Template talk:Infobox NBA season

Special cases

• At the beginning of the season, each team has a record of 0-0. But according to the template, the wins will be divided by the total number of games. However, dividing by 0 results in an error.
• If a team has a number of wins, but no losses, the calculated record will show ".1000" instead of "1.000"

Those two issues have to be fixed ASAP. ● 8~Hype ^@ 10:20, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Division and conference abbreviations

I have to say I'm not a fan of the division and conference abbreviations. For example, it's not very intuitive to relate "CE" to "Central Division". I think the infobox would look better if the conference and division names were spelled out. — X96lee15 (talk) 01:38, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

I've spelled them out and shrunk the font to reduce the risk of wrapping with the increased length. I hope everybody's happy. —LOL (talk) 02:23, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

What's the difference between these?

What's the difference between this template and {{NBA yearly infobox}}? Seems there is good (and different) information in each of them. I propose merging them into one template (probably merge into this template since it's older and has more edit history) and adapting each of the NBA seasons to use the newly merged version. Unless I'm missing something obvious as to why there are two different infoboxes. — X96lee15 (talk) 17:13, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

There's no need. {{NBA yearly infobox}} was created for older NBA seasons, but some of the information is really not needed and not always available. This template has all the needed information and shouldn't be changed for now. ● 8~Hype ^@ 17:50, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

I still think the infoboxes should be combined. I can't see any reason for having two different versions of essentially the same information. We can "hide" headings when the information in not available. — X96lee15 (talk) 14:10, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

So what info can be impleented into this template from {{NBA yearly infobox}}? Owners, local television & radio. But that is not viable information and in my opinion nonsignificant. However, stats could be added (ESPN, Basketball-Reference). ● 8~Hype ^@ 14:53, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

I have added stats from Basketball-Reference.com in the same way as in {{Infobox NBAretired}}. Are there any other mainstream sources for each team season dating back to 1946-47? ● 8~Hype ^@ 22:59, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Proposal to remove redundant parameters

Since many of the parameters currently contain text that can be derived from other parameters, I am proposing a new structure (nested to the right).

{{NBA season
| team = 
| end_year =
| wins = 
| losses =
| division = 
| division_place = 
| conf_place =
| coach = 
| arena =
| playoffs = 
| bbr_team =
}}

Changes to the existing variables:

team

Do not wikilink.

year

Change to end_year and enter only the year on which the season ends. For example, enter "2008" if it is the 2007–08 season.

The following list shows the fields that would be removed and the code that would be used to replace them.

;bbr_season
: <code>{{{end_year}}}</code>
;prevseason_link
: <code>{{#expr:{{{end_year}}}-2}}–{{padleft:{{#expr:({{{end_year}}}-1) mod 100}}|2|0}} {{{team}}} season</code>
;prevseason_year
: <code>{{#expr:{{{end_year}}}-2}}–{{padleft:{{#expr:({{{end_year}}}-1) mod 100}}|2|0}}</code>
;nextseason_link
: <code>{{{end_year}}}–{{padleft:{{#expr:({{{end_year}}}+1) mod 100}}|2|0}} {{{team}}} season</code>
;nextseason_year
: <code>{{{end_year}}}–{{padleft:{{#expr:({{{end_year}}}+1) mod 100}}|2|0}}</code>
;seasonslist
: <code>Template:{{{team}}} seasons</code>
;seasonslistnames
: <code>{{{team}}}</code>

Comments? —LOL (talk) 05:21, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

I like it. But who would overwork all that? There are a lot of team pages for various seasons that need to be changed in that case. ● 8~Hype ^@ 07:43, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

I'll be able to do that relatively quickly by programming (assisted editing). I plan to go through the lead section of every page that transcludes the template (Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:NBA season) in order to:

• Remove square brackets from the team value.
• Change year to end_year, then take the first four numbers of the original value and add one (e.g. [[2007–08 NBA seasonI2007–08]] → 2007+1 → 2008).
• Remove the seven deprecated fields.

