User talk:IJBall/Archive 33

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A move request Looking for Alaska (TV series) to Looking for Alaska (miniseries)

Hi IJBall,
Can you move Looking for Alaska (TV series) to Looking for Alaska (miniseries) without leaving a redirect. It's a miniseries, not a whole TV series. Reliable sources on the article refer to the series as a miniseries or limited series. In addition, Looking for Alaska (miniseries) shouldn't be redirect to Looking for Alaska, the book. — YoungForever^(talk) 17:18, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

@YoungForever: I'm going to decline this request, because I'm one of the editors in WP:NCTV who think that use of "miniseries" should actually be phased out, as it's basically an anachronistic term these days. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:20, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

Draft:Henry Hart (Kid Danger) and Ray Manchester (Captain Man)

Big hell no. Looks like the second one has already been rightfully CSD-tagged. Cyrus Goodman was one thing, and even that still seems borderline, but these two, uh-uh! Amaury • 15:44, 16 May 2020 (UTC)

If the latter fails to get CSD'ed, I'll boldly move it to Draftspace; the former will likely die in Draftspace – both should be deleted. Failing that, they can simply be converted to redirects to List of Henry Danger characters. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:47, 16 May 2020 (UTC)

MOS:DATERANGE

Hello,

I see you reverted my edit and based upon the MOS, I understand. Technically, from my understanding, either format is correct. Although non-abbreviated years are generally preferred, two-digit ending years (1881–82, but never 1881–882 or 1881–2) may be used in any of the following cases: (1) two consecutive years; (2) infoboxes and tables where space is limited (using a single format consistently in any given table column); and (3) in certain topic areas if there is a very good reason, such as matching the established convention of reliable sources. but at the risk of edit-warring, I'll just resolve to the default. Snickers2686 (talk) 03:43, 17 May 2020 (UTC)

@Snickers2686: Please refer to the example table at WP:FILMOGRAPHY – as MOS:DATERANGE now "prefers" 4-digit date ranges in most cases (and has for several years), that is also the preferred style in Filmography tables. Note that Filmography tables are generally not considered to be examples of "tables where space is limited". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:48, 17 May 2020 (UTC)

Mallory James Mahoney

And another one... Amaury • 04:53, 18 May 2020 (UTC)

More reasonably borderline – at least with her, you can claim that she gets to WP:NACTOR through Adventures in Babysitting and Bunk'd. Also, this one is almost decently sourced, which is more than I can say for a lot of these... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 06:23, 18 May 2020 (UTC)

About WP:LEAD on TV series articles

Some editor have been repeatedly adding specific dates of renewals and cancellations on the lead paragraphs of multiple TV series articles which are almost the exact copied and pasted from the body sections. Who cares about the exact dates on renewals and cancellations on lead sections?! The specific dates of renewals and cancellations are already on the body section of the articles. Good TV series articles that have specific dates are only for the premiere date and end date of the television series (which are what most readers want to look for anyway), the rest are just with a month and/or year on the lead sections. While the body sections of the TV series articles, have the specific dates. Per WP:LEAD, specific details should be on the body section. What are you thoughts about this? — YoungForever^(talk) 14:18, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

@YoungForever: My general thoughts on this are – for "finished" or completed TV series, this kind of info doesn't belong in the lede at all (save possibly for info on the original series pick-up by the network, etc., and possibly/probably the cancellation info) – just the premiere and final episode air dates (ranges); for a "current" TV series, it is probably appropriate to list renewal (and premiere) date(s) but just for the most recent, or the next upcoming, season (e.g. The Outpost (TV series) or Van Helsing (TV series)). But a "laundry list" of renewal and premiere dates should not be included in the ledes of mutli-season TV series articles IMO. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:27, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

If the question is in terms of "date precision" for e.g. renewal info, I agree with you that exact dates are generally not needed – the one exception to that is an exact date for a series' cancellation is probably fair. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:30, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

Amaury and Geraldo Perez, thoughts? — YoungForever^(talk) 14:50, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

The Good Fight's lead contains third, four, fifth seasons information. A veteran editor removed the info about the third season and made the lead less wordy. Then, a somewhat newbie editor who have been repeatedly adding exact dates on leads of multiple TV series articles decided to add them back on claiming Reinstated edits that were previously made and removed by another editor that was misinformed. Info on third season is completely unnecessary as it is not the current season and as well as the exact dates of renewals of fourth and fifth seasons. They are all on the body already. — YoungForever^(talk) 16:05, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

Start a Talk page discussion about it, ping the editors that removed and re-added the info, and if necessary post to WT:TV about it. But, again, for a currently-running TV series, I do not think it's appropriate to include previous season(s) renewal info – that is simply not important enough to include in the lede... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:09, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

Ugh...the other editor decided to edit war instead of participating in the discussion and threatening to have me block. Perfect. — YoungForever^(talk) 18:49, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

Starklinson at it again

Not with a BLP this time, though. See Category:Television series created by Terri Minsky. I don't know where the exact guideline is, but I'm sure that just like with navboxes we need more than one item for a category to be relevant. It still wouldn't be close to enough even if we were to include Lizzie McGuire. Ping Geraldo Perez as well. Add: They've it added more to it while I was writing this message, but still, I'd say at least a dozen items before we even start considering it. We don't need a category for every single nook and cranny. Amaury • 08:19, 24 May 2020 (UTC)

I defer to Geraldo – I make it a point to not get into the details of cats: it's just one of those things I'd rather not have to deal with. WP:NOTDEFINING and WP:CATVER are pretty much the extent of my knowledge on this subject... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:10, 24 May 2020 (UTC)

List of Kid vs. Kat episodes

You may wish to merge the contents of this YTV and Disney XD sci-fi animation series back into the main article without leaving behind a redirect as you did to here back on the 4th. The aforementioned LoE should have never merit a stand-alone article after being a target of vandalism regarding a bogus third seasons which is the reason why it got protected from anonymous editing in the first place no more than a decade ago.

