User talk:Supparluca/Archive 2007

Requested moves

I re-opened the discussion on the move of Trentino-South Tyrol and South Tyrol. If you want to say your opinion, you're welcome. --Checco 07:54, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I have re-opened again as well. Taalo 10:42, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Motion to close mediation

A very important note. This mediation offer concerned the greater overall naming convention to use in this region, not just the name of the region itself. We came up with a very good compromise for the regional name itself. I for one am still looking forward for Lar to help us out. Taalo 21:33, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Hey, welcome back

Good to see you back Supparluca. I think it is fine to use Province of Bolzano-Bozen and Bolzano (Bozen) though. This fits general convention for dual-language communities like in Canada. Icsunonove 22:03, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

I got your message. I had the userid taalo, but from how a lot of these people act, i wanted to just be away from this wp. but, overall, i guess i still can't throw away my idealistic side. so i rebirth with a more serious account. at least i made a more detailed user page. :} Icsunonove 17:28, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Placename conventions

Hi, thank you for your message. I appreciated that you explained your point of view. I was not aware that a consensus had been reached about the naming convention that you described, but I'll be most glad to stick to the rule in my next contributions. I would probably prefer a "dual name" convention (Bolzano/Bozen, Helsinki/Helsingfors, Biel/Bienn) but I understand that many entries would become excessively complicated to read. Also, it seems to me that the naming convention (one main placename used in the heading and the corpus of the entry, other placenames quoted in the first line) should be used consistently. Therefore, it has been Bolzano and Brixen (or Meran), otherwise we're facing a classic case of double standard. I would like to point out that I'm not at all interested to participate in an exchange of opposite POVs about everything that lies between Brennerpass/Passo del Brennero and Salurn/Salorno. I think that a neutral and "politically correct" wording is a very wise solution that clears the way from any charge of "Italian POV" in these entries. By the way, I've been adding some improvements in style and vocabulary to the entry about South Tyrol because the existing text in English was a bit weak at some points. Any feedback will be appreciated. Take care, FrancescoMazzucotelli 14:19, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

RfC on Gryffindor

Lets put in a formal request. I saw he is doing more admin abuse while I was on break. This is not proper to constantly use admin powers to push his strange nationalism. Icsunonove 07:49, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Blizzard Entertainment

I reinstated your reverts of my edits on Blizzard Entertainment, with explanation here. --Voidvector 07:00, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

move request

Hey Supparluca, Do you mind checking out TN for a move request? We have to talk sometime too about finally getting a fair solution for the T-AA/ST debacle. Icsunonove 01:05, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Saw your vote, lets debate a bit then. :-) I think the case is that TN and BZ are the two provinces in Italy that have this Autonomous Province of... title, that is why I think it is worth noting. Plus, when I listen to the online radio from the area, I hear them all the time say Provincia autonoma di Trento after they make some advertisement about visiting Trentino. So maybe I heard it so many times, now I want it to be right on English Wikipedia too. :P Anyway, do reconsider. Icsunonove 11:27, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

I think you'll like my reply on the TN page. hah. Icsunonove 17:10, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Isarco

Please check the talk page, we made a mistake in the move. More Italian speakers surround the river. Icsunonove 22:27, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

the conversations on this page remind me of why I really dislike this whole debate and a lot of the people involved. :( I feel sorry for you, someone who lives in BZ, that there are people that act/think like this. I was reading some stuff on unionfs, and was completely shocked; but then it fits very well with the mentality of many people I see on here. I applied their criteria using correct mathematics, and I feel I get bashed. Icsunonove 20:28, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

SVP

AndreasJS pointed me to this: [1] Had you seen this? Is the SVP actually hoping to erase all the Roman/Italian names? O_O Icsunonove 00:41, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the information. I hope they have a good purpose, this SVP. Ilario makes me laugh when he said you must be new. :-) I remember Emes saying once they met in Bolzano and discussed everything and came up with the method they will use. I just find it very funny that a few Wikipedians can get together and think they have decided for the World. :-) They are but a few people with their own opinion. Still, you see people like Emes, his opinion is just on the hyper-extreme; no concept of really compromise, sharing, or even being half way relaxed. :)) Anyway, if you know some good editors, do ask them to come over and discuss. It would be nice if we can get more fresh ideas. Icsunonove 17:27, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

