Template talk:Jct/Archive/2012

Edit request on 25 March 2012

Please add the following line, in connection with a proposed edit to {{Jct/city}} (explained in the talk page there):

 |city1=…
 |link1={{{link1|}}}|link2={{{link2|}}}|link3={{{link3|}}}|link4={{{link4|}}}
 |areadb1=…

P.T. Aufrette (talk) 17:56, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

We already have the |location1= |location2= |location3= |location 4= parameters in the template, which allow the specification of linked or unlinked locations. It's useful for linking to Mackinac Bridge, which Michigan uses as a control destination instead of cities on various highways in the state. Its also useful for listing airports, or things like the "Other Desert Cities" used as a destination in California, and it doesn't require something to be linked or unlinked. Imzadi 1979 → 21:12, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

OK. For some reason, I thought mistakenly that using |location1 et al. was unsuitable and required a cumbersome form for the calling parameters that would be unsuitable for ordinary users, when in fact that was not the case. I guess the problem is solved then. -- P.T. Aufrette (talk) 22:25, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Toll banner

I was wondering if it is possible for the template to add File:Toll plate yellow.svg above the route shield for routes that are toll road, as this is what the 2009 MUTCD calls for. Examples of this in the field can be see on North Carolina Highway 147 (here) and Interstate 376 (here). If possible, can this be done without changing the link of the route? Dough4872 01:08, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Since this could be used for any type of route, could we do something like |toll1=yes to produce the toll banner, as opposed to creating a new type for each potential use? –Fredddie™ 03:32, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

That' s a possibility, versus using I-Toll, US-Toll, etc... Imzadi 1979 → 03:48, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

I was thinking of what Fredddie said. Dough4872 03:55, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

add non-standard CRs

{{Jct/shield/USA}}

Replace:

|CR|CR-Alt|CR-Byp|CR-Old|CR-Spur|CR-Truck={{#switch:{{{state|}}}
 |MI=Michigan {{{route}}} {{{county}}} County.svg

With:

|CR|CR-Alt|CR-Byp|CR-Old|CR-Spur|CR-Truck={{#switch:{{{state|}}}
 |AR={{#switch:{{{county|}}}
  |Lee|Washington={{{county}}} County Route {{{route}}} {{{state}}}.svg
  |#default=CR {{{route}}} jct.svg
  }}
 |MI=Michigan {{{route}}} {{{county}}} County.svg

Reasoning: We have a handful of non-standard CR shields in Arkansas, this will account for them. –Fredddie™ 05:11, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Seems uncontroverial.  Done: sorry for the delay. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 11:20, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

State Code

There is an issue with the state postal code being used. The use case is GA creating a link to Georgia which is a dab page. It should instead link to Georgia (U.S. state). The same thing may be happening with Washington. Rwalker (talk) 15:31, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Do you have a specific example? -- WOSlinker (talk) 17:10, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

If you meant the link in the Exit list section of Interstate 520, it was due to the {{GAint}} template, which I've updated to fix the link. -- WOSlinker (talk) 18:03, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Mexico

How do I use the template with Mexico Federal Highways? I found the alpha-3 code for Mexico is "MEX", but there aren't any instructions as to how to use it. Allen (Morriswa) (talk) 09:58, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Here's an example. {{jct|country=MEX|FH|1}} -- WOSlinker (talk) 10:08, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Subtemplate consolidation

I think this would mainly only affect the US, but I could be wrong. We should set a goal that by the end of the year, all the various subtemplates still in the Infobox road namespace should be consolidated under Jct and the Infobox road subtemplates G6'd. I think most US route types are already consolidated, but state highways are not. –Fredddie™ 03:51, 5 June 2012 (UTC)

Australian Roads

Scott5114↗ made the following comment on the WT:WA talk page, regarding using the jct template for Australian Roads:

I've done some experimentation, and it looks like {{jct}} will need some adjustments before it can be successfully used with Australian roads. I know that it does use bits of {{infobox road}} to do its work, and that template has already been set up for Australia, so that's half of the work done already. What will need to be fixed is that jct sometimes makes boneheaded assumptions; namely, it assumes WA always means Washington and not Western Australia, even when "country=AUS" is specified. (I have not tried NT but I assume it links to the Canadian Northwestern Territories.) Infobox road seems to override Washington to Western Australia if country=AUS. Linking and abbreviation templates will also need to be done.

