Westergaardhansen
Other kayakers
editThat's a different topic. Write or expand existing articles on those people, ask long as there are verifiable references to back up the information there shouldn't be any problems with notability. NtheP (talk) 15:27, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
You previously said I'm still very concerned that those who have done much more are not getting recognized as such and I've written above how you can do that. You do not achieve recognition for Freya Hoffmeister by running down someone else. You do it by expanding the article on her. I don't care how Helen Skelton would answer the question you posed but if you asked most people their answer is likely to be According to Guinness World Records, yes. We're back to the same issue - you don't appear to agree with how GWR define world records. If that's the case start a section in the article on GWR called Controversy or such like but I hope you have evidence to back your arguement or else you won't get far. For all you know you might be comparing apples with pears. If GWR have put a narrow defintion on Skelton's records e.g. paddled further in one journey than any other woman in the world on fresh water then you can't compare her trip with Hoffmeister's circumnavigation of Australia. NtheP (talk) 16:51, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
I've understood you from the beginning. However as it now stands the article is accurate. It does not misrepresent anyone else's postion either by omission or inclusion and it follows wikipedia's policy of maintaining a neutral point of view WP:NPOV. I'll repeat, yet again, the place to have a debate on what constitutes a world record is at articles about world records, not about people who hold world records. Think of boxing, there are at least five different federations all having their own version of a world title. An article on a boxer who has ever held one of these titles does not have a section pointing out that other world titles exist and why the one held is or is not the best. As long as the article makes it clear and is accurate that X holds the world title of Y organisation that is as far as it goes. The same applies here, it now clearly states that Helen Skelton holds 2 GWR and there is a link to GWR. If a reader wants to know more about GWR then they can read it in the appropriate article on GWR. Or if you don't want to take particular issue with GWR perhaps you ought to think about editing the article World record which most definitely gives the impression that GWR is the custodian of world records. As I've suggested before you can also create & expand articles on other female kayakers to highlight their achievements.
I have no idea what the full definitions are of the records GWR have ascribed to Skelton hence it reflects only what has been publically stated. If more information comes to light then it can be added in. NtheP (talk) 21:29, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
I don't monitor GWR to see when records change and as they don't display every record on their website I don't know how to. If you do, and the records currently 'held' Helen Skelton are passed to someone else then amend the helen Skelton article accordingly. If you do I suggest you word it as was awarded two records which have subsequently been broken by ... rather than omit any mention of them as it's undeniable that they were held by her, however meritorious or not you feel the awards are. I'd also suggest that you ensure any such amendment has a supporting citation so that some well meant but ill-informed editor reverts your edit. On your comment then we'll see how Ms. Skelton's claims are stated if you mean the wikipedia article, then it can be edited by anyone who knows some details have chanaged. If that is you, then do so. If you don't want to make the edit tell me and I'll do it - as long as you tell me (or supply me with) the supporting evidence that a new record has been verified. Please remember the wikipedia article is written about Helen Skelton not written by her and that everyone who edits wikipedia is a volunteer. NtheP (talk) 14:42, 2 April 2010 (UTC)