End of story,

--67.81.163.178 (talk) 21:50, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

I'm likely to leave this one – 52 episodes (with episode summaries), plus assorted additional tables for shorts – it's arguably OK as a standalone article.... It's when you see separate LoE articles for one season TV series that you want to let me know, as those are nearly always not justified as standalone LoE articles. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:55, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

The Heights

I was just taking a look at The Heights' article, since it's airing in the UK soon, and noticed that there are no viewing figures but it's included in the episode tables. Do you think it should be removed? — Preceding unsigned comment added by DarkGlow (talk • contribs) 16:44, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

@DarkGlow: I would advise removing the column, yes. Even if ratings figures for one or two of the episodes can be found and sourced, I would advise writing that up in prose in a 'Ratings' section instead. You should only include a ratings column in the episodes table if a substantial number of the episodes have ratings available to report. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:48, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for the quick reply. I've removed the column, also I'm unsure on why I forgot to sign my comment above! – DarkGlow (talk) 16:56, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

While I'm here, do you know anything about the dynamic IP that has been editing picture formats on TV articles? River City is an example. – DarkGlow (talk) 16:58, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

@DarkGlow: There's actually two of them – an American one from the Carolinas, and a UK one (the one you're referring to). Geraldo Perez has been trying to contain the U.S. one. I think Geraldo may know about the UK one as well – I want to say that the UK IP has recently been blocked for this same disruption, so an WP:AIV report may be appropriate... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:01, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

Put a report in. The things vandals will do... – DarkGlow (talk) 17:08, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

Awards and nominations for Laura Harrier

@IJBall: I don't understand the edit you made for Laura Harrier's "Awards and nominations" section. Where in Wikipedia guidelines does it say not to include rowspan? Also, if it's the same work, it's redundant to say it over and over. Good Articles Eva Green, Amanda Seyfried and Malin Åkerman have rowspans for several titles in their "Awards and nominations" sections. Factfanatic1 (talk) 02:30, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

@Factfanatic1: WP:OSE, and this is exactly why I have no respect for the WP:GA process. MOS:ACCESS is basic, and 'rowspans' should never be used in the middle or on the right-hand side of tables. The fact this nonsense repeatedly slips through the WP:GA process, which straight-up discriminates against our text-to-speech readership, just shows how flawed the whole process is... If you want to know more, search my Talk page archives for MOS:ACCESS or rowspan, and do the same at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Accessibility. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 02:47, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

@Factfanatic1 and IJBall: Per this discussion, all but the most complicated rowspans no longer appear to be an issue. Heartfox (talk) 00:12, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

@IJBall and Heartfox: Did you see the above message? Also, would either of you be able to help me with the article Laura Harrier? It's currently a Good Article and is now a Featured Article candidate. Could either of you perhaps help with improving the article to reach FA status, or at the very least become a better Good Article? Factfanatic1 (talk) 01:25, 9 June 2020 (UTC) @IJBall and Heartfox: Hey, just following up about this. Thanks. Factfanatic1 (talk) 00:31, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

@IJBall: Hello?? Factfanatic1 (talk) 06:28, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

@Heartfox: Hello? Factfanatic1 (talk) 06:28, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

I have never really done the WP:FA process (and am not really interested in it), so I am unlikely to be of any help on this. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 06:29, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

@IJBall: No problem. My main question though was how Heartfox (talk · contribs) brought up the fact that it's actually fine to merge rows or use "rowspans" according to the link that was provided. That's what I was asking about. Factfanatic1 (talk) 06:58, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

@Factfanatic1: My advice is still to avoid unnecessary, and esp. over-use of 'rowspan'. List of awards and nominations received by Jennifer Lawrence is a WP:FL and is a good example of 'rowspan' being used responsibly. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:45, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

Kristine Froseth

Why did you reverted this? The source says 1996. So why didn't you delete the source then? --WikiPimpi (talk) 19:17, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

@WikiPimpi: You're right – the sneaky WP:DOB vandalism was in these edits from an IP in April. I will restore the correct 1996 date. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:21, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

Ariana Greenblatt

I'm not thinking she passes notability yet per WP:NACTOR, and probably not WP:BASIC either. I do see at least a couple of future films in the filmography, one of which looked like it was going to be released earlier this year, but because of the circumstances happening right now, was delayed to later this next year. That one, plus another which is going to be released to Disney+ (and was originally planned as a theatrical release), might satisfy NACTOR after their releases, but definitely not right now. Should this be reverted to continue as a redirect to Stuck in the Middle? MPFitz1968 (talk) 19:56, 15 June 2020 (UTC)

@MPFitz1968: I would advise it. Definitely does not meet WP:BASIC. WP:NACTOR requires "multiple significant roles" and playing the "child" version of a main character in a few movies is not that. (So that leaves just Stuck in the Middle.) Regardless, what is there currently doesn't demonstrate WP:BASIC. Why some editors refuse to try to demonstrate notability in WP:Draftspace first, I will never understand... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:02, 15 June 2020 (UTC)

Invitation to RedWarn

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Candace Cameron Bure

My edit on Cameron Bure's page was reverted because she's not a political figure, Jennifer Aniston (like Bure) is an actress but has her party on her page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amanofpolitics (talk • contribs) 11:01, 17 June 2020 (UTC)

