User talk:Alf.laylah.wa.laylah/Archive 5

Archive 1

←

Archive 3

Archive 4

Archive 5

Archive 6

Archive 7

DYK for Hebrew Benevolent Congregation Temple bombing

The DYK project (nominate) 17:37, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

Kasper

Thanks for filling in the articles about Pound's unsavory disciples (well, that's one way of referring to them!). I just dumped a bunch of text into Kasper that will need disentangling but the book, which at $100 is too pricy for me, is way overdue and going back to the library tomorrow. There's more in it about Kasper but I'll take a few notes tonight and add in the rest over the next few days. Victoria (tk) 00:09, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Sure, and thank *you* for filling in the articles about crazed American fascists (another way of referring to them)..I just discovered tons of FBI files at archive.org that renewed my interest. Too bad I can't use them directly in the articles; they're full of fascinating minutiae. Do you mind that image of the teletype I just added to Kasper? It's not from his file, but George Bright's. Kasper was the first person they thought of when the Temple blew up. When you added the stuff to Kasper's article it popped up on my watchlist and reminded me I'd wanted to add that.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:14, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

No, it's a good image. People (as in scholars who write the sources we need) are now starting to write about the files so I might be able to get more stuff into Kasper. The Pound/Kasper story is particularly interesting because from what I've been reading tonight, Pound really had a strong influence on Kasper but never signed his letters and tried to pretend he was uninvolved when in fact he was more involved than people may have realized. Opening the FBI files has changed Pound scholarship quite a bit and the stuff that's being published is interesting. I'll finish reading this one essay I cited tonight, and then I think I have more in some pdfs stuffed away. But those can wait. I'd wanted to take a break for a while. Those crazed American fascists are exhausting! Victoria (tk) 00:20, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

There are so many of them skittering around like little rabid rats in the walls. I'd really like to write articles for each of the eleventy-zillion fake organizations that Mullins started. He had letterhead printed for each one; all in the files!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:26, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Redundancy in Choudary

Why did you revert the edit? It is terrible form to include the same information twice in the article. Worse yet, by saying, "Choudary is of Pakistani descent. He is a critic of the UK's involvement in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan," makes it seem that his Pakistani descent was the reason he was a critic of the UK's involvement in the wars. Is that the message the article is sending? Then it's repeated again under Al-Muhajiroun, and states, "A British national, Choudary is of Pakistani descent. He embraced Islamism and, with the Islamist militant leader …." which implies that the reason he embraced Islamism with a militant leader is because he is a British national of Pakistani descent. Is that also the message that it being sent? Further, there is nothing I read in WP:LEAD, or WP:MINOR that affects, or applies to the edit. Be more specific, and explain why you did the revert. Atsme ☯ talk 03:45, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

I'll reply on the article's talk page.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 03:56, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Coincidences

Hey. I know we've never spoke but I've seen your name around and always wondered what dit it mean. Today, I came across an article nominated for A7 and it contained a sentence that mentioned One Thousand and One Nights. I then landed to that page to verify something and found the translation, Kitāb alf laylah wa-laylah, and immediately thought about you name. Thought, I'm still puzzled because it missed the word Kitāb. Curious :) → Call me Hahc21 21:44, 15 March 2014 (UTC)

"Kitāb" just means "book", so I left it out of my name. Plus, this way I have my very own redirect in mainspace: Alf Laylah Wa Laylah! I picked it mostly because I keep the 16 volume Richard Burton translation at my desk, and it was staring me in the face when I registered my account. Plus, the idea of the endless story, night after night, feels an awful lot like Wikipedia, no?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 21:57, 15 March 2014 (UTC)

Oh, so that's what Kitāb means. I think that by now you must have realized that my knowledge of Arabic is close to zero. I agree, it looks a lot like Wikipedia, editing night after night, endlessly :) → Call me Hahc21 22:28, 15 March 2014 (UTC)

Neo-fascism

I can assure you my edit to "Neo-fascism" was not a test. Whether you like the Republican party or not, calling them a neo-fascist organization is inaccurate. Thanks for your work on Wikipedia.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.141.35 (talk • contribs) 02:36, 16 March 2014‎

You're completely right. I didn't look closely and thought that you and the IP that added the RP to the article were the same since both started with 24.* I thought I was removing the edit you removed, but instead I restored it. I beg of you a thousand pardons, and I've removed it again. Thank *you* for your work.alf laylah wa laylah (talk)02:40, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

Berge

Ok - I'm done for now - the article must be long enough now. And thanks again for coming up with a nice new hook! -- kosboot (talk) 17:55, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

It looks great, thank you too!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 18:30, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