BZ

By the way, do you want to go ahead and put in a request to move South Tyrol to Province of Bolzano-Bozen and History of South Tyrol to History of Alto Adige/Südtirol? Icsunonove 17:32, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I guess you are right it is too early. Already people go a bit crazy over the names of rivers in Italy. I would personally prefer Province of Bolzano-Bozen, but second best would be Province of Bolzano. Both are correct actually, I just feel the first has more chance since it is in the Encyclopedia Brittanica, and it is multilingual (so people won't make accusations of fascists erasing Germans...). For the history page, I think History of Alto Adige/Südtirol (or History of Alto Adige/South Tyrol) would be better, because then it matches History of Trentino and Trentino-Alto Adige/Südtirol. Also, I don't think it is fair to only use South Tyrol, because the other valid English name is Alto Adige. There shouldn't have to be this constant appeasement to these angry people. You know what, the term South Tyrol still in some ways sounds funny to me, because shouldn't the real "South" Tyrol be Trentino? :)) I'm sorry, but Südtirol is more Middle or Central Tyrol..hah. At least the term Alto Adige is a real thing -- here is a river, and it starts in BZ. :) Anyway, funny stuff. Icsunonove 19:55, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

I agree it may be better to let the dust settle a little. SL, I also tend to agree that double names may not be the best idea generally, but this case may be an exception. I'm not sure. However, before proposing the move, we should best settle on one version (Province of Bolzano, or Province of Bolzano-Bozen). It'd make consensus on a move even more difficult to reach with more than two options. —AldeBaer (c) 09:19, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, agree on both points. Let the dust settle and come up with an initial consensus on Bolzano versus Bolzano-Bozen. More so, I agree that even if there are so-called conventions, they can be broken. I think this is a very good case where having a double name is a good solution and even has Brittanica has a reference. Also, I can easily predict that if it isn't a dual name we are going to have to hear all sorts of nasty stuff again (i.e., as was the case on Adige, etc.). Icsunonove 23:23, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Isarco/Eisack

The admin who closed the move request messaged me at my talk page that we can request a review. I do believe the arguments made for a move far outweigh those against. In fact, the only arguments against were from Matthead, and which were quite baseless. Icsunonove 20:46, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Provinces of Italy

Hello, could you help with the user Rarelibra, I found you have had discussions with him before. It is unreasonable what he does on this page and what he says at South Tyrol. 71.109.183.44 07:50, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Province of Bolzano-Bozen

Hi Supparluca, I think we can go ahead and ask now to have the pages renamed since they have split, eh? We can do the province page first. Do you have a preference for Province of Bolzano, Province of Bolzano-Bozen, or Province of Bolzano/Bozen? I prefer the second since it is in Encyclopedia Brittanica. The first is probably more common English usage though, and is in the official translation of the autonomy statute. The last is also given on the BZ official webpage. I'll ask Aldebaer and Checco also to comment here. Thanks! Icsunonove 17:34, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

HAH! Saw your message, and good point. AldeBaer and Checco, please go to the discussion I've setup on the talk page. I've asked AndreasFS to join us as well, and I imagine others will chime in. Icsunonove 18:00, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

• did you see what rarelibra did now. [2]. I swear people really act bizarre on this encyclopedia. I came in on Monday morning, saw an edit war, and even went and added his reference. I just pointed out no editors support this Bozen-South Tyrol thing, and I guess the result is some users throwing all their toys out of the pram. Icsunonove 18:46, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

ok, now pmanderson is going insane.. o_O O_o o_O Icsunonove 21:33, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

I can't think of how to have information to fit on three artcles, it will really get confusing. Two is really enough. Also, it is unacceptable to just have South Tyrol. If there is a page describing the region it has to be Alto Adige/South Tyrol or Alto Adige/Südtirol. Any other way is just incorrect, considering Alto Adige is used more often in English. Icsunonove 21:55, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Lake Resia

Gryffindor and Emes may not be around lately contributing, but Matthead certainly is. Check out Lake Resia; he is making a German page (and even in German! :-). It is hilarious. This lake in English is definitely known as Lake Resia; not Reschensee, Lago di Resia, or Lake Reschen. Anyway, hopefully he is just planning a translation and then to move the page to the proper location. I see the German article has some nice POV too.. hah. The Italian article is actually much more reasonable and neutral. Icsunonove 19:29, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

