Tron55555

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Again, welcome! --Paul Siebert (talk) 16:55, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Spanish Civil War

Hi. Buck Privates. It's funny what's missing from that page, eh?
There was a lack of authority there once Dudeman stopped running it years ago.

With Spain, I know from engineering experience, the best practice is to keep things visible – so they receive the standard set of retrofits, whatever that is or will be – then you decide where to put them.
But if you personally want to start isolating Civil War-only films in a new table at the bottom, then that's fine with me.
Even if there is now a table somewhere else in Wikipedia, our table format will be better. Probably.
Now, I tend to be pretty careful about things so I would tend to read some plot descriptions in Spanish before declaring that a Spanish film has nothing to do with WWII. Do you read Spanish at all?
The page now has lots of problems, and the presence or absence of half a dozen Spanish films is not make or break.
I have been aware of this matter for ages.
Cheers, Varlaam (talk) 17:22, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

That 2010/2011 date of release

Hi, I don't think it is ever good to knowingly introduce an inconsistency, or a synchronization issue.
The IMDb date is based on first public screening, and that is reasonable. That has been the IMDb standard since the 1990s.
If you notice a problem here, then it's advisable to just deal with it generally. Otherwise someone else in the future will need to revisit the whole matter when you have already done that.
You have already looked into it; noticed a problem; decided to act. Therefore you should do everything, including fixing the main article.
If you need to rename an article, that's cool. If you need to request a move, that's cool.
Just follow through on what you have determined to be correct.
That doesn't mean today, necessarily, but in the next day or two, address the main article's problem too.
Cheers, Varlaam (talk) 16:40, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

Yes, my first instinct was to change the main page too, but, 1.) I thought I'd wait to see if you raised a problem with the edit, since I considered the possibility that Wikipedia may have a standard for using the wide-release date for films or something of that sort, and 2.) I don't know how to rename an article on Wikipedia. Obviously I can look into that and figure it out, but even if I do find out how to change it to "The Debt (2010 film)", what will happen to all the pages that have previously linked to it as "The Debt (2011 film)"? I assume Wikipedia has a way of handling this, since I'd imagine it'd be a very common problem otherwise, but I'm not a very experienced Wikipedian, and I didn't want to be the ignoramus who causes a bunch of problems on here, so I figured it would be better left in the hands of someone with more experience. I'll look into it all the same, though. If you have any input or advice on how to go about it, I'd be appreciative. I'm always trying to learn. Thanks. Tron55555 (talk) 12:47, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

Perfect.

I come from a family of professors and teachers, and people always guess I'm a prof.

Here we go.

Vigilance in WP has a lot to do with Watchers of a page and whether they care.

So a particular type of correction on one page will produce no reaction at all, while the exact same thing on a different page will get you into a bar brawl.

The inconsistency of WP is one of its weaknesses, I think.

And, of course, one of those WP rules states that one WP page cannot be used as a precedent for another WP page! Highly regulated chaos.

I still prefer the IMDb where data passes through a manager, he has a standard, he knows who is reliable and who is not. He trusts your competence. That's the IMDb.

So, speaking as an engineer, there's a human factors problem around here.

But, technically, things are much better.

They have anticipated your concerns and allowed for them!

Here's your paradigm:

Beside Search is an arrow thingy. That's a menu.

First item: Move. That's your cue.

You get a nice screen. You adjust your date.

Provide your justification. "IMDb records 2010 as the release date." Your words to that effect.

Accept the defaults as they are.

Two outcomes:

1) It works. Your new name becomes the real name; the old name becomes a special REDIR page. So every existing link anywhere passes through the REDIR page to your new page. So everywhere still works. Technically, very smooth.

2) It fails. This happens if your chosen new name already exists as a REDIR page. Unlikely in this instance. If this happens, it tells you how to remedy the problem (with a Move Request).

So you are chomping at the bit now?

Varlaam (talk) 17:48, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

P.S. Have you figured out how to edit quickly yet?

I would see guys edit a page in a minute, and it would take me 20 minutes to do the same thing.

Where is the hidden feature that those guys have got enabled?

Varlaam (talk)

No, I haven't figured out how to do much yet in regard to Wikipedia, as I'm sure you can tell. Seems like you edit pretty quickly by my standards, though, from what I've seen on the WWII film page. Then again, my standards are bound to be rather lax.

Anyways, I agree completely about Wikipedia's method. It's kind of an online anarchy. And I feel much the same about it as I do about the concept of anarchy. It's a nice idea, but in reality, it doesn't work. Anarchy is a great concept in a world where people can be trusted to be intelligent, competent, and sensible. Unfortunately, we don't live in that world. I like the IMDB method, as you described it, much better. Although, I will admit, Wikipedia works much better than I would have ever expected from a site that allows anyone to change anything at will. Maybe given enough time and success, Wikipedia could make a strong argument from the self-governance of mankind.

I've never really been a true Wikipedian, just a casual one. I never really intended to be one at all, but one can only use a site for so long, and so often, before he feels a moral obligation to contribute, no matter to how small of an extent. When I notice an error or something missing from a page that I'm referencing, I make a point to change it, but that's been the extent of my work here. That being said, your logic is sound on changing the main page for "The Debt", and I intend to follow through on it, and learn a few things in the process. I'm about to go to work on it this morning. I wish I could say that I've contributed to this site as much as I've referenced it, but that's just not true. Maybe one day that will change. I was sketchy on the idea of a site like Wikipedia for a long time, but I've really become a believer, so I appreciate those such as yourself who keep the place running, and in a tidy fashion nonetheless.

Thank you for your tutelage in the ways of moving/renaming a page. Very much appreciated.

Tron55555 (talk) 11:22, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

Okay, so I tried to move it, and it wouldn't let me because the page "The Debt (2010 film)" already exists. I checked it out and this page is simply a redirect to the "The Debt (2011 film)". There are two edits in the history section of the page, one fixing a double redirect, and the other is the redirect itself to the "The Debt (2011 film)" page. I know that what I need to do now is put in a move request, but I wasn't sure how. You can't edit the move request page directly; apparently you're supposed to add the request to the talk page of the page you're trying to move, so that's what I did. If you get a chance to visit the talk page for "The Debt (2011 film)" and want to let me know if I did it right, that'd be great. And what am I waiting for now, just for someone to come through and approve the move? Anyways, thanks for your time and help. It'll be nice to know how to do this in the future. Tron55555 (talk) 11:56, 21 June 2012 (UTC)