Gosh - where did you find all those newspaper sources? Chronicling America? And thanks for your help! -- kosboot (talk) 16:18, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

I have access to a database through my job which includes scanned and searchable full-page images of American newspapers from the 18th century on, called "America's Historical Newspapers" by Readex or Newsbank or something. It's fascinating. I use them a lot on tiny town articles, and it's nice that they're so old, because I can often upload entire images of stories or advertisements to illustrate articles with. I'm just sorry they didn't say who won the 1915 contest, because I'm sure it was Berge and the lyricist, and then you could have rephrased it somehow. It seems that before the 20s, various clubs would just hold contests for the state song whenever they felt like it, and it would only be locally recognized. The past is a different country...— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 16:38, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

I have access to that database through work too, although I forgot about it. Thanks for the mention - I'll check it tomorrow. -- kosboot (talk) 21:49, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

OK, I hope you have better luck than I did. There wasn't much in there about Berge, and I really couldn't find anything definitive about the song.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 22:06, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

Fighting Wombats

Until proven otherwise, I'm just going to assume the Fighting Wombats are a boxing league made up entirely of wombats. You'd think that would get some kind of outside coverage, but apparently not... TheCatalyst31 ^{Reaction•Creation} 20:08, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

If there's one thing they excel at in small Alabama towns, it's keeping quiet around outsiders.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 20:10, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

DYK for National Renaissance Party (United States)

The DYK project (nominate) 08:02, 18 March 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Editor's Barnstar
	For your continued efforts to share knowledge. Sportfan5000 (talk) 23:53, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

Gee, thanks! <blush...>— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:21, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

You have a fantastic user page!

Welcome to Wikipedia

Thank you for your contributions, I hope you like it here and decide to stay. Any problems, give us a tinkle. Once again, Wikipedia offers you a warm welcome. -- GrumTum (talk) 18:25, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

uhhh...thanks, I spose?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 18:32, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

Was just some random copyvio/disruptive editor. DMacks (talk) 18:38, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, I saw the ANI thing... I figured someone who knew more about it than I do would be along to take care of it soon enough... thanks!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 18:47, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

Swiftwater, Mississippi

I want to add something to the article, but don't want to tinker with that amazing picture or its location.

[[Pete Shields]], a professional baseball player with the Cleveland Indians, was born in Swiftwater.<ref>{{cite web | title = Pete Shields | publisher = Baseball Reference | url = http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/shielpe01.shtml | accessdate = March 2014}}</ref>

Cheers. Magnolia677 (talk) 17:39, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Just do it (if you didn't already)... we can work out the layout later. I tried putting the image in the infobox too, which looked good, but it made an awful lot of whitespace. That's another possibility if we can get some more content in there.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 07:09, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Additional thoughts on school zoning

Talk:Tarzana,_Los_Angeles#.22Zoned.22_schools WhisperToMe (talk) 09:44, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

IPT

I requested Mediation for WP:HOUNDING, and WP:TAGTEAM violations against me. Atsme ☯ talk 13:15, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Precious

surprising facts on hot topics
Thank you for quality articles, such as Camp Aliceville, offering surprising facts on hot topics, for a clean and informative userpage with a clean-up plan, for improving 1001 articles with expressive edit summaries, for helpful reviewing, and making friends with bible quotation (Matthew 6:26–30) and poetry, - this mortal can't keep the secret that you are an awesome Wikipedian!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:53, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

Oh, thank you! You're very kind; maybe too much so... but thank you.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 12:18, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

Sexism

Hi. I see you have removed my edit at Sexism on the section on Criminal Justice about Provocation (legal). Maybe it was not well written, probably too much detail; but I do think it has to be mentioned. There is very much literature on this issue; and this legal defense being considered gendered is the reason why is has been recently abolished or restricted in some Australian states/territories and other jurisdictions. I don't think it was WP:SYN, since the sources directly address discrimination against women. I think that especially given that the text about criminal sentencing in that section - which is very problematic - is allowed to stay, at least a short mention of one paragraph on provocation should be left in.2A02:2F0A:508F:FFFF:0:0:50C:31E4 (talk) 14:46, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

OK, I'll move this to the article talk page and respond there so others can participate.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 14:47, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

New Article Proposal by Atsme

I would honored if you would help me! I actually do have a new article in mind, and I don't think it would be contentious. I want to do a BLP on Dr. Gabor Racz. He is amazing. There's a little bleep about him on U.S. Health News to get you started. The disease he specializes in is Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy or CRPS. My friend developed the disease from a dog bite a few years back, and I accompanied her to the pain clinic in Lubbock on numerous occasions. CRPS is among the most painful and most misunderstood diseases that attacks the CNS. Atsme ☯ talk 17:45, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