Is there anything I'm missing? —LOL (talk) 08:56, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Seems fair to me. ● 8~Hype ^@ 12:33, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Definitely a good idea to clean up the template as you said. — X96lee15 (talk) 16:12, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

All the logic is in place but I'd like to ask, what would be the best way to indicate on the template that the franchise does not have a previous or next season? For example, I don't want to link to the 1945–46 Boston Celtics season, because it is nonexistent. Should I indicate this by adding | prevseason = none ? — LOL ^T/_C  16:58, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Bolding of place

In my opinion, the headings in the infobox should be bolded, and nothing else. Especially if it's just a portion of the data (such as "2nd"). There is nothing in the WP:MOS that says a portion of a word or phrase should be bolded and if you are writing prose, you wouldn't put half in bold and half in non-bold. I'm also not sure what you mean by "viable" in your edit summary. — X96lee15 (talk) 16:10, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Proposal to put winning percentage on same line as wins and losses

Because of the amount of whitespace to the right of the wins and losses, in the infobox, I'm proposing to move them all to the same line. It helps compact the infobox and reduces the height of it. — X96lee15 (talk) 22:50, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

No. I, for example, get irritaed by so many numbers in the same line. ● 8~Hype ^@ 12:51, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

There are only 3 sets of numbers. What if we put more than a space between the record and the percentage? — X96lee15 (talk) 15:58, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

I think it looks just fine right now. ● 8~Hype ^@ 16:01, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

Do you have any other reasons other than "I like the way it looks now"? — X96lee15 (talk) 17:11, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

"East" vs "Eastern"

There is no reason to abbreviate Eastern as East in the infobox. "Eastern" is the name of the conference, not "East". There should be no confusion with the Eastern Division as there is a "conference:" label preceding the wlink. Plus the text is wlinked to the conference's article. — X96lee15 (talk) 16:02, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

In the 50's there was an "Eastern Division", which was shortened to "Eastern". Therefore, the "Eastern Conference" is shortened to "East". If both were named "Eastern", it would be quite confusing. ● 8~Hype ^@ 16:05, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

"There should be no confusion with the Eastern Division as there is a "conference:" label preceding the wlink. Plus the text is wlinked to the conference's article." — X96lee15 (talk) 17:10, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

How would you say that the Eastern Conference got stronger? "The East got tougher" or "The Eastern got tougher"? ● 8~Hype ^@ 19:45, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

If you were writing in an encyclopedia, you would say, "the Eastern Conference got tougher" (as long as you provided a reference). However, this is not a sentence, it is a label, and should be the entire name "Eastern" (minus the word "conference" obviously, as the label already says it). — X96lee15 (talk) 19:53, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

It's also "Southeast", not "Southeastern". ● 8~Hype ^@ 04:56, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

I agree, it should be "Southeast", not "Southeastern", because that is the name of the division. But the name of the eastern conference is "Eastern Conference", not "East Conference". — X96lee15 (talk) 05:02, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Alright, we're talking about the full version of the name, and the shortened one. "Southeast Division" will be shortened to "Southeast", but "Eastern Conference" is shortened to "East". It's just like that. You would say, "The Orlando Magic are first in the Atlantic", and also "The Orlando Magic are first in the East", not "The Orlando Magic are first in the Eastern". Conference and division names are shortened differently, and we really don't want to mix it up with the Eastern Division. And please, no more dogmatism. ● 8~Hype ^@ 10:19, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

I do not understand why you would shorten "Southeast Division" to "Southeast" but shorten "Eastern Conference" to just "East" and not "Eastern". Again, if you were writing, you would say "The Orlando Magic are first in the Atlantic Division", and also "The Orlando Magic are first in the Eastern Conference". It's informal to not include the entire name ("Atlantic Division") when writing in an encyclopedia. In the infobox, I'd rather spell out "Eastern Conference", but since space is a premium, "Eastern" is the next best thing. "East" is not correct though, because it is not the name of the conference. — X96lee15 (talk) 14:42, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Again, we don't want to mix it up with the Eastern Division, and since "space is a premium", it should be shortened. Now, in the shortened version, one would say "The Orlando Magic are first in the East", not "The Orlando Magic are first in the Eastern". ● 8~Hype ^@ 14:58, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Space is at a premium, but not at the expense of correctness. And "There should be no confusion with the Eastern Division as there is a "conference:" label preceding the wlink. Plus the text is wlinked to the conference's article." — X96lee15 (talk) 15:07, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

I didn't say it would lead to total confusion, I only said it would add to it, as a casual fan wouldn't know right away. Also, it isn't at the expense of correctness, as you have yet to prove that your version is correct. ● 8~Hype ^@ 19:26, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Wow, where did "total confusion" come from? I do not think there would be any confusion at all for the reasons I've stated above. I'd also imagine the casual fan has no idea there was an Eastern Division anyway (since it last existed in 1970).