Can someone here take a look at this? I have since made the necessary shield, abreviation, and links templates. (preliminary versions - linking is an issue as very few road route pages currently exist for Australia as most pages are for road names. We should be able to work around this by creating redirects to appropriate articles or disambig. pages). These templates work except for the destination cities/suburbs. Western Australia and Northern Territory are assumed to be Washington and Northwestern Territories, other states like South Australia don't get anything appended to the destinations (see my sandbox). - Evad37 (talk) 19:45, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

I'm not exactly sure how the city subtemplate works, maybe someone with a higher pay grade can look at that one. I don't even know if you can use |country= and |state= at the same time. The Australian subtemplates look fine. The link template had some duplication, so I cleaned that up and added some switches where appropriate. Are the abbreviations right? I'll check the Australian Dept. of Transport's website for clues. But so far so good. –Fredddie™ 00:57, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Part of the problem with abbreviations (and therefore links) is that as far as I know, there aren't any official abbreviations. Roads are referred to simply by their name - without exception, I have never heard a road in Western Australia referred to by the route number(s). I believe it is similar for the other states. This is why their are so few Australian route pages on Wikipedia, and the Kwinana Freeway (manually formatted) table has road names as links.

I've take a look at the city subtemplate, the variable it uses is {{{statename}}}, which is taken from the {{jct/statename}} subtemplate. It looks like statename name will need to have {{ifeq}}'s, or another switch for {{{country}}}, as at the moment is just a single switch with US states, Canadian provinces, and other countries. However, to do this {{jct}} will need to be modified to pass through the {{{country}}} variable, and it is protected. I have submitted an edit request (below) - Evad37 (talk) 07:41, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 14 June 2012

Can the template be edited to pass the variable {{{country|}}} through to the {{jct/statename}}?
This is needed for Australian roads, as Western Australia (WA) and the Northern Territory (NT) conflict with Washington and Northwest Territories. To fix this, {{jct/statename}} would also need to be edited with either {{ifeq}}'s (as in my suggested code), or by using a switch on the {{{country|}}} variable first, and allocate names to Australian states, before the current switch for {{{state|}}}{{{province|}}}.
This request should be uncontroversial - it shouldn't affect any existing tables, assuming the code for {{jct/statename}} is OK (please check!); this will allow Australian road junction tables to be easily edited to WP:RJL standards.
Suggested code change for jct and jct/statename
Thanks, Evad37 (talk) 07:37, 14 June 2012 (UTC)
:{{jctint}} would also need to be changed to accept a {{{country}}} parameter, and pass it on to {{jct/statename}} - Evad37 (talk) 10:43, 14 June 2012 (UTC) (see comments below - Evad37 (talk) 12:13, 14 June 2012 (UTC))

jctint is a completely separate template that uses {{jctint/core}} for its backend. There is a Western Australia-specific template in the works, much like {{MIint}} is Michigan-specific. Imzadi 1979 → 10:59, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the info, Imzadi. I found the WA template {{AUS-WAint}} that Fredddie created, and it seems to work. - Evad37 (talk) 12:13, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Edit request reactivated, as only the part about {{jctint}} has been resolved. {{jct}} and {{jct/statename}} should still be edited, as detailed above. - Evad37 (talk) 16:21, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Could you make your proposed changes to Template:Jct/sandbox and Template:Jct/statename/sandbox, and then seek agreement for your changes on this talk page? — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 16:26, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Edit made to Template:Jct/sandbox. The changes to Template:Jct/statename have already been made by Fredddie (talk · contribs) (live version, not sandbox). - Evad37 (talk) 16:40, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

 Done -- WOSlinker (talk) 19:18, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Coding Jct to allow "name (route)"

It looks like there is consensus to change MOS:RJL as per the first part of Imzadi1979's proposal (using road names as a primary identifier, with consistency on a regional basis). As such, {{jct}} and the /1 /2 /3 /4 subtemplates should be modified to support this.

The best way in my opinion would be to switch {{{country}}}-{{{state}}}, but I'm not sure of the best place for the switch

The options I have thought of are:

• Including the switch at the start of {{jct}}. Regions with named roads would be be directed to new subtemplates jct/n1, /n2, /n3, /n4 based on how many named roads there are, with #default directing all other regions to the regular subtemplates (/1, /2, /3, /4). This requires only one switch, but four new subtemplates.
• Including the switch in each existing subtemplate jct/1 /2 /3 /4, so that regions with named roads get the formatting <name> <dir> (<route>), with #default= the current coding for <route> <dir> (<name>). This requires no new subtemplates, but four switches.

Any proposed coding changes will of course be implemented and tested in the appropriate sandboxes before requesting admins to change protected templates.

