Sw258

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Lancs dialect

Hello. I'm glad to see that you've taken an interest in the article on Lancs dialect. I wrote the article originally, even though I'm actually from Yorkshire. There seems to be a lack of writing about Lancashire accents despite the pride in them.

I've added a source for the MOUTH /ʏ:/ symbol: page 359 in Wells' Accents of English. Would you say that this sound is not particularly common? Wells does suggest that is more typical of southern Lancashire. Is there anything else in the article that you think should be changed? I don't live in Lancashire, so I'm not sure how accurate it is. Epa101 (talk) 16:45, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

In response to your message, the main thing I think should be changed is the name of the article: to me, "Lancashire accent and dialect" sounds better than "Lancashire dialect and accent".

I've never heard the MOUTH vowel pronounced as /ʏ:/ in Lancashire (at least not by people born after ~1960) and the same is true of rhoticity regarding the Lancashire accent: it is (in my experience) much more commonly found in people born before ~1960, regardless of what part of Lancashire they are from.

Generally speaking, I've found that writing accurately about the speech of a particular county is very difficult as within any one area there is so much variation, so I suppose there is no reason why anything in the article is incorrect; I think it would be better just to give a general outline of what the general speech of Lancashire is like (contrasted with other Northern English English varieties) - on the whole it's a good article which offers a good general outline for the casual reader but for a detailed overview I'd suggest reading an academic book on the subject or actually going there.

Interesting response. I might give the article a revamp soon. There are a few sources that say that rhoticity in Lancashire is in decline, including Trudgill and Wells. I have known a few people born after the 1960s who have rhotic accents though. In the Rossendale area, not far from the Yorkshire boundary, it seems to be used by most people. A good example of this is the border town, Todmorden, which people from nearby Rossendale pronounce /ˈtɒdmərdən/.

An interesting thing is that the two points you mention, the MOUTH vowel and rhoticity, are two things that traditionally distinguished Lancashire from most of Yorkshire. It seems as if the two sides of the Pennines speak in very similar ways these days. The Wells test, mentioned in the article, might be the only thing left now to tell them apart.

Best wishes. Epa101 (talk) 20:32, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Fixing redirects

Thanks for your contributions. Just so you know, though, edits like this and this are usually not necessary; see WP:Do not "fix" links to redirects that are not broken for further information. rʨanaɢ (talk) 15:36, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

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