I'm not sure what I have to do to "prove" my version is correct, but here are my points: 1) the official name of the conference is the Eastern Conference (NBA) per the Wikipedia article name and all standings pages throughout the Internet; 2) if you search through the Eastern Conference Wikipedia article, there are no references to just "East". "East Conference" is just not correct. — X96lee15 (talk) 19:52, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

2008 NBA Finals#Road to the finals says "1st East". Also, on the NBA's 2008 Playoff page, on the first picture, it says "Buy Eastern Champ shirts". These are just two of many examples, and if you wish, I can prove to you that those are not exceptions. ● 8~Hype ^@ 20:12, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Showing two cases doesn't prove anything. I say those are indeed exceptions and the first example is incorrect and should be changed. Plus, what does the shirt say? "Eastern Conference Champions", not "East Champions".

This method better proves the most general form: If you google "Eastern Conference" NBA you get 1.7 million hits. If you google "East Conference" NBA, you only get 152,000 hits. — X96lee15 (talk) 20:50, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

However, the shirt doesn't use the shortened form, and we are talking strictly about it. The official NBA site says "Buy Eastern Champ shirts" (here's another example). It isn't that hard to understand. Your Google results are also inaccurate, as we were not talking about the long, but the shortened form (Eastern vs. East). I also never claimed it should be "East Conference", it's just that the short form of "Eastern Conference" is "East". If you search in Google for "NBA East Champion" and "NBA Eastern Champion", you will get nearly equal results. Also, Google's search is inaccurate and really shouldn't be used for the decision on the correctness. I am sorry, but I can only label this discussion as a clear case of dogmatism from your side which hasn't led anywhere (please don't take it as offense). ● 8~Hype ^@ 22:11, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Search engine test—search engines are an acceptable way to determine how things are more commonly used. I ignored the dogmatism comment earlier, but since you brought it up again, we both have arguments that have valid points, to call one side "dogmatism" and to strike out portions of words are equivalent to calling it "unfounded" or "unnecessary", which again, borders on incivility. And when someone says, "don't take offense", the statement is typically offensive — X96lee15 (talk) 23:54, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

I agree with User:X96lee15. There are no evidence suggesting that the official short form of "Eastern Conference" is "East". I think we should stick to Eastern.—Chris! _ct 19:02, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

But the current version is "East". And please read the whole discussion before making any judgements. I have linked a couple of times to the official NBA site. ● 8~Hype ^@ 19:19, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

I did read the entire discussion. My point is that even if the NBA "officially" (I doubt they do) uses the short form, there is no reason for us to also use the short form. Could you give a good reason why it is better to use the short form? As far as I can see, this is unnecessary.—Chris! _ct 21:32, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

You might have missed the point of this discussion. "East" is not the short form of "Eastern", it's the short form of "Eastern Conference". "Eastern" alone, according to the official NBA site, is not a valid option. ● 8~Hype ^@ 21:39, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

I still don't understand why we need to use short form when using long form is perfectly fine. I guess if you disagree, twe would have to raise this issue on WP:NBA and see what people think.—Chris! _ct 21:57, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

The long form would be "Eastern Conference". But this is obviously too long, so X96lee15 an I were discussing which is the short form of "Eastern Conference" - "East" or "Eastern". And since the official NBA site uses "East" as abbreviation, it should be "East" and "West". The choice is East vs. Eastern, not East/Eastern vs. Eastern Conference. ● 8~Hype ^@ 22:01, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

How is East the short form of the conference when Eastern is clearly a more suitable short form?—Chris! _ct 22:01, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

We should raise this to WP:NBA—Chris! _ct 22:02, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

I have explained it above in numerous posts. And the fact that "East" is the official name (accodring to NBA.com) shouldn't be denied. ● 8~Hype ^@ 22:03, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Comment there instead. I posted the question on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Basketball Association.—Chris! _ct 22:09, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

I think it should be changed back to "East", but for another reason: If you have it "Eastern", it drops one line in the box. If you have it "East", it is in line with "Conference". ● 8~Hype @ 08:56, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

Note: I copied the above comment from my talk page to keep the discussion in one place.