OK, the first thing to do before you start an article is to make sure that the subject is notable. This is interpreted in a bunch of ways, depending on the kind of subject. An overview is here: WP:N. The most general guideline is the "general notability guideline," which is here: WP:GNG. A quick look at http://books.google.com makes me think Racz won't meet the GNG, but never fear, Wikipedia understands that scientists don't necessarily get the same kind of coverage that other subjects get, so there's a separate notability guideline: WP:SCHOLAR. Before you start working on the article, you should feel pretty sure that the subject will meet at least that. One way to do this is by counting citations to the person's work, which you can do with http://scholar.google.com . There's a quantitative measure of this, the h-index, which is popular for estimating how highly cited a scientist is. You can do this by hand or there's a firefox add-on here, which I haven't tried yet but it might work. A high value of this is enough to establish notability. Roughly it looks like from this search that his is over 30, which is more than high enough. You can get a feel for how notability is established by reading some deletion discussions at WP:AfD. There's probably some way to search for completed discussions about scientists but I'm not sure what it is right now. Anyway, then you start working on the article in your sandbox. You can make as many dedicated pages in your userspace as you want, so you can keep your different projects apart, like e.g. User:Atsme/Gabor Racz will work for this one, and then when you're happy with it you can move it to the main article space. It looks like with this guy that some paywalled sources will be necessary, so if you don't already have access to a university or public library account with databases of newspapers and stuff you might want to find out how to get that. Then pick a short article on some other doctor and copy the formatting, and we can get to work. As long as it's in your user space it mostly doesn't matter if it's good, bad, ugly, or beautiful, so you can experiment as much as you want. I hope that's enough to get you started. Oh, by the way, you want to make new articles in your own user space rather than trying to go through articles for creation, because that takes forEVER. Please ask if there's anything else you need to know to get started.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 18:23, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for all the great info. I'll start researching now. Atsme ☯ talk 19:15, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

• Impact indices for Gabor B. Racz, MD, FIPP (using Google Chrome - they stopped upgrading Firefox). Do you think he's notable enough?
• Citations: 221
• h-index: 8.00
• g-index: 14.00
• e-index: 12.00
• delta-h: 1.00
• delta-g: 4.00
• per co-authorship: 118.70
• h-index: 7.00
• g-index: 10.00
• e-index: 7.00
• delta-h: 3.00
• delta-g: 2.30

He is like one of only 2 doctors who perform a very special procedure. Of course, I'll get all the tech terms, but before I go through too much effort, I want to make sure 221 citations would make the cut. Atsme ☯ talk 20:34, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

Lord, I have no idea. It's so hard to tell what's going to happen if it gets sent to AfD, which is so common these days. I think the h-index of 8 is bad, and I don't know what the other numbers mean. I wonder if that tool is working correctly, because a hand-count on google scholar seems to give me something around 30, which is a notability lock. Maybe you could ask on the talk page at Wikipedia Talk:WikiProject Medicine. You could just start a new section there to ask if they think that the guy's notable enough for an article, explaining that you're going to try your first one and you just want their opinion? You can also link to this section if you want so you don't have to explain every detail. I feel a little unable to judge and I don't want you to have a bad experience at AfD with your first article. How does that sound?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 22:48, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

You were right. When I first ran the search, I included his doctorals. Second search just his name, and the results were much different:

• • Citations - 2474.00
  • h-index - 28.00
  • g-index 49.00
  • e-index 35.00
  • per co-authorship
  • Citations - 901.00
  • h-index 17.00
  • g-index 27.00
  • e-index 18.00

Major difference. I'm headed over to Medicine Talk. Thank you!! Atsme ☯ talk 10:59, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Camp Aliceville

Thanks for this article Victuallers (talk) 19:17, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

• What an excellent job, Alf. I was very proud to see you on the front page, with an excellent hook. Drmies (talk) 22:07, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Well, thanks very much to both of you! I have a number of other sources coming in by ILL, so I should be able to fill the article out a little more at some point. I was surprised to see the number of these POW camps that are still redlinked. So much to do!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 22:12, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

It's now featured on Portal:Germany (where the Goethe Oak was just archived), - feel free to put the next DYK related to Germany there yourself, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:28, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks! I didn't even know about that portal.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 22:43, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Here's more, even one of the designers speaking ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:48, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Did you know about this page? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:05, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

I had no idea; that's fabulous! Thanks for telling me..— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 14:09, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

A cup of coffee for you!