I fixed it, and put a new article. :-) Icsunonove 20:15, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Provincia autonoma di Bolzano - Alto Adige

Did you see what someone did on the IT Wiki? It is really strange. Why can't they just use Provincia autonoma di Bolzano or Provincia di Bolzano? They already say later in the article that the provincial government likes to use the - "Alto Adige, etc." on their papers. I can't believe how long they have made the article title now. :-) Icsunonove 21:34, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

By the way, I saw this was a fairly newly registered editor that did this. If you have an account on IT Wikipedia, maybe you can put it back to something more sensible (i.e., short) like it:Provincia_autonoma_di_Bolzano. Icsunonove 08:24, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

South Tyrol location

Now that South Tyrol has been moved to Province of Bolzano-Bozen, if you care, please add your opinion on the future of South Tyrol here: Talk:Province_of_Bolzano-Bozen#Whither_South_Tyrol.3F. — AjaxSmack 00:28, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Gryffindor

This guy is... incredible... Icsunonove 19:58, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

I think Rarelibra wants you to post your ciricululum vitae. :-) For the best of me I can't see why these guys can't accept shared solutions. They must be only childs.. Icsunonove 18:44, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

I think Rarelibra has been drinking a whole lot of Gryffindor's Kool Aid these past few months. I don't know what is wrong with us that we don't like them using only Trentino-South Tyrol and Province of Bozen-South Tyrol (or just South Tyrol), and the total erasure of all Italic language names along with Alto Adige. I guess we are not culturally aware? :-) If Gryffindor was left on his own it would simply be still Trentino-South Tyrol, and maybe autonomous state of South Tyrol - with all Italian/Roman/Ladin names gone. They need to go back and learn how to share. :-) Icsunonove 21:24, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Gryffindor

Is at it again. I think it is time for the long needed RfC and investigation of his abuses. Icsunonove 05:20, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

• I think we finally need to create a subpage where we can go back through the history and list every little Administrative abuse Gryffindor has made (as well as current and future). I will put in plenty of my free hours to work on this. I had hoped to finally be able to put time into the T-AA/ST articles, but this is much more important. I take it very personally how he has abused his privileges, especially when it comes to the region T-AA/ST. There are quite a few of the other editors that will contribute their time to this investigation. The only thing we should feel bad about is not doing this a long, long time ago to stop him from laying down this abuse to other editors and projects as well. Please drop by my page to discuss and think about where to setup a page. Icsunonove 05:42, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Good job. I alerted plenty of Admins as well. The discussions on the BZ talk page were really good and productive this past month and then all of a sudden Rarelibra and Gryffindor came in attacking. Hopefully Lar can actually sit and babysit us all and get this back to being productive. Anyway, is there something I can do with regard to that report you made? Icsunonove 18:31, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Gryffindor again

He is going through and reverting edits again.. o_O He also included a "straw poll" at the Province of BZ page; one I think is good to boycott. Hopefully it will just be him and himself, only. hah. Icsunonove 05:03, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

I fixed a good deal of his vandalism. He even tried to have some pages deleted, but a keen-eyed Administrator nixed his idea. :-) [3][4][5] He is going more nutz than when his Trentino-South Tyrol "thing" came to an end.. By the way, any thoughts on my question about having his Administrative status reviewed? Icsunonove 06:05, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Hah, hilarious addition to the PofB-B talk page. :)) With regard to the investigation, I see what you mean. Well, I'll see at first what I can start gathering myself. At least the major history like moving Trentino-Alto Adige to Trentino-South Tyrol without consensus, what he did at Merano and Province of Trento, etc., etc. Icsunonove 08:22, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Mediation

Hi Supparluca, do you think we should just place a formal request for mediation for this page and the general naming convention of places in BZ? It gets boring to see this Gryffindor-poll again. I think having a dedicated group to help sort things out would be best. Frankly, if they decide to use Trentino-Alto Adige and Province of Bolzano because they are most common English usage, I won't care anymore. I tried to have us go with a solution that was fair, neutral and bi-lingual.. but look at what we get? Icsunonove 00:57, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Trolling