Feedback and any other suggestions would be much appreciated. - Evad37 (talk) 09:10, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

At the moment, this change should only be implemented for Australia, Australian states and the US state of Alaska. Imzadi 1979 → 09:41, 26 June 2012 (UTC)

On second thought, maybe it would be easier to develop a new set of templates, ie {{jctAUS}} or {{jctname}} - Evad37 (talk) 04:28, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

I was thinking along the lines of the second. You could use all of the same subtemplates and things, but have it flip the output. Done right, it would be just as international as jct, and not a one-jurisdiction fork like {{jcon}} (only does Ontario, doesn't do as much either.) Imzadi 1979 → 04:32, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

I love this idea; using Jct's backend to make something that has pre-achieved consensus. However, I've never been able to make heads or tails of the template's backend. –Fredddie™ 06:42, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Sounds good; we just need to find someone to code it. --Rschen7754 07:08, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

I've pinged WOSlinker. He knows a lot about how the backend works, so I'm thinking that if anyone could code it up without too much trouble, it would be him. Imzadi 1979 → 07:35, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

The link on {{jctname}} has turned blue, thanks to WOSlinker. It's ready to test for 1 or 2 road. He's adding the coding for 3 or 4 highways later. Imzadi 1979 → 14:32, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

{{jctname}} is now working for 1, 2, and 3 roads - I've updated Mitchell Freeway and Graham Farmer Freeway. A big thinks to Imzadi and WOSlinker :D (Route multiplexes are coded by hand, but there aren't that many of them, and I can't see an easy way to code it into the templates) - Evad37 (talk) 16:14, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Increasing number of routes

Is it possible for the number of routes that the template can handle be increased from four to five or more? There are some routes like Delaware Route 1 and Georgia State Route 40 that have five routes at an intersection. Dough4872 04:50, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

Whilst it is technically possible, it would make jct and the associated sub-templates even more complicated than they are currently. I believe that four was made the limit for jct because instances of five or more routes at a junction are sufficiently rare that they can be coded by hand. - Evad37 (talk) 05:12, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict) How often will we have cases of a highway intersecting another highway that has five designations on the same piece of pavement. As I've said before, we can't imply false concurrencies that don't actually exist, which then limits some of these edge cases. As for the rest, they're sufficiently rare so as to allow us not to incur the extra time and complexity to expand the template. Imzadi 1979 → 05:13, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

In the case of GA 40, its western terminus is at a road that carries five routes. Dough4872 00:08, 21 July 2012 (UTC)

So code it by hand. Using jct isn't compulsory, it is just a "shortcut" for making MOS:RJL compliant entries. - Evad37 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 02:16, 21 July 2012 (UTC)

Turning off banners with noshieldnn

I discovered today that using |noshield#= with a bannered route will not turn off the banner as well. Check it out. –Fredddie™ 19:40, 24 July 2012 (UTC)

US 40 Bus.

Yep, only works properly with |noshield= at the moment. -- WOSlinker (talk) 21:07, 24 July 2012 (UTC)

FFH on USA subtemplates

This is a multi-part request. It will put Federal Forest Highways on this set of Jct subtemplates.

1. On {{Jct/shield/USA}}, please add |FFH=Forest Route {{{route}}}.svg right before #default.
2. On {{Jct/link/USA}}, please add the following:

   |FFH={{#ifexist: Forest Highway {{{route}}} |Forest Highway {{{route}}} |Forest Highway }}

3. On {{Jct/abbrev/USA}}, please add |FFH=FFH {{{route}}}.svg.
4. Afterwards, this list of templates may be deleted per WP:CSD#G6

   {{Infobox road/MI/shield_FFH}}

   {{Infobox road/WA/shield_FFH}}

   {{Infobox road/MI/link_FFH}}

   {{Infobox road/WA/link_FFH}}

   {{Infobox road/MI/abbrev_FFH}}

   {{Infobox road/WA/abbrev_FFH}}

–Fredddie™ 18:57, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

 Done I've made the changes, will come back & do the deletes soon. -- WOSlinker (talk) 19:08, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 15 September 2012

This is actually for {{Jct/plate}}. Please remove OK from the switch.

–Fredddie™ 18:40, 15 September 2012 (UTC)

space between banner and shield

I've been noticing a space between the shields and any banners. I think we had this problem a while ago, not sure what the fix was or what may have caused it. It seems to add extra padding above and below the template when a bannered jct is used in the jctint tables. -- LJ ↗ 11:44, 3 November 2012 (UTC)

Interstate 395 Alternate

Moved from Template talk:Jct/doc/type/USA –Fredddie™

Is there any way that Interstate 395 Alternate be added to the template? I saw it in Washington, DC, and was wondering what it was, and how it could be mentioned and shown on Wikipedia. Thank you. Allen (Morriswa) (talk) 02:01, 18 October 2012 (UTC)