I think it's more important to have the correct name for the conference than to worry about formatting at this point. With all the different resolutions a reader's monitor may be and the different font sizes the browser may use, it's probably tough to get them all "correct". I wonder what Wikipedia's MOS says about that. Anyway, I'd imagine the infobox can be adjusted to reduce the "heading" column size to keep it all on one line. — X96lee15 (talk) 00:27, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

NBL (Australia)

hi, i am from Australia and wanted to expand our national league's section(NBL). we currently have no templates for team seasons for the NBL and i am not sure of how to script them. i was wondering if i could have some help from you guys creating a template similar to this one - making it uniform worldwide? thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Eccy89 (talk • contribs) 00:29, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Need to disambiguate team...

Consider both 1949–50 Baltimore Bullets season and 1970–71 Baltimore Bullets season. These two seasons however are for different franchists, but both of them use this infobox with team=Baltimore Bullets. However, simply putting double brackets around it means that this goes to a disambiguation page. It would seem that the way to fix it is to add a different argument (teampage= ?) with the name of the actual page that it should be linked to which will only be used if it exists. Opinions?Naraht (talk) 13:55, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Changing the wiki-code formatting for the infobox

Could or would someone please help me? I'm trying to change the wiki-code formatting for the infobox in this template so that it resembles Template:Infobox NFL team season using Template:Basketball color cell & Template:Basketball color cell2. Charlesaaronthompson (talk) 21:26, 19 February 2023 (UTC)

You should first gain a consensus at WT:NBA before asking someone to change the code. And yes, I am against including colors in this infobox, because there is absolutely no reason for that. – sbaio 15:01, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

Adding NBA Cup championship parameter

@Frietjes: – can you please assist by adding a parameter for the NBA In-Season Tournament (colloquially NBA Cup) championship, vis-a-vis the NBA Finals championship parameter? It will be a recurring annual event, and it's pretty obvious this was a huge success as determined by both the players' buy-in and the viewers' buy-in. Thank you in advance! SportsGuy789 (talk) 20:26, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

SportsGuy789, I can help, but where do you want it to appear? should it be under the "results" heading before or after |playoffs=? or where? Frietjes (talk) 16:09, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

Frietjes, I was picturing it to go immediately beneath the "Division champions" toward the top of the infobox, since it's a championship but also it's an early-season one. That way, going from infobox championships lower to higher: NBA Cup champions → Division champions → Conference champions → NBA champions. Can we take a look at that? SportsGuy789 (talk) 06:06, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

SportsGuy789, okay, I think I get it. I added |cup_win=yes. let me know what you think. Frietjes (talk) 20:11, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Frietjes, thank you for mocking that up. I'm torn... while on one hand, it's the first championship a team can win during the season (well before a division, conference, and league championship, chronologically speaking) and so it might make sense to list it on the bottom like that; on the other hand, it just looks odd ya know (having that link to NBA Cup on the bottom and the NBA in general at the top)? Can we see one more modification, where the NBA Cup 'ship is directly beneath the NBA 'ship and above the Conference 'ship? It might just "flow" better after all. TBD... SportsGuy789 (talk) 01:17, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

SportsGuy789, okay, I moved it up. Frietjes (talk) 17:19, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Frietjes, we have a winner! That looks way more natural. Thank you so much for the help with this. SportsGuy789 (talk) 22:38, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Name appearance

This does not need to be fully displayed as "NBA In-Season Tournament champions" when "NBA Cup champions" works even better, for [a] infobox real estate considerations, and [b] formal names are not required when a commonly known shortened version suffices just as well. SportsGuy789 (talk) 06:35, 14 December 2023 (UTC)

@SportsGuy789

However, NBA Cup is the name of the championship trophy, not the tournament. 爨龘龘 (talk) 06:49, 14 December 2023 (UTC)

爨龘龘, I thought it was the nickname for the overall tournament, I wasn't aware it is the trophy's name. That changes my opinion. SportsGuy789 (talk) 07:15, 14 December 2023 (UTC)

Rename tracking category

The template calls check for clobbered parameters to populate Category:Pages using infobox NBA season with redundant parameters. This should be changed to instead populate Category:Pages using infobox NBA season with conflicting parameters to match the ~50 other categories — GhostInTheMachine ^{talk to me} 13:49, 15 February 2024 (UTC)

Sure, why not. Primefac (talk) 15:51, 16 February 2024 (UTC)