@Amanofpolitics: WP:OSE, and it shouldn't be IMO – I'd advocate its removal from the infobox there immediately (though I would check the Talk page first, to see if there's been a previous discussion about this...). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:27, 17 June 2020 (UTC)

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A move request from Matt James (television personality) back to Draft:Matt James (television personality) or vice versa

Can you move Matt James (television personality) back to Draft:Matt James (television personality) or vice versa (which ever one you feel is more appropriate) without leaving a redirect? The draft was started few days before the main article. He have only been cast as the Bachelor. His season haven't even started, this is maybe WP:TOOSOON for the mainspace. — YoungForever^(talk) 20:35, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

@YoungForever: I have converted the former to a redirect, as the Draft has precedence. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:53, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

Pup Academy

Will probably need more eyes here. Probably about the only thing that was good was the updated Netflix release date, but otherwise, no, as per the reasons stated in my revert. I believe Geraldo Perez is the one who's pointed to some guideline regarding keeping series nationality out of the lead if more than one, but I don't remember the exact guideline. Also, courtesy ping C.Fred if he has anything to add on the matter since he recently edited the article. Amaury • 02:18, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

@Amaury: Even the updated Netflix date is suspect: the website is not reliable. —C.Fred (talk) 02:21, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

@C.Fred: Ah, yes. Good point! Amaury • 02:22, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

@Amaury: Guideline is WP:TVLEAD "If the nationality is not singular [...] omit the information from the introductory sentence" Geraldo Perez (talk) 02:35, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Right. You can say something like, for example, "Pup Academy is a television series that premiered on Disney Channel in the United States and on TVOntario in Canada on August 26, 2019. The series is a co-production between Canada's Air Bud Entertainment and the United States'..." (i.e. cause the nationality part is not in the intro sentence...). What you can't say is "Pup Academy is an American-Canadian television series..." --IJBall (contribs • talk) 02:53, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

COI at Kira Kosarin

Hello! I just noticed the edits on Kira Kosarin's article – it might be worth noting that Santana is a close friend of Kosarin's per COI guidelines. – DarkGlow (talk) 18:31, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

@DarkGlow: I'll admit – I've mostly stayed clear of the details of WP:COI guidelines, so I'll leave it up to you if you want to either tag the article or "report" this editor... Aside from that, I still think inclusion of "Songbird" in a 'Discography' at the article is WP:UNDUE if there is no independent coverage/sourcing of it. In general, I don't think anything like this should be included (in a 'Discography') unless it actually charts, and it definitely shouldn't be included if there is no independent coverage. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:35, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Discussion at User talk:YoungForever#Surnames on Alexa and Katie

 You are invited to join the discussion at User talk:YoungForever#Surnames on Alexa and Katie. — YoungForever^(talk) 17:23, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

Dates in List of nearest stars and brown dwarfs

Hi IJBall,

I noticed that you have a little back and forth about uncited dates.

I think the dates should be returned and a compromise reached by instead of taking it out to put [citation needed].

Afterall the other dates in the list have no sources either.

All the best. Nsae Comp (talk) 00:35, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

@Nsae Comp: All the dates in the table actually need to be sourced. But the fact that the others aren't sourced doesn't justify an IP editor disruptively adding more unsourced dates (esp. when one of them initially had a "?" as well). So, the "compromise" should be to get sources for the other dates, not to add more unsourced dates to the table. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 01:12, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for the answer. I do understand, but still dont agree, especially the argument that it is by an IP editor and calling it disruptive for being not cooperative. I anticipate that even registered users with sources at hand will fill in the dates without sources since the dates are coherently without source. I would at least put it up on the talk page if you want sources for the other dates before letting more dates in. Afterall following your logic you should also take out the other dates and a majority of Wikipedia as a whole. Sorry for being frank. Sincerely, Nsae Comp (talk) 02:06, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

You can believe what you like, but when an editor is reverted on the basis of WP:BURDEN, it is clearly disruptive to keep adding the same material back without a source. WP:V is pretty much the number one policy of this project. There is no excuse to willfully ignore it – that is disruptive. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:40, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

Raven's Home and Bunk'd double-length crossover event July 24

Ping Geraldo Perez as well. Should we mention something about this on the Bunk'd article as well? It's hard to tell if this will be an episode of Raven's Home or Bunk'd only—like the "Danger Games" crossover which featured Henry Danger and Game Shakers was an episode of Henry Danger only—or an episode of both series. For example, the first half being an episode of Raven's Home, with the second half being an episode of Bunk'd—like "The Haunted Thundermans" or "Lab Rats vs. Mighty Med," each counting as episodes for both series, with different production codes for each half. Amaury • 22:39, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

If it's gotten secondary source coverage, I would say mention it at Bunk'd. If there's only a primary source, then I'd say it's a harder call, esp. not until we know which show this will be episode(s) of... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 06:50, 1 July 2020 (UTC)

DuckTales

Hi. Sorry to bother you, but 86.133.149.233 changed the premise to DuckTales again. I got involved and fixed it, but I fear they'll be back before long. I also noticed you and User:Geraldo Perez are both actively involved in the situation, and this is how I knew to contact you about this. I just thought I'd let you know. Blazewing16 (talk) 04:21, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

Editing of List of tram and light rail systems

I keep trying to contact User: Oknazevad and User: Cards86446 (other Users who reverted my edits) to discuss why they reverted my edits but they are incommunicado. Please make me understand how my are edits disruptive as they only revert them, they tell me that my edits are disruptive, I go to try and contact them to discuss this, they aren't replying. Ranamode (talk) 18:33, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

@Ranamode: It's been made crystal clear – you are changing the formatting of the table at the article which is against the consensus at the article. (See also WP:STYLEVAR.) You need to establish consensus before making the changes you want (and I can tell you, you won't get it). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:35, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

