.svg if someone else knows how to do that. For now, I'll change the image to the brass one like you mentioned. ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 05:23, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

  Agreed: We can submit as many different key designs as we like. As I don't have the capability of working with svg files, I placed a request at Wikipedia:Graphics Lab/Illustration workshop/Archive/Jan 2022#Committed identity topicon orientation. No reply yet, though I will periodically check on the request, and Commons at some point for more potential candidate images. Thank you for working towards improving the template as a community member. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 08:59, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

• Comment: We appreciate WP:BOLD editors, but WP:SILENCE is not a valid reason to change the template's image before first being voted in this discussion. Thank you. I would like to see more editors in this discussion. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 08:49, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

  I did not change the image because of WP:SILENCE, I don't know where you got that idea. I changed the image because of what you said in a comment 11 days ago: if the new image is applied to Template:Committed identity topicon now, I won't revert the change. The day after, I told you For now, I'll change the image to the brass one like you mentioned, to which you Agreed. I don't mind you reverting it if you changed your mind, but I don't want you thinking that I went behind your back. ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 19:22, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

  WP:SILENCE was the original logic used, and I mistakenly thought it was being applied again. You are correct—I had only read the last comment you left, and had not back-read far enough because of the stalled discussion. No, you did not try to go behind my back, and I apologize for my giving that impression. That was definitely hypocritical on my part, and I'm sorry for the mix-up. With the discussion stalled, and our technical limitations, I'm at the moment trying to invite more involvement in this discussion. As I'm am directly involved in this discussion, I'm also trying to get someone to take over the task of officiating it (and monitor the template for preemptive edits), to avoid a conflict of interest situation. Thank you for your continued patience. Again, I'm sorry about my confusion. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 20:45, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

  Courtesy note, I've responded to the request at the Graphics Lab and uploaded File:Crypto key topicon.png. 🐶 EpicPupper ^{(he/him | talk)} 05:26, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

Images for consideration

• More images may be added. Rationale optional. Votes may be changed until closed.
• 
  Crypto key.svg

  A
  ^(current)
• 
  Crypto key topicon.svg

  B
• 
  OOjs UI icon key brass.svg

  C
• 
  OOjs UI icon key.svg

  D
• 
  Nuvola apps password.svg

  E

• B: Crypto key topicon.svg E: Nuvola apps password.svg. Changed vote in reply to BappleBusiness's rationale below. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 10:18, 22 January 2022 (UTC) (revised 07:24, 23 January 2022 (UTC))
• E: I'm actually changing my mind, I think E is the best option. In my sandbox, I decided to test it out (just look at top). I made top icons of all five proposed images + a yellow version of C (brass didn't match the yellow of the other icons). I think E works the best out of all 6. I did make it 24 px instead of the standard 20 px because the raw image itself was smaller (see previous sandbox) but we can change the size if needed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by BappleBusiness (talk • contribs) 13:12, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

  My opinion is slightly mixed with E, as its license is LGPL-2.1 and LGPL-3.0. This is a license I'm unfamiliar with, but as far as I can tell, there shouldn't be any issue (we can change the template's image again if necessary). The head is a bit square shaped, but otherwise I think it fits well with the aesthetic of the other top icons. I can now see that A, once rotated to become B, has a rather thin body, while E visually stands out better. I'd like to see the image improved slightly, but I'm going to change my vote to E also. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 07:24, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

  It's been two weeks and no other responses have been made - should we change the icon since we have a consensus between us both? ~BappleBusiness^[talk] 01:44, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

  I would appreciate more editor opinions, but I don't think anyone is taking an interest, and I've been busy offline. I would change the template after Legobot has ended the RfC; February is not a long wait. — CJDOS, Sheridan, OR (talk) 09:53, 10 February 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.