SiroCallimaco

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Please remember to sign your messages on talk pages by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or , and a volunteer should respond shortly. Again, welcome! Qaei ☎ 10:41, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

Machiavelli and Plato

Hi. Concerning your proposed addition, I have heard such arguments about a hidden influence of Aristotle, who we still don't mention, but do you have any published source for Plato being such an influence? In any case both proposals are somewhat controversial, and not simple/straightforward? I think it is often considered likely that Machiavelli had no Greek.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 06:47, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Hello, yes I believe Aristotle should be added too. I don't believe these are controversial, as there are references not only to both ancient authors but many secondary sources which state without a doubt that Machiavelli was influenced by them. As an example, Leo Strauss, whose book on Machiavelli shows how de departed from the ancients and their "imaginary republics." SiroCallimaco (talk) 04:03, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Yes he did, but how is showing that someone departed from someone the same as showing that they were influenced by them? All we need to assume is knowledge of the common Scholastic thinking on these matters, let alone Plutarch, Polybius etc. But perhaps you are saying that he was influenced by Plato and Aristotle indirectly (for example through Plutarch, Polybius, and Scholastics)? If so then I think the question arises as to whether this is the way to use these summary boxes surely? And the same question arises if you are saying that he is influenced in a negative way, ie that he saw someone as wrong?--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 07:50, 7 June 2018 (UTC)