Template talk:Corporal punishment
Header names?
editAny suggestions for what the headers should be called? Gabbe (talk) 16:23, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
Inclusion
edit
Moved from Talk:SpankingThings like "Abacination", quite aside from being an extremely obscure word (I never heard of it before), may be "physical punishments" but not what people mean by "corporal punishment". I would simply omit the items you have put under "historical".
On a quite separate point, is there a danger that if we include the three countries which happen to have separate articles in a list of countries, as you have done, people might think those are the only places that have corporal punishment, or the only countries Wikipedia discusses in this context? Alarics (talk) 09:31, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
- Abacination etc. are part of what was (at least) historically refered to as corporal punishment, hence my inclusion of them in the historical heading, as opposed to the main one.
- On the separate point, templates such as {{weapons of mass destruction}} don't necessarily lead us to believe that these are the only countries to dabble in them, only that they are the countries for which there are articles in Wikipedia. Gabbe (talk) 11:02, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
- The stub article Abacination cites no source for the claim that it has ever been described as corporal punishment, or even that it ever existed. So we should certainly delete that one. And if we are going to include "cucking stool" (another one which is not what people mean by "corporal punishment"), I fear somebody is going to come along and want to include the whole gamut of things like amputation and castration and indeed capital punishment even though these, and the latter in particular, are really quite separate subjects. You say that some of these things "are part of what was (at least) historically refered to as corporal punishment", but I am not convinced that that is so. Here is the crux of the matter: I don't think the significant distinction is between what is current and what is history -- amputation is still used as a punishment in Sudan and such places -- but between those punishments that involve striking the offender's body in some form or other (but falling short of killing or permanently injuring them) (which is what "corporal punishment" usually means) and those which are "physical" punishments of a different kind, in which we should have to include Rhaphanidosis and Castration and Tarring and feathering and Flaying and Scaphism and the Breaking wheel and all sorts of other things as well, including, I suppose, if there really ever was such a thing, Abacination. Rather than open up all that can of worms, I very strongly urge that the new template confine itself to the normal, more restrictive definition of corporal punishment. Alarics (talk) 12:43, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
- After having glanced at {{capital punishment}} I noticed that that template only includes the currently most prevalent forms of capital punishment and omits rare or historical forms such as crushing by elephant etc. So I've removed the historical heading from the template until we can reach some sort of consensus on it.
- Assuming that you have no other objections to this template I'll start adding it to the mentioned pages. Gabbe (talk) 17:08, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
- Yes, that seems fine. Alarics (talk) 20:29, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
- The stub article Abacination cites no source for the claim that it has ever been described as corporal punishment, or even that it ever existed. So we should certainly delete that one. And if we are going to include "cucking stool" (another one which is not what people mean by "corporal punishment"), I fear somebody is going to come along and want to include the whole gamut of things like amputation and castration and indeed capital punishment even though these, and the latter in particular, are really quite separate subjects. You say that some of these things "are part of what was (at least) historically refered to as corporal punishment", but I am not convinced that that is so. Here is the crux of the matter: I don't think the significant distinction is between what is current and what is history -- amputation is still used as a punishment in Sudan and such places -- but between those punishments that involve striking the offender's body in some form or other (but falling short of killing or permanently injuring them) (which is what "corporal punishment" usually means) and those which are "physical" punishments of a different kind, in which we should have to include Rhaphanidosis and Castration and Tarring and feathering and Flaying and Scaphism and the Breaking wheel and all sorts of other things as well, including, I suppose, if there really ever was such a thing, Abacination. Rather than open up all that can of worms, I very strongly urge that the new template confine itself to the normal, more restrictive definition of corporal punishment. Alarics (talk) 12:43, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
Replace Taiwan with Saudi Arabia
editHey, with countries that use corporal punishment that have they own Wikipedia article, could Taiwan's article please be deleted and removed as it doesn't currently have JCP. I suggest that Taiwan should be replaced with Saudi Arabia as they have amputation (a VERY SERIOUS issue) as their JCP!!! Thanks, McAusten (talk) 02:18, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
- First of all, this is not the place to discuss whether the article "Corporal punishment in Taiwan" should be deleted, please see WP:DPR for how that works. Secondly, navigational templates shouldn't include redlinks, such as "Corporal punishment in Saudi Arabia". If that article existed, then we could discuss including it here. Gabbe (talk) 07:10, 26 May 2011 (UTC)