Hi Supparluca, he is just trolling now. He isn't countering any of the arguments that have been made, instead he just makes insults. It is nice how he especially so irritated by me. :-) Anyway, he defends PhJ because he knows that neither PhJ or himself are going to make a logical and civil debate on the topic. I give him information that counters his claim, and his response is to make more insults. So, let him stay at his own level if that is what he wants. Worse case, and since you know better than I, maybe you can post an alert about his behavior. It is simply uncivil the way he is behaving on the discussion page right now; surprising though? no! ;] Icsunonove 09:17, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I saw how he scorched the redirect. I havn't seen an Admin be warned as often as Gryffindor is warned. It is always this type of really unethical behavior. I don't understand why the project doesn't simply take a stand against this sort of behavior. De-opping isn't enough; a good long ban is in measure. No matter what I feel with regard to Gryffindor personally, any Administrator abusing his privileges like this should be gone. I believe many Admins are aware of his behavior; I don't know if they simply do not want to "rock the boat". boh.. Icsunonove 09:34, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

• ps. he did this here too Eisack. It is funny he states that he is so supportive of the language-naming criteria. Yet, I showed clearly that this river is in the region of more speakers of Italian. Is that supported? nope! :-) Icsunonove 09:44, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Sudtirolo

Hi Supparluca, on the PofB-B page, we added Sudtirolo under Italian. I know this is not proper Italian though. Should we add the term colloquial? I think it is incorrect to imply that Sudtirolo is correct Italian usage. Icsunonove 06:41, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

PofB-B

Did you like PhJ's reply? :-) You know what, at least our side of the debate has been based off of quantitative evidence and logical discussions. The ST debate has just been nationalistic aggression, again and again and again and again. I'm really glad that we never had anyone coming on here and saying "It has to be Alto Adige, I warn you!". It is too bad the "other side" can't open their minds to see that. Icsunonove 23:19, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

so...

Romans aren't Italians. The last one died 1'480 years ago. After the fall of Rome hundreds of peoples settled in Italy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.8.109.14 (talk) 02:25, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Then you believe that the people of Rome simply vanished into thin air? Of course the people of Italy are a great mix of Etruscans, Greeks, Germans, now Chinese. If you believe the Roman people just vanished though, that is extremely funny. Do you think the Germans, French, or British are some "pure" race? Anyway, so the person who had been trolling Supparluca ([6]) was you Hannes? Icsunonove 00:14, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Progetto:Warcraft

Ciao, su it.wiki ti interesserebbe la partecipazione ad un progetto su Warcraft? Skywolf 19:59, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Ciao, grazie per la segnalazione, ma non mi interessa la wikipedia italiana.--Supparluca 07:25, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Barnstar

		Barnstar of National Merit Italy
		I hereby award you this Barnstar for your work on articles related to our great country Italy. noclador 07:02, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

Comments on Siusi all Sciliar

Please reply on my talk page for the following comment if you wish to do so.

Regarding the Siusi allo Sciliar change to the FIL European Luge Natural Track Championships and FIL European Luge Natural Track Championships 1977, I like what you did. What I need to remind you is that if you make a change in the name to the venue, please make certain to go through all of the medalists and locations in the tables where the respective championships. I am asking this in the name of consistency. Thank you. Chris 19:07, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

South Tyrol disambiguation (here we go again)

Hello, I would like to hear your opinion on a possible different disambiguation concerning the term South Tyrol. The naming dispute for the Province of Bolzano-Bozen has been exhausting and I think that the current compromise is fine, although I might have preferred a forward slash (Bolzano/Bozen) rather than a hyphen. Since the linguistic majority of the province is German (as Icsunonove correctly points out here), it might also be possible to invert the names (Province of Bozen/Bolzano). After all, this is the convention used for instance in the article Åboland, where the Swedish place name comes first, and the Finnish one after. (We already discussed this topic, see earlier here on your talk page.) However, the naming dispute has been so long and "acidic" that it seems useless and not constructive to flame it again.
What I find unsatisfactory is the redirection from South Tyrol to Province of Bolzano-Bozen. I propose something as follows:

South Tyrol (German: Südtirol) may refer to:

• the areas of the County of Tyrol (part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire) south of the Alpine divide, including the Italian-speaking areas of Trentino, in past times also known as Welschtirol in German.
• the German-speaking part of the County of Tirol that was annexed to the Kingdom of Italy in 1918.
• the Autonomous Province of Bolzano-Bozen, a political subdivision of the Republic of Italy, which is also known as Alto Adige (lit. "Upper Adige") in Italian and Südtirol (lit. "South Tyrol") in German.