Thanks for engaging with a class in the Wikipedia education program. I regret that it will take time and a lot of mistakes before we find a way to get student participation without a lot of bumps. Your participation makes for a better experience and I am glad that you were able to present the Wikipedian side to the professor, which you did well. Blue Rasberry (talk) 14:59, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your kind words and I'll probably pour a little whiskey in that coffee if you don't mind. I almost certainly was harsh in my edit summaries, but the nonsense, the nonsense! Also, I wonder if there's some way to make the educational project template more noticeable from the article itself, maybe in an edit notice? I mostly don't think to check the talk page for articles I've worked on a lot to see if someone's added one before I start editing. In the instant case I had no idea there were students afoot until after my initial round of edits.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 15:04, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

My apology for jumping the Talk:Ernest Hemingway sequence

Alf, sorry for putting my post above yours rather than below T's later post. I'd already lost my first attempt to an edit conflict. Other than suffering that irritant, how'er you doing? - Neonorange (talk) 20:07, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Doing well, and you? No need to apologize... I got edit-conflicted myself twice in a row over there. These things happen...— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 20:09, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Well, thanks. Almost spring here, near Atlanta; our Japanese Cherry Trees are in full glory. I have plans for major contributions to three articles (real soon now.) It seems time I contributed more and lurked less; a long time since authorgeddon. B^) - Neonorange (talk) 20:25, 27 March 2014 (UTC)style="color: #CC0000">authorgeddon"?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 20:35, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Go read Talk:Separatist_feminism#bell_hooks_fake_quote on the citogenesis we found re: Bell Hooks quote. Fun stuff! It lasted 5 years in the article. what is authorgeddon? --Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 20:45, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

The answer is... authorgeddon: Americans who write books are set to outnumber those who read them, suggest latest book industry figures. 2052 is the year when this "Authorgeddon" will arrive. (removed blacklisted site, will find another source)

Oh Lord, I'd just about put it out of my mind until I saw that ‎Obiwankenobi and I were in full agreement at Hemingway, which was nice. I wonder if there's sourcing to make that "authorgeddon" rather than "<span

Where have all the e'tors gone?

Gone to write books, every one.

Where have all the templates gone?

Gone to flowers, every one.

- Neonorange (talk) 21:10, 27 March 2014 (UTC) (apologies to Pete Seeger)

And... Authorgeddon was deleted from Wikipedia eight years ago; does that mean the slot is still available? - Neonorange (talk) 21:24, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Red links build the encyclopedia, so go for it! And I don't think it's necessary to apologize to Pete. I remember from one live record or another a story Seeger told approvingly about Woody Guthrie finding out that someone had plagiarized one of his songs and saying "Well, he just steals from me, but I steal from everybody!" The bell hooks thing is fantastic. I can't help but admire people who manage to pull that kind of thing off. I don't have the nerve for it. I find misattributed quotes everywhere, even in doctoral dissertations. Jefferson's almost as popular as Twain.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 21:42, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, it wasn't done on purpose. Editor 1 inserts POV quote. A year later, editor 2 attributes it to bell hooks - this was sloppy, but I don't think malicious, I think they believed the source was "close enough". two years later, book writer pulls the quote from wikipedia, and turns a paraphrase into an actual quote (by simply adding " " ) - citing wikipedia as a source. The quote has spread around the internet, all attributed to her, even though she never said it. Part of me wants to write her and have her write a story about it, which will create a RS, then we can add it to an article like Circular reporting. is it wrong to try to forcibly create a RS?--Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 22:10, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Absolutely not wrong. I've done it myself. Won't say where, though. It's legit if it's legit, after all, as we citogeneticists say.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 22:13, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

We all bootstrap when we start our computers (still, I think, and much more graphic than citogenesis); if it's good enough for the universe, then... - Neonorange (talk) 22:42, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for removing that nonsense from my user page. Much appreciated. Bahooka (talk) 15:11, 29 March 2014 (UTC)

No problem. If they don't call you names once in a while you're not doing all you could be around here...— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 19:19, 29 March 2014 (UTC)

File:2014.03.29.torso.sculpture.at.rodeo.dr.and.dayton.way.beverly.hills.CA.jpg listed for deletion

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:2014.03.29.torso.sculpture.at.rodeo.dr.and.dayton.way.beverly.hills.CA.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. LGA _talk^edits 03:09, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

What am I supposed to do about the BLP allegations on IPT?