How the First-Run syndication list can join mainspace

My apologies for editing your User:IJBall/List of drama series broadcast in first-run syndication, I saw a mistake that you can fix which can be the reason the article can be in mainspace. User:$uperFan32 (contribs • talk) 11:45, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

@$uperFan32: Again, if you discover any other corrections or additions you want to make, just post them here and I'll take a look at them. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:48, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

@IJBall: The only mistakes left to fix are the following: The Lost World should be under the Lonesome Dove entry, and Star Trek: Deep Space Nine should be under Space Precinct. --User:$uperFan32 (contribs • talk) 21:13, 7 July 2020 (UTC)

 Fixed. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:19, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for August 2

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Changes on Melanie Scrofano's Wikipedia page

Hi You removed a change I made on Melanie Scrofano's Wikipedia page because I didn't have a citation. I know for a fact that she has 2 children because I follow her on every possible social media (you can look at her last Instagram post if you need proof) I think you made a mistake by removing my changes. I will change it again and this time please leave it. Ylrz (talk) 09:54, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

A move request Draft:Power Book II: Ghost to Power Book II: Ghost

Hi IJBall,
Can you move Draft:Power Book II: Ghost to Power Book II: Ghost without leaving a redirect? The series has a premiere date now. — YoungForever^(talk) 14:48, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

@YoungForever:  Done. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:19, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Full House

Got a disruptive IP making extensive edits to the article. Their merging paragraphs without explanation is the most disruptive part of their edit. (Diffs: [1][2]) Also noted in their second attempt their adding details in the plot about Pam's death, which I recall going into a bit on the article's talk page about its irrelevance or triviality. MPFitz1968 (talk) 19:43, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

If the IP keeps this up for much longer, I would apply for page protection – both you and another editor have reverted, so it's clear the IP doesn't have support for their edits. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:46, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Fort Worth Missing Trio

As is common with many crime articles, it gets clinical and dehumanizing. There should definitely be more respect shown in the article to the girl who was a pre-teen. PAustin4thApril1980 (talk) 16:05, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, I have never edited this article. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:06, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

For what it's worth, neither has the OP here... Amaury • 16:43, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

Template:Henry Danger

Ping Geraldo Perez and MPFitz1968 as well. Seems totally unnecessary and should be deleted. (Plus, it would only belong on the parent articles, anyway, as per our other discussions for other series.) You need at least half a dozen links in a template or category for that template or category to even be considered. User in question also added unnecessary and, more importantly, way too premature redirects at List of Danger Force episodes and List of Danger Force characters. Amaury • 03:26, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

I wouldn't object to taking it to WP:TfD, as I agree with you. But once at TfD, anything can happen... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 13:46, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

Sort of related... but Sean Ryan Fox has an IP removing the redirect, with only two references, both of which are NOTRS (IMDb and a fan-run wiki to be specific...). Magitroopa (talk) 03:34, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Notice of noticeboard discussion

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. P-K3 (talk) 20:01, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Never mind, the frigging thing was closed while I was informing you. Tsk.-- P-K3 (talk) 20:02, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

@Pawnkingthree: Thanks for letting me know. For context, the editor at this IP has already received a short block for edit warring within the last few days. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 23:30, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

To All the Boys: P.S. I Still Love You

Back in February 2020, when it was released on Netflix, I edited the cast list of roles to go according to the closing credits as shown here. Then, various ip addresses went against WP:FILMCAST by adding full names. I seen this happened to a lot of kids/family and teen films that go against WP:FILMCAST. — YoungForever^(talk) 21:42, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

@YoungForever: Yep. I've been adding more and more film articles, esp. those released places like Netflix, to my watchlist lately for this very reason. I was lucky to get "Names as per credits" added to WP:FILMCAST in the first place, but I pushed for it precisely because the almost "made-up" name thing in film cast lists was getting out of control. I just had to do some similar trimming at The Sleepover. But in the case of To All the Boys: P.S. I Still Love You, the cast naming convention should at least match the parent article, To All the Boys I've Loved Before (film). The reason I didn't get to the sequel sooner is because I didn't have Netflix for almost a year (and then Netflix "lost" my entire account with them in the meantime!!). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:53, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

I noticed every few days a random ip address decided to go against closing credits over by The Kissing Booth and it's sequel The Kissing Booth 2. — YoungForever^(talk) 22:08, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia:WikiProject Television/2020 Infobox television channel redesign proposal

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:WikiProject Television/2020 Infobox television channel redesign proposal. Raymie (t • c) 07:01, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Side Hustle and The Astronauts

Amaury too: Deadline released an article for upcoming Fall 2020 premiere dates. Side Hustle is listed under "October TBA", and The Astronauts is listed under "slated to air this fall with no hard date". Magitroopa (talk) 15:54, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Weird – they were advertising for the latter fairly heavily over summer, and then just... stopped. I wonder why they pushed it back. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:04, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

(talk page watcher) Filming for The Astronauts just began beginning of this month (August 4) and scheduled to conclude on September 23, 2020. They are probably waiting to conclude filming first. — YoungForever^(talk) 18:28, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

That would only be the restart of production, if true then. The trailer for it released back on May 2, during the airing of the 2020 Kids' Choice Awards. That trailer is the only thing that's been airing of it though. It airs occasionally on the main channel (I think mostly during Saturday nights?...) and I believe I sometimes see it on Nicktoons. Still says the same "Launching soon" at the end though... But yes, production definitely is ongoing. [3] [4] [5] Magitroopa (talk) 19:44, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Magitroopa: They probably didn't change it because it is still probably going to premiere this year, just rather later than sooner. Based on reliable sources, that's the only teaser trailer for the past couple of months, there still isn't a new main official trailer yet. — YoungForever^(talk) 18:56, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Based off of this post from one of the actors, seems like today was their Zoom press day. with the news on Group Chat and Unfiltered earlier today, I wouldn't be surprised if we get some news on The Astronauts any day now. Magitroopa (talk) 00:15, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

@Magitroopa: With the COVID-19 pandemic still going on, every TV series that is just resumed filming for a new series or season seemed to delay the announcement of the official premiere date. — YoungForever^(talk) 00:20, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

References

Require clarity

Hey...