I think that this suggested disambiguation is informative, balanced and reasonably neutral. This version relates to the current articles Tyrol, History of Alto Adige/South Tyrol and Province of Bolzano-Bozen, so any reader can find the information that matches his/her interests. This version also seems quite language-balanced. I would really like to hear your opinion.
Best regards, FrancescoMazzucotelli 19:06, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

My proposal is now on the talk page of Province of Bolzano-Bozen. You are welcome to add your comments there. Best regards, FrancescoMazzucotelli 19:21, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

again

I see army boy is back... It is only entertaining to see how well he was brain-washed by Gryffindor. Yes, of course, the page at South Tyrol was neutral, but the province of Bolzano-Bozen -- with every name in existence in the first paragraph -- is not neutral and "Italo-centric". Man, it has been a busy week, and then I get to read this nonsense again... Icsunonove 04:45, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

ani board

you must see what is going on now on the ANI board. [7] Icsunonove 07:32, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Province of Bolzano-Bozen

Hello and thanks for your positive comment. My rewriting attempt stemmed exactly from the concern that any improvement of the article has been derailed for a long time by a seemingly endless naming dispute. So I thought that we may confine the debate (which is interesting and meaningful) to a specific paragraph, where all the different naming conventions and their cultural/political significance and connotations can be discussed and explained.
Unfortunately, it looks like some users are not satisfied by this proposal [8] [9]. Best regards, FrancescoMazzucotelli 02:05, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

hey

I saw what that guy wrote on Francesco's page "Francesco - my honest reply is I have no more opinion or comment. I have no more interest nor intent - other than to ensure that the terms of both myself and Icsunonove permanently staying away from the page is upheld.". Does he believe he is some sort of police? Icsunonove (talk) 08:57, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Ok, yeah, I see you are correct. I noticed he had apologized for the behavior, and that was a welcome gesture. But this above looks like he wants to somehow take me out from topics I'm interested in. That would be like me pushing that issue with regard to legal threats so that I can take him out from doing maps (something he is interested in). Crude. Anyway, with regards to Future's proposal; it would be nonsense really to eliminate people from contributing. In that case he can't just single out two editors, he'd have to ask also for quite a few other editors (which I guess I won't name :-). Anyway, I like overall how Francesco added to the BZ page, eh? Later on I will add some more references/clarification from the Ladin perspective. Then hopefully we can add more to the actual interesting parts of the TN and BZ pages on geography, tourism, etc. I still believe we have a very fair and neutral solution on that page.. Icsunonove (talk) 20:57, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

look at this

Isn't it comforting to see such discussions on this project [10]? Anyway, we continue putting down good work and they can be as sour as they want, for as long as they want. Hypocrisy at its finest. Icsunonove (talk) 18:38, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

• will they ever leave me alone? [11] Icsunonove (talk) 19:20, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
• Oh yeah, and I found this [12]. What is wrong with people in this World, everyone red with anger all the time? So this guy feels that unless someone supports only the usage of the name South Tyrol, they are a (probably unconscious) fascist. *roll eyes* It seems those fascists back then were successful, because they have got both a father and now son holding hatred. Icsunonove (talk) 20:57, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
  • You have got to read what he continues to write on that ANI board, it is just surreal. :-) I'm going to just do a topic ban, on him. :) cya, Icsunonove (talk) 22:48, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

your counter

How do you get that to work on your main page? Do you have to create this User contributions page? Icsunonove (talk) 21:32, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Got it, thanks. By the way Supparluca, your English is much better than just "2". Icsunonove (talk) 23:20, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

names section

Check it out, I've tried to add as much information as I know of. :-) Now I think *every* term is there except maybe Chinese... Icsunonove (talk) 00:37, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Bot de la dieta

Done ;) --Kontrol Z (talk) 21:34, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

UK topics

Hello,

Can I point out that the UK WikiProject doesn't acutally exist. The banner you've been adding only directs to the UK Wikipedian's noticeboard.

Instead, if the article is about a place or settlement in the United Kingdom, consider adding Template:WPUKgeo which is the UK geography Wikiproject banner. Thanks, -- Jza84 · (talk) 12:54, 23 December 2007 (UTC)