Am I supposed to delete that paragraph, or strike-though? You know I was not aware that mention in a discussion about NPOV would be construed as a BLP violation. I didn't "force" my views, or edit war, or vandalize, or do any of the things that warrant blocking or banning. We were having a discussion about NPOV, and now I'm being accused of all kinds of things I wasn't even aware I was doing. You never said anything to me about it, or I would have fixed it right then and there. Why did you strike through your original comment about me on the ANI? Why is this happening? Atsme ☯ talk 14:23, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

I didn't realize that you'd said that the authors of the report were associated with the Muslim Brotherhood. At this point no one's going to do anything to you because the ANI discussion has degenerated into the usual blethering. If you just ignore it you'll probably be fine. If it's bothering you a lot, though, probably if you post at the bottom that you realize that your original comment violated BLP and you'll be more careful in the future and then ask someone to close the discussion, it'll almost certainly put an end to it. I struck through only part of my comment because I think that one single comment was a violation of BLP, but I left the rest because obviously I don't think you've done anything that merits blocks or topic bans. You just needed someone to explain that fine point to you, which you got, and how. Really, though, if you ignore this it will go away completely, like most things that go to ANI in this manner. You'll get more used to how that noticeboard works as you get more experience.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 14:31, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

@Alf.laylah.wa.laylah: Thank you!! I admire your work here more and more with each passing day, and with each passing issue. If only neophytes like me understood from day one all of what goes into being a great editor like you, there would be less arguing, and fewer disputes. I have certainly learned some very valuable lessons, and attribute a great deal of that to your patience and understanding. Thank you again, and again. Oh, and before I read your response here, I did post what I hope will be a final note on the ANI discussion. And I did get a mentor so I wouldn't be bothering you so much. Atsme ☯ talk 15:25, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks to you too. You're doing fine. There's no easy way to learn how to edit here; you just have to dive in and get banged around a lot. Eventually you have to learn to listen sometimes and ignore people other times. You're not bothering me, and I saw that you got a mentor.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 15:29, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

I have since purchased head gear, and shoulder pads. Hopefully, I will never have to use them. Sigh of relief!! I'm off to play in my sandbox. Atsme ☯ talk 15:56, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

No

It is not me, i have been informed that you think that someone else is me, but i can assure its not. Itsbenja (talk) 23:28, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

also

also, heres PROOF its not me — Preceding unsigned comment added by Itsbenja (talk • contribs) 23:34, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Wheal Eliza Mine

Hi, Thanks for your comment on the DYK nom of Wheal Eliza Mine. That ref is to a word document - I've tried to cut down a weird google link to the word doc & changed it on the article & DYK nom - It works for me but that may be because it is cached - could you try it?— Rod ^talk 17:04, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing it. The new link worked, so I'll finish the review momentarily.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 17:04, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Los Angeles and San Bernardino subsection in Climate of California page

for Los Angeles I used the monthly averages of East Los Angeles http://www.weather.com/weather/wxclimatology/monthly/graph/USCA9255 for san bernardino I used its own monthly averagesrecorded the the noaa and weather channel http://www.weather.com/weather/wxclimatology/monthly/graph/USCA0978

please let my redo my postings or fix it yourself if you wish, thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.200.218.180 (talk) 23:13, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry. Maybe use edit summaries in the future? Some editors change those numbers just for a joke.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:09, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

You were right-on about the images...

@Alf.laylah.wa.laylah: Commons wants publication info for the images I uploaded to my User page, (my photographs), but I can't give out all the metadata info or publishing info because it contains my professional info which links to me personally, and I didn't think that was allowed. I uploaded from my user page, but I'm still being notifyied by Commons. Can you help me? Atsme☯ talk 22:49, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

So you took the picture yourself, with your own camera?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:09, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Like File:ChickUpToXInAlligators Image.jpg? This one's not OK, and the fact that it's all over the internet doesn't mean anything. The question is whether or not you hold the copyright, which you do if you took the picture yourself. But you can't just copy random photos from the internet even if everyone else has violated the copyright. No one seems worried about the glacier picture, so it was the lighthouse that got deleted? And you took the photo yourself? If so, just reupload it and make sure you choose the proper licensing tag for a picture you took yourself and use the keeplocal template and it should be fine.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:15, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Ok - I think I can fix it. Atsme☯ talk 00:32, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Notable people in US city articles