Sorry to bother you but a matter has caught my attention on which I would appreciate some clarity by an experienced editor such as yourself. The user Lonniemitchell22 has a history of going to many articles and altering the way references have been named and cited/written, example: [6][7][8]. Now, am I missing out on something, like is there any hard and fast rule that title should always come before url, using website instead of work is incorrect, ref names should always have a space between words ("This Way" not "ThisWay") and so on. I have skimmed through the Wiki guide on citing references but haven't found a satisfactory answer to my doubts. If the aforementioned changes and many more like them that have been done by said user are indeed necessary then it is definitely improving the articles and making Wiki better but if not, then isn't altering another editor's work for no apparent reason in bad taste. Any clarification on the matter would be greatly appreciated and will also help me in improving the quality of my own work in the future. TheRedDomitor (talk) 06:40, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

@TheRedDomitor: No, there is definitely no such "rule" on the first or third points, and this editor has been persistently disruptive about this for quite sometime. On your second point, this is minor, but I think work may be a redirect to the parameter website, though I tend to use the former much more often than the latter myself, and am pretty sure it makes no difference, is not "wrong", and doesn't require a change... Long story short: This editor has been a problem for a long time, and my guess is that they'll eventually need to be taken to WP:ANI – so if you or anyone else does, I'd like to be made aware that an ANI discussion has been started on this one. Thanks. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:18, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

I did notice the prior violation reprimands on their talk page. I'll keep an out from now onwards. And offcourse Thank You for clearing my doubts up. Cheers!! TheRedDomitor (talk) 16:32, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Can this be used as a source?

Hi. I realized you removed by edit from the Tracy Spiridakos article since the source was from a gossip site. However there initially was another site where that article got that information from. And it was an actual newsletter from her school rather than a gossip site or a self published source. The link has been long dead, but over on the filmboards(formerly the IMDB boards) there was a thread from years ago regarding her age and someone copied/pasted what was posted in that newsletter. I'll post the link to the boards along with what that part of the newsletter that poster copied/pasted.

https://www.filmboards.com/board/p/3048892/2/

"Former student, Tracy Spiridakos(Class of 2000)will be playing the lead role of Charlie in a new series staring in fall on NBC called Revolution. Tracy was a part of the theatre program here at OP and has worked extremely hard to land such a huge role."

Here's the link: http://www.pembinatrails.ca/oakpark/info/Newsletters/June.pdf"

I'm not sure if this will be considered reliable enough or if this will be considered a copyright violation. So I was just wanted to make sure with you. The person that posted it username is ChuckWelch in case you wanted to see the actual post.2600:1702:3390:81B0:9061:E397:1F63:937C (talk) 08:56, 1 September 2020 (UTC)

So, the first is an internet forum, and so can't be used as per WP:SELFPUBLISHED. The second might be acceptable to use, except that that link is now dead, which means that it can't really be verified right now. So, saying that she graduated in 2000 would be fine, if we an extant WP:RS that published it can be found. For now, I would say it should stay out until an extant WP:RS reporting it can be located. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 13:52, 1 September 2020 (UTC)

List of Game Shakers episodes

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

These episodes were aired in France before the USA:

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_Shakers

We've wrote the airdates here.

And here, there is a TV schedule:

https://www.linternaute.com/television/serie-game-shakers-p3575024/#3

You give me warning for this ? --41.92.74.3 (talk) 18:25, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

It's irrelevant. This is an American series; we only care about the American air dates. Drop it or be blocked. Your choice. Amaury • 18:36, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

Actually, that's not it – it's that this IP NEEDS TO TAKE THIS TO THE ARTICLE TALK PAGE AS DIRECTED. Then we can have a proper discussion about this there. I'm not doing it here. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:42, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

For the record, they went to my talk page as well (original message left by different IP address, but on the same /17 - 41.92.55.98) [9]. Pretty much making nothing but an WP:OSE argument by saying that this is done at List of The Powerpuff Girls (2016 TV series) episodes. I left no reply comment on my talk page, but it looks clearly wrong at that article, too. MPFitz1968 (talk) 19:06, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

Yes, and that's what a proper discussion at the article Talk page would entail – 1) is this relevant? and 2) if it is relevant, in which article (and in which section) should it go? But, like I said – I'm not going to do that here! --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:48, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

This article is relevant. --41.92.84.90 (talk) 09:52, 4 September 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Ethnicelebs.com and proper sources

Referreing to my edits on Elizabeth McLaughlin and Victoria Moroles, I would ask your advice: I could link the original marriage records and censuses that are available as sources in ethnicelebs.com, but woudn't that be Wikipedia:No original research? I thought using secondary sources instead on primary sources would be technically "safer" in cases like this? (Terot (talk) 18:25, 4 September 2020 (UTC))

@Terot: I doubt you will find the sourcing necessary to add this to the articles. What you're suggesting would be problematic both in terms of WP:BLPPRIMARY and WP:OR. In general, unless a public figure speaks to their own ancestry themselves in an published interview (or they get a properly researched biography or in-depth profile written about them), mention of their ancestry in Wikipedia articles is inappropriate as there is usually not WP:RSs to back it up. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:29, 4 September 2020 (UTC)

Dark Skies and Gregory Harrison

I wasn't sure how to respond to you regarding the Gregory Harrison undo you did to his wiki page. He was not credited with the voice for Dark Skies, but he is listed on IMDB as being the uncredited voice. I should have shown uncredited. My apologies.

