User talk:Orfeocookie/List of compositions by Vagn Holmboe

Comment

Thanks for showing me the draft.

I expect you are aware of Category:Lists of compositions by composer. This has many examples, most of them rather simple ones.

I'd recommend using a sortable list or lists similar to List of compositions by Richard Wagner. Obviously you could decide how many columns to have.

Please see Wikipedia:WikiProject_Classical_music/Guidelines#Opus_numbers_and_catalog_numbers where it explains about opus numbers etc. We put a space after No. and Op.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any questions. Best. --Kleinzach 03:03, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments. I am quite keen on doing a sortable list. However, my main concern at the moment is that the most natural first column - the 'Meta' number from the comprehensive catalogue - is something I am lacking some entries for at this point.

I may actually start with the 'list by genre' version and try to add the sortable list later.

I will let you know when I think my page is getting somewhere close to being ready to release 'into the wild', as I have no experience and might be deluded as to whether it's good enough to release. Orfeocookie (talk) 08:28, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

Hope it's OK to move the conversation here . . . I've been thinking about this, and I'm inclined to think one (completely sortable on each column) list would be best. Obviously the data would not be complete for each column but I don't think that matters. Presumably the meta number would be the first column on the left? Anyway let me know what you come up with! --Kleinzach 09:00, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

Moving here is fine. Wasn't sure who could see what in different locations!

I've been having a look at one of the sortable lists I'm familiar with and which might be roughly comparable List_of_compositions_by_Antonín_Dvořák. I find the results useful for some sorts but not others - specifically, genre and scoring don't always produce what I would think is a helpful result. I will still try creating a list but I'm going to continue with the manual sorting by genre as well. Orfeocookie (talk) 10:00, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

On further reflection, I might try building the list, and reducing the genre description to something more of a summary. For example, just saying 13 symphonies rather than listing them separately. I can probably get all the information I'm worried about losing that way. Or, possibly, I can move that sort of information into the main Vagn Holmboe article as part of a tidy up of the list there. Might work on it on this page, with a view to possibly revising that other article at a later stage. Orfeocookie (talk) 10:13, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

You may already know this, but it is possible to put in invisible sort tags to influence the way the sort is done. (The Dvorak list uses these tags.) --Kleinzach 10:51, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

Table progress

The table is slowly growing. I think I'm happy with the way it's developing. For the time being I'm putting the works where I don't know the Meta number at the end. However, once I've done all the entries, I will delete any lines with just a Meta number and no other information, and insert the 'non-Meta' entries into appropriate chronological positions. Of course the table is sortable in any case, but this will be the way the table appears initially. Orfeocookie (talk) 08:15, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

If the date is more significant than the M or opus number, you might decide to put that column on the left. Incidentally there is a script available to move the columns around automatically. Let me know if you want to do that. --Kleinzach 11:47, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, I will keep that in mind. The M number is the most significant, the only reason for not sorting entirely by M number is a lack of data. I don't have the complete list of M numbers at present. And apparently, to find it I either need to buy a book or travel to a library in Germany, the UK or California! (I'm in Australia)

The M numbers are chronological, so year of composition is a proxy where I don't know the exact number. I could make an educated guess about many of the missing M numbers, but it would be exactly that - a guess. Not suitable for an encylopaedia. Orfeocookie (talk) 02:47, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

I think some of the people on WP:CM have library access so you could ask them to check specific items. Anyway if the M column is the most significant that's fine. Quite a number of other lists put opus numbers in the left-most column, which is basically the same thing. --Kleinzach 10:17, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

Table data entry complete / remaining tasks

Table has as much data as I am comfortable with - I did not include some entries where I have cause for doubt about the accuracy. Surplus rows have been deleted and the items where I don't have the M number have been slotted in approximately the right place for now.

Tasks I can think of: 1. Fix the sorting in the Opus column, so that it behaves numerically. 2. Clean up the references I've included for specific rows. 3. Add more general references to my sources:

• Grove
• 1974 edition of Rapoport's catalogue
• Wilhelm Hansen's Holmboe page
• Dacapo records Holmboe page
• BIS records Holmboe search results?
• Earsense chamber music Holmboe page.

Orfeocookie (talk) 07:15, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Looks good — maybe good enough to move to article space now? --Kleinzach 07:42, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks! Almost, not quite but getting pretty close - also need to clean up the top part. Is there a specific method for moving to article space, or do I just create a new page and copy the material across? Orfeocookie (talk) 08:51, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

You just create a red link e.g List of compositions by Vagn Holmboe. Click on it and then cut and paste the contents over to it. (You should delete the copy in userspace.) --Kleinzach 09:22, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

LAUNCHED! Orfeocookie (talk) 03:54, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

Great! I've done a few minor edits, but I'll sign off now. Good luck. --Kleinzach 08:09, 9 January 2012 (UTC)