Can I get your input on something? When I add a notable person to a city article, I try to make sure the person has lived there for a while. I follow the guideline WP:USCITIES, which suggests adding notable individuals "that were born, or lived for a significant amount of time, in the city". This avoids excessively long lists for college towns. In the past few weeks I've deleted the names of some notables who have lived in places a short time, and had some angry reverts. The rationale has been that WP:USCITIES is just a guideline (true), but WP:LISTPEOPLE is part of the Manual of Style, and that's what they're following. But my understanding is that WP:LISTPEOPLE is a section in the guideline Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Stand-alone lists. My read of "Listpeople", particularly its introduction, is that it deals only with "stand-alone lists". City articles aren't stand-alone lists, and the notable people sections of city articles aren't stand-alone lists. In fact, USCITIES suggests the notable people sections be written in prose. Said another way, if I followed Listpeople, I could add William Faulkner as a notable person in Toronto, New York City, and Moon Lake, Mississippi. Your input would be great. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 04:03, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, this is a perennial problem, and people are quite protective of these lists (I'm sympathetic, I am too for the ones I care about). What I've settled on is to stop removing people from the lists in cases where I'd have to rely on just list policy to support my removal. I only remove ones where I can make arguments based on WP:V or WP:UNDUE if it's necessary, and where I care enough to argue for a while if it comes to that. Basically that means I only remove people from Los Angeles related articles, and hardly ever even then. It's more rare for people to argue against including someone, although I've faced that too. In those cases I try to only add non-natives where secondary sources discuss their association with the place somewhat substantially, e.g. Edgar Allen Poe in Charlottesville, Virginia, even though he only lived there for two years or Gauguin in Tahiti (I didn't add these, but they're archetypal cases). Basically I've decided it's not worth the trouble of arguing in most cases. I think I saw some of your edits on my watchlist today; people who lived in various LA neighborhoods? I personally think it's ridiculous in a city like LA for the neighborhoods to even have notable people sections, since the difference between e.g. Reseda and Encino is nominal at best and which side of some line someone's house is on doesn't seem too important. See List of people from Los Feliz, Los Angeles, California for an extreme example of ridiculousness. Some days I'm tempted to add Raymond Chandler to every single LA neighborhood with a notable people list if it wouldn't be a violation of WP:POINT. He and his wife lived in about 40 different places over 20 years. The upshot is that I don't have any good solid advice for you but I'm quite sympathetic.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 04:20, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

I poked around a bit and found that notable people lists are actually Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Embedded lists. You make a good point and I appreciate your input. Isn't it human nature though, that Medal of Honor recipients and Olympic athletes seem to have lived in every town in county. It's hard not to be proud of the good ones. Thanks again. Magnolia677 (talk) 04:36, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Archives

@Alf.laylah.wa.laylah: how can I make my archive box behave like your's? I'm worried if I try to change it now, I might lose what has already been archived. Also, on citing notable doctors and such, Wow!! It involves an entirely different criteria because mainstream media isn't involved. Is a Curriculum Vitae from TTUHS an acceptable source considering that's where he practices and teaches? Almost every citation that's available originates there, and of course his research & articles are published in JAMA [1] but it's all technical stuff about procedures. There are some bios about him online, but again, they are published by associations he's either a member of, or else he serves on their Board, etc. Are those going to be acceptable sources for inline citations? Atsme☯ talk 20:02, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

You won't lose old archives. I don't really understand the archiving syntax, but here's something which will work: Copy my archiving code over to your talk page and change nothing but the username. Wait till the bot archives something and then go to your old archives and manually paste all the material at the top of the bot-created archive, and it should work right on its own from then on. Then after that you can have the old sporadic archive pages deleted if you want, although there's no harm in having them.

A CV is certainly reliable for uncontroversial facts about publications, honors, memberships, and so on. After all, the real-life penalties for lying on a CV are certainly harsher than anything Wikipedia can contrive. With scientists secondary sources aren't so much needed to establish notability, so it's possible to use a lot more sourcing that's dependent on the source.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 20:17, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

West Hollywood elementary

Thank you so much! WhisperToMe (talk) 00:28, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

BTW I would like to move the image to the Commons. Is that alright? I want to use it on the Spanish Wikipedia WhisperToMe (talk) 00:45, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Is it possible to move it to Commons while retaining the local copy? If so, I don't mind at all. I just don't want it moved there and the en.wikipedia copy deleted, because I've had too many weird and bad experiences with the people over there deleting things for really random reasons.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:47, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

I can upload to the Commons there without doing anything to the locally stored image. There is Wikipedia:CSD#F8._Images_available_as_identical_copies_on_the_Wikimedia_Commons which states that an image on EN that is also stored on the Commons can be speedied, so there is a possibility a third party can mark it for speedy. But I can ask on the talk page of CSD if the uploader can prevent a speedy using a template saying to please also keep the local image WhisperToMe (talk) 01:31, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

I believe that the keep local template I put on the image prevents it from being speedied in that manner, so it shouldn't matter if you upload it there. It says explicitly in the template that it's not eligible for F8. Why not go for it! Checked your mail recently? I sent you something.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 01:35, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Just found Template:Keep local. That should work. Thank you! I'll check my mail WhisperToMe (talk) 01:37, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Here's the Commons version with the school's name stated in English and Spanish: File:2014.03.29.west.hollywood.elementary.school.970.n.hammond.st.90069.jpg WhisperToMe (talk) 02:39, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Got the papers. Thank you so much! I checked the "Hankook school" and unfortunately it seems like it is a different one than the one in LA. But I'll "milk" the article for whatever it has about the Korean language heritage schools WhisperToMe (talk) 02:32, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

OK, good luck. I thought it might be a different place. It seems to be a popular word in Korean; there's even a brand of tires called that.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 02:41, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

I used the source a bit in hagwon. WhisperToMe (talk) 08:48, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

Well I'm glad it was good for something, anyway.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 12:20, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

A cold beer on me!