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002129/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1 Spiel (talk) 03:04, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

@Spiel: Two things, then: 1) First, if he was uncredited, it means the show itself can't be used to verify his participation (under WP:PRIMARY), so there needs to be a reliable secondary source (and IMDb is definitely not that) to verify that Harrison did provide the voice-over narration for the show. 2) Second, because he wasn't credited cast, he can't/shouldn't be included in the bulleted list of "main cast" at the article. The way to be handle it would be with a sentence in prose, as is done at, for example, Love Life (American TV series)#Main (though in this case, as I said, it will also need to be sourced to a reliable secondary source). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:30, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

Well, I can find plenty of secondary sources like the attached, but this really isn't a big deal, so I am going to forget about it. Thanks for the help. :)

https://www.paleycenter.org/collection/item/?q=dinner+with+the+president&p=8&item=B:52243 Spiel (talk) 02:40, 7 September 2020 (UTC)

@Spiel: a press (i.e. newspaper) source would be better – if one of those can be found, I think it can be added to the article as I suggested: as unbulleted prose. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 02:42, 7 September 2020 (UTC)

The Loud House

It seems to be becoming the new SpongeBob, or at least another SpongeBob. See here. One interesting fact about it is that all of its seasons, including the upcoming premiere of the fifth season on Friday and now this sixth season renewal, have had 26 episodes. Not even SpongeBob has that, though I wish all series would be like this, in particular the live-action ones since that's what I watch, on the networks I watch. Kids and broadcast. For example, Nickelodeon canceling Knight Squad after two seasons. Okay, fine. But both seasons should have had 26 production episodes each. All seasons should have 26 episodes by default—that's a nice amount of episodes for a season that can easily be aired in a traditional television season that broadcast networks like ABC do. And if they wish to order episodes for a season, go for it. See, for example, here and the subsequent two replies from NAM with regard to Coop & Cami Ask the World. Originally 21 episodes for the second season, but then got extended to 31, though only 28 ended up being produced because of this pandemic. Although even there and other similar situations, it shouldn't be too hard to, for example, air the last three as part of the third season, plus the amount of episodes the third season is intended to have. So if the third season is ordered with 21 episodes, it would end up being 24 episodes, three of those being the ones that couldn't be filmed during the second season due to COVID that can be used as the season premiere. (Although I imagine the third season, whenever that's announced—or it could be another silent renewal like Bizaardvark—will likely just be another 21 episodes.) But, anyway, this 13 default with a back-nine order if the series does well, for a total of 22, is just not enough. 13 episodes is too little. Even 20 or 22 episodes is okay, but not 13. So an absolute minimum of 20 should be the default, though 26 would be nicer. Amaury • 22:10, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

A Move Request from Draft:Debris (TV series) to Debris (TV series)

Hi IJBall,
Can you move Draft:Debris (TV series) to Debris (TV series) without leaving a redirect? The Draft was created weeks before the Debris (TV series) article was even created. — YoungForever^(talk) 14:08, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

@YoungForever: I am much less comfortable doing that in this case, as the difference is only a month, and the mainspace article has itself now existed for 2 months. (If Debris (TV series) had been created in the last few weeks, it would be a no-brainer.) In this case, I can only suggest that the articles be merged – I would request a WP:HISTMERGE of the Draft and the mainspace article – that seems like a reasonable request in this case. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:39, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

That's fine. Thanks, anyway. Do I place the History merge tag to Debris (TV series)?— YoungForever^(talk) 14:55, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Yes, as that came later, I would place it there. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:33, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Elena of Avalor

The Futon Critic is reporting that the series finale aired on August 23, 2020. [10] It is sourced in the series overview table under last aired for season 3. I can add that source to where you tagged the date in the article. MPFitz1968 (talk) 16:44, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Yeah, that's fine, but it definitely needs to be sourced in the main TV series article itself. Otherwise it's just an unsourced claim. (And it's better if somebody can come up with more than just TFC for this.) --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:45, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Need help

Hi,I wanna know know more about editing here on Wikipedia I'm new here so I need help Kenzie Abraham (talk) 18:51, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

@Kenzie Abraham: I would suggest starting with Help:Getting started – this has a number of resources for new editors – and Wikipedia:Contributing to Wikipedia. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 00:26, 30 August 2020 (UTC)

@IJBall:Thank you so much I think that will help me --Kenzie Abraham Kenzie Abraham (talk) 14:39, 18 September 2020 (UTC)

WP:DUCK: 2600:8800:3983:1F00:A5E1:3D1C:F83E:A091

@Geraldo Perez and MPFitz1968: I need more eyes on this IP, please. I've reopened the report at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Pwt898‎, as I strongly suspect this IP is that user evading their block. Amaury • 01:55, 25 September 2020 (UTC)

Wood couple baby

they literally said their sons name is (Redacted) on Instagram so I do not see how that is an incorrect statement. Anchoredbyfaith (talk) 01:55, 26 September 2020 (UTC)

WP:MINORS, WP:BLPNAMES, WP:NOTNEWS. Others can do whatever they want, and press/media as well, but we have different rules, and a different function – we don't include names and bio info of non-notable people, esp. if they are minors. See also WP:ONUS. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 05:32, 26 September 2020 (UTC)

Hey

Is there any rule that prohibits using "rowspan" in filmography tables?BradfordTalk 17:00, 27 September 2020 (UTC)

There is no formal "rule" anymore, as MOS:ACCESS has basically walked away from the issue. But many of us who edit filmography tables discourage its use, and in general 'rowspan' is used badly and inappropriately in Filmography tables. In most cases, I would say use of 'rowspan' adds nothing to these tables, and is often a net negative – (ease of) readability is the most important factor here, and a lot of the people who add rowspan seem to give this aspect no consideration. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:04, 27 September 2020 (UTC)

Futon Critic production codes

Just checking... The Futon Critic is fine as a source for production codes, (like it has been for some time now...) correct? Currently have an IP insisting that TFC is not a WP:TVRS for production codes- that only episode titles and dates are fine to be sourced from there. See their discussion here. They are very insistent that they entirely be removed from Group Chat with Jayden & Brent, as it started with this edit.

