Wikipedia:Association of Members' Advocates/Requests/March 2007/Wood345

Case Filed On: 07:21, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedian filing request:

• Wood345 (talk · contribs)

Other Wikipedians this pertains to:

• Lukas19 (talk · contribs)

Wikipedia pages this pertains to:

• Talk:White_people#Mustafa_Hefny_Pic (edit | [[Talk:Talk:White_people#Mustafa_Hefny_Pic|talk]] | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Questions:

Have you read the AMA FAQ?

• Answer:Yes

How would you describe the nature of this dispute? (policy violation, content dispute, personal attack, other)

• Answer: Content Dispute

What methods of Dispute Resolution have you tried so far? If you can, please provide wikilinks so that the Advocate looking over this case can see what you have done.

• Answer: Trying a RFC.

What do you expect to get from Advocacy?

• Answer: Clarification of the issues related to fair use, WP:blp and to focus the argument away from an unrelated argument.

Summary:

Basic summary- is whether the picture should remain or be removed. The dispute is sandwiched between various issues, such as wikipedia policy, and a (what I think is an) unrelated argument between Lukas19 and other people leading to a removal of all exemplary white people. My point in this is that the Hefny picture is unrelated to this "exemplary white people" issue and deals with a specific area of U.S. definitions of white people (starting from the 70's) and how it supersedes, at times, self identification. However, if the picture is in breach of WP policy, then it should go.

More detail- Concerning the "exemplary picture" argument, Hefny's picture is also African, which is a cause of consternation. (Please see the development and changes in the argument points of Lukas19). I am not against more pictures, and feel that this article could use more unambiguous coverage of te different social definitions of what constitutes 'white.' The picture in dispute is under a subsection of a U.S. social categorization of white that includes people of North African (in this case, Egyptian) origin as part of the classification of White. This articles briefly outlines the efforts of the U.S. government in the 1970's to combine all federal categories of race uniform definitions. Hefny's struggle is that while he self-identifies as "black," he is categorized as "white" due to his Egyptian origin. Since the other pictures were eliminated due to the disputes of 'exemplary people' this is now the only picture on the page, and this has caused consternation with Lukas (see white, genetics, and Europeans [1] and pointing out Hefny's as a bad example due to his Africanness [2] [3] [4] ) This picture is illuminating a specific issue, unrelated to the previous argument on 'exemplary white people' and other examples should be brought forward to bring up the national/other variations in social definitions of white people.

Various issues, like BLP and Fair use have also come up. I don't feel the image is a violation of BLP since it is used in the exact manner from the CNN article. I'm not sure about Fair use. If it is indeed a violation of wikipedia rules, then those rules have to be followed.Wood345 07:21, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Followup:

When the case is finished, please take a minute to fill out the following survey:

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• Answer:

AMA Information

Case Status: NEW

Advocate Status:

• None assigned.