It's Happy Hour! There's nothing like an ice cold beer to celebrate life's lessons, particularly the ones we survive relatively unscathed. Thank you for helping me survive the most common (and irritating) new editor mistakes. Atsme☯ talk 18:26, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

Thanks! I hope things are going well for you!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 18:46, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

Vaughan family

Can I get your advice? I'm not always sure what to do when I come across a weak article, such as the Vaughan family. I spent a while trying to improve the article about Henry, and could hardly find anything. I actually left a message with the article creator asking where he found his sources. The rest of them don't seem individually notable either, so having an article about the family doesn't make sense. Do I leave it as is, and hope someone will find more info to add? Nominate for deletion? And if so, speedy deletion, proposed deletion, or article for deletion? Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 22:26, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

I'm willing to AfD that one on grounds of being original research. There don't seem to be sources discussing the family as a family, which is what's necessary to have the article. I would send this to a full AfD because it doesn't actually meet any of the CSD and probably a prod would just get contested, so might as well start where you'll probably end up. If you'd like to try out the nomination process go for it, or I'll do it if you don't want to for any reason. Probably that Henry Vaughan one's not a keeper either.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 22:32, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

Would you mind doing it? I'll watch what you've done after. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 22:51, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

OK, now let's watch and wait...— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 23:02, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

FAQ on talk pages

As an experienced member, I thought I'd ask you: how does one go about creating an FAQ on a talk page? Does there need to be a discussion with consensus reached? Or can I just create one and see what people think? Given the repeated questions on Talk:Islamophobia I thought it might be useful to create one there (as well as some other pages). Cheers! EvergreenFir (talk) 23:47, 5 April 2014 (UTC)

I have no idea whatsoever. I've noticed them. Maybe look in the talk page history of some pages with them and find out who created them and ask them about it? I really have absolutely no clue how it's done.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 23:51, 5 April 2014 (UTC)

Okay! Thanks! EvergreenFir (talk) 00:38, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Mark Twain Middle

Thank you! I'll get them on the Commons WhisperToMe (talk) 01:38, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

• File:2014.04.05.mark.twain.middle.school.mar.vista.los.angeles.jpg - Done :) WhisperToMe (talk) 04:10, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

California State University master's thesis?

Alf,

Is California State University convenient for you? There is a master's thesis that was written by someone who attended the school. Do you think they'll have a copy of that thesis?

• Watanabe, Chizuko. "The Japanese Immigrant Community in Mexico Its History and Present" (Master's thesis, California State University at Los Angeles, 1983.

I am involved in an AFD debate on the Spanish Wikipedia about the Liceo Mexicano Japonés and I would like a copy of this so I can describe exactly what research she did on the Liceo Mexicano Japonés and what conclusions she made. If you are able to get be a copy I would really appreciate it!

Thank you WhisperToMe (talk) 04:19, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, I can't do that one for you. CSULA doesn't have digital copies of their older theses and they won't circulate them by ILL, so I'd have to actually go over and copy it in the library, which is too much work. I'm sorry. Maybe ask at the source exchange noticeboard? Or if you can find the author it might be possible to ask them via email for a copy? I've done that successfully before.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 04:24, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

There was somebody who was saying in the AFD that he had a copy of it: "Ya todo he dicho respecto a cada texto y sus menciones a la pasada, no es necesario que copies cada párrafo una y otra vez; y como dije aquí Chizuko era una simple tesista y en su trabajo cercano a fuente primaria menciona hechos o eventos no refrendados por ninguna fuente que es repetido en otras partes, aunque no precisamente en cuanto al colegio, hay que leer lo que se dice: puedes ver su tesis en Researchgate." See diff but he didn't send anything when I asked him to send it. (Diff of me asking) - But is it that only the abstract is on Researchgate? In that case, we would still need the complete article.

I can check with the LA project if there's anybody willing to scan the paper copies. I'll try to find Chizuko Watanabe and e-mailing her for a copy. The article is from the 1980s so I'll have to see where she is now.

Thank you, anyway!

WhisperToMe (talk) 05:09, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

According to my library it's not available electronically, although they could be wrong. I don't have direct access to researchgate, but if my library did I assume they would have gotten it that way. Anyway, good luck with it.