I really don't see the production codes being removed from all articles just because an IP has decided themselves that TFC can't be used as a source for them... Magitroopa (talk) 23:35, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

@Magitroopa: Wikipedia:Verifiability, not truth applies in this situation – sourcing prod. codes to TFC is better than nothing. It is true that the "prod. codes" TFC lists are sometimes not the "real prod. codes" used – Legacies (TV series) is an example of this – but TFC's listed prod. codes do correlate (generally) with the "real prod. codes", so it's pretty much a distinction without a difference.

So, if this IP doesn't have an alternate source, and can't produce the "real prod. codes" from the show's own (end-)credits, then they don't have a leg to stand on – using TFC meets WP:V, and that's all that matters... If they persist, bring in someone like myself, or Amaury, or Geraldo Perez in, and we'll back you up with this IP. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 00:29, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

P.S. I still think this article should be moved to Group Chat (talk show), but I'm in no position right now to shepherd a WP:RM on it! --IJBall (contribs • talk) 00:31, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

Please fix these links immediately

what links to Special Report (Fox News program) as you have assigned them TOP priority for repair as really bad errors. So I stop being annoyed when I see them highlighted in red in my browser, which is what that template does. This distracts my attention from other matters I view as far more important needs to be addressed. Thanks, wbm1058 (talk) 17:37, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

This strikes me as a template editor issue. I am not using the template incorrectly – it is "incorrect disambiguation" as per WP:NCTV. Perhaps this template needs to be "split" into one that covers incorrect disambigation as per guidelines, and another for more serious "errors" such as typographical ones... But, bottom line: This isn't an editorial issue, it's a template problem. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:42, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

OK, sorry for my rant. This is something I've been letting get under my skin for a while. The issue traces back to this change to User:Anomie's linkclassifier.js which is called from User:Wbm1058/vector.js. I specify the colors in User:Wbm1058/vector.css which has been broken ever since linked-misspellings and linked-miscapitalisations were merged into incorrect-title. So, rather than edit war with Anomie over the configuration of his link classifier I'll just fork that to a copy that suits me in my own user space. Sorry to bother you. – wbm1058 (talk) 19:58, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

That sounds... complicated. I'm afraid when it comes to the "coding" side of things, I'm not much help (though I know a few other editors who are knowledgeable about such things!). But I'm glad that it sounds like there is a "personalization" solution to this issue. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:01, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

Yes, it's complicated which is why it's taken me a year to get around to making the effort to fix it more to my liking. I'm not really proficient in CSS and JavaScript (not an everyday user) though I can muddle my way around and figure out how to tweak this stuff. The link classifier is a really nifty gnome-editor's tool, when used in conjunction with WP:NAVPOPS. If you're curious to try it documentation is at User:Anomie/linkclassifier. And I'm just now remembering the discussion where I left this issue: User talk:Anomie/linkclassifier#Some suggestions. Anyhow, thanks for (indirectly) motivating me to finally getting around to fixing my setup. – wbm1058 (talk) 20:35, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

Jimmy Neutron episodes Again

Hello, I see that you had dropped a line on Geraldo’s talk page last July about the episode guide of the Nickelodeon series on production codes which was already discussed. (and now archived) And here we are, when I rummaged through the episodes I noticed that series premier When Pants Attack was released on a date of June 21, 2002... which obviously slipped out from one of those date vandals. Not correct and also very wrong in so many levels additionally being seen in the main article. Mind keeping a watchful eye on these, if they persist a request at WP:RfPP would be imminent. Lastly, I will come back to make small contributions now and then. Sorry to bother.

Lights out,

67.81.161.226 (talk) 03:28, 4 October 2020 (UTC)

Daniella Perkins

@Geraldo Perez: Brought to you by Starklinson. Again. Amaury • 14:39, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Hanna

Hello! I saw that you edited on Hanna a while back, so I'm assuming you've seen the series – I may be wrong, but hopefully not. Mia Jenkins played a character called Danielle Marks in 6 episodes of the series, but isn't listed in the cast section. I'd do it, but I haven't seen the series, so I don't know what section she would go in or a description of her character. Would you be able to help me out? Thank you! – DarkGlow (talk) 10:27, 6 October 2020 (UTC)

@DarkGlow: Danielle Marks was a very minor character – she was basically Hanna's rival at The Meadows (the training school for the teen girl assassins), but she either got no lines of dialogue or very, very few. I considered adding her to the list myself, but I determined that the character was too minor. However, if Danielle Marks appears again in season #3 (which is possible), then I would probably support adding her to the 'UTRAX' part of the cast list then, because it's likely she'll be a more significant character if that happens. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:14, 6 October 2020 (UTC)

P.S. Thank you for reminding me about this article – I should probably put it on my watchlist, as IP editors keep on adding incorrect or low-quality and frivolous content to the article... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:18, 6 October 2020 (UTC)

It's ok – on a different note, I just wanted to inform you of 91.110.157.177 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · http · block user · block log), they're an IP that is purposely making MOS:ACCESS violations on articles, and I have my suspicions that they are a dynamic IP of an editor I've been rollbacking for months. – DarkGlow (talk) 21:52, 6 October 2020 (UTC)

It's not considered a "MOS:ACCESS" violation anymore (MOS:ACCESS has regretably walked away from the issue, despite this being a "bigger" access issue than just text-to-speach readers), but these changes can still be reverted on a WP:STYLEVAR basis, and I think there is no reason to accept poor use of rowspan that makes tables harder to read just because some IP's are disruptively pushing it... So, yeah – if you can make a case that there's rangeblock that's needed to stop this clear WP:DE, please do! --IJBall (contribs • talk) 00:06, 7 October 2020 (UTC)

That IP is back at it again, in mass. I've reported them and their range before, and it's hit-and-miss whether they get blocked each time. – DarkGlow (talk) 17:35, 7 October 2020 (UTC)

PAW Patrol

Could you take a look at that article. Same editor as The Cleveland Show. Dubious edits in my opinion adding unsourced and inappropriate content to article and infobox but I can't edit it any more. Geraldo Perez (talk) 00:06, 14 October 2020 (UTC)

@Geraldo Perez: None of that was good, so I've reverted and left another Level 4 UW on their Talk page. I would say if they do anything again at either article, try taking it to WP:AIV, and then if that doesn't work you and AussieLegend should take this it WP:ANI. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:17, 14 October 2020 (UTC)

@Geraldo Perez: You may want to check that this editor isn't just a sock of Kingkobra775 (who was blocked on Oct. 11) – the fact that they both show up at Scaredy Squirrel (TV series) and have similar user names gives me pause... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:53, 15 October 2020 (UTC)

Danger Force

Looks like you already took care of the warning, so next disruptive edit should probably be taken to AIAV. Amaury • 18:44, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Breanna Yde moved to YDE (singer-songwriter)

This is quite suspicious, as there is no consensus whatsoever for this move. (Shouldn't a talk page discussion precede this?) I'm thinking this move should be reverted (unless there's something I'm not aware of concerning Yde). MPFitz1968 (talk) 01:21, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

It's an obvious promotional account. Amaury • 01:31, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

Looks like this has been sorted. If anything like this happens again, I would advise reporting it. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:02, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

The Astronauts

No clue when this series will be getting an article (it's premiering November 13), but just wanting to let you know that there are already two redirects in place: The Astronauts (2020 TV series) and The Astronauts (TV series). Magitroopa (talk) 17:27, 23 October 2020 (UTC)

Yep. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 17:29, 23 October 2020 (UTC)

Invitation to WikiProject Current Events

Hello. I wanted to invite you to the Wikipedia:WikiProject Current events as you have done edits on Portal:Current events. Most editors aren't aware that the project became active again in April 2020. Just wanted to inform you about that and hope you join. Elijahandskip (talk) 18:51, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

Just commenting to say that I have seen this, and am considering it, though I will likely be following the WP Current events page whether I join the project or not... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 06:10, 24 October 2020 (UTC)

Do it right

Hi IJBall, I recommend you not leave edit summaries that merely say "Do it right" without explanation, which you seem to be prone to doing, to avoid coming across as uncivil. --Iiii I I I (talk) 05:18, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

The edit (the diff) itself is its own explanation. And it's not "uncivil". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:14, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Emily Hampshire edit

Hello. I noticed your edit on Emily Hampshire's wikipedia page. Can you please point me to a direct link where it says IMDb is not to be used for biography information on Wikipedia? Thank you. 173.179.1.99 (talk) 18:17, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

I literally did in the edit summary: WP:IMDB/BLP. In fact, IMDb should pretty much never be used as anything other than an 'External link'. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:19, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Referencing

What do you mean I poorly referenced Jet Jurgensmeyer??? I specifically added a source and cited it. Did I do something wrong? LocalContributor281 (talk) 06:45, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

WP:NOTRS – not all "sources" are the same, esp. for WP:BLP bio info. See also WP:DOB. Not just any source can be used for that – it needs to be a high quality source, or a social media post from the subject as per WP:ABOUTSELF. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:15, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Okay, so we need to talk about this. I have cited info from an interview from him where all the info I put he stated to be true. I'm pretty sure everything I put is facts and is confirmed. Why do you feel the need to always revert my changes to the article? LocalContributor281 (talk) 15:33, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

See: WP:YOUTUBE – YouTube videos are generally not usable for inline citations, esp. for WP:BLP info. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:34, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Please have a look at the videos and you'll see that he legitimately confirms it, especially from his official channel in February of 2019. After you watch them, tell me what's wrong. Sounds good? LocalContributor281 (talk) 15:37, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Notice of edit warring noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Wikipedia's policy on edit warring. The thread is Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:LocalContributor281 reported by User:Amaury (Result: ). Thank you. Amaury • 16:43, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

Apology About Heated Edit War

I apologize that I kept reverting back my changes and said a couple of harsh things. It's just been so agitating that in the past, I legitimately help, but everyone pushes my thoughts to the side, like Peteforsyth constantly does. Can you forgive me, and if so, can we please compromise? LocalContributor281 (talk) 18:42, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

You have to listen to what people are telling you. Things go badly on Wikipedia to editors who don't listen to others. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:43, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

I did listen. I listened in the past, but everyone wants to be a fascist and they keep telling me I'm wrong and they keep threatening to block me and it seems like they are getting a kick out of it. You told me that I needed to cite reliable info, which I did. What did I do? LocalContributor281 (talk) 18:44, 30 October 2020 (UTC)