Thank you. I posted Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_California/Los_Angeles_task_force#Request_for_copy_of_master.27s_degree_thesis_at_California_State_University_LA_for_Spanish-language_AFD_discussion and I amended Wikipedia:WikiProject_Resource_Exchange/Resource_Request#Master.27s_thesis_.28only_available_in_person_at_California_State_University.29.2C_Mexico_Journal_.28available_at_Stanford_University.2C_may_be_other_places.29 WhisperToMe (talk) 05:26, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Worldcat says it's also available at the University of Cincinnati and the El Colegio de Mexico http://www.worldcat.org/title/japanese-immigrant-community-in-mexico-its-history-and-present/oclc/16517074 WhisperToMe (talk) 05:31, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Ah, OK. I was just going by what my librarian said. I don't know anything beyond that. Have you asked at your local public library? It's possible that they have different ILL relationships than mine do?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 05:33, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

I'll try my library and see what happens. Thank you! WhisperToMe (talk) 05:38, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Is it likely that the UCLA may have this kind of inter-library relationship with CSULA that would allow someone to get a copy of the article? Should I ask a UCLA student? WhisperToMe (talk) 05:56, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

I just don't know about that. It certainly couldn't hurt.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 15:01, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

A kitten for you!

That trivia is as irresistible to you as this toy is to this kitten! :D

EvergreenFir (talk) 05:35, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

Aw, thanks!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 13:50, 8 April 2014 (UTC)

Zero sum assumptions

Do you think it is "irrefutable" that Title IX has benefited girls at the expense of boys' sports? The argument assumes a zero sum game. Binksternet (talk) 17:51, 9 April 2014 (UTC)

I don't think that, I just didn't revert far enough back due to a lapse of attention. Thanks for pointing it out.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 17:55, 9 April 2014 (UTC)

Photos for Racz

Hi, Alf - I'd like to add a few more photos of Racz at work, one of the International Pain Center, and a couple of the innovative medical devices he invented, like the Racz Catheter. I reviewed Michael DeBakey's article, and saw that it was rated "B". I'd really like to get Racz up there with the Georgia Tech article [2]if that's possible. Thanks in advance. Atsme☯ talk 02:27, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Hi, sorry I haven't gotten around to looking at your draft yet. I think you should at least upload all the pix you want (assuming you hold the rights to them), and then figure out what ought to go in the article. I did notice on a brief glance that you don't seem to have a lead section. Maybe you can look over Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Biographies and see if there's anything more you can do to make it conform to that (not that it especially doesn't, like I said I haven't looked at it super-closely yet; tomorrow I hope).— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 02:30, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Working on gathering the photos now. There is definitely a lead. Perhaps I shouldn't have included his name in a header? Bad habit of titling my drafts. Atsme☯ talk 12:56, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Hello! There is a DR/N request you may have interest in.

This message is being sent to let you know of a discussion at the Wikipedia:Dispute resolution noticeboard regarding a content dispute discussion you may have participated in. Content disputes can hold up article development and make editing difficult for editors. You are not required to participate, but you are both invited and encouraged to help find a resolution. The thread is "Rodeo Drive". Please join us to help form a consensus. Thank you! EarwigBot ^{operator / talk} 20:50, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
	Thank you for supporting me as a new editor Drowninginlimbo (talk) 21:42, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

Gee, thanks!— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 21:49, 12 April 2014 (UTC)

Hiya!

Hiya! Congrats on the badge and the kitty....... — Preceding unsigned comment added by IBCPirates (talk • contribs) 00:28, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

Thanks! And whose sockpuppet might you be, friend?— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 00:30, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

A special thought for you....

Thank you for helping me launch my first article. You've been the sunshine that makes the flowers grow. Atsme☯ talk 16:36, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

I need to create a template

Ok, I read WP:TEMPLATE, but don't want to screw this up, so will you help me get it started? I want to create a series on primitive fishes, so the template should probably be titled: Part of a series on Primitive Fishes. We need to be able to add relevant subheadings and links with the hide/show capability. There will be one header for Osteoglossiformes (bony tongues), and another for Coelacanth, and one for Endangered Fish Species, etc. I've got two other collaborators who can help with the categories (subheadings), but it was my suggestion to do the template, so I'd like to take the lead in setting up. What say ye? Atsme☯ talk 21:06, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

I just do it by copy/paste of other templates. If you find one that has the right structure, just hit the little "e" link on the template, it'll take you to the source code, copy and paste it into your sandbox, and then take out the content and replace it with your own. It's way easier than trying to write one from scratch.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 21:10, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

Working on that now. Thank you. Atsme☯ talk 21:24, 14 April 2014 (UTC)