Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/2001 Football League First Division play-off Final/archive1
- The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.
The article was promoted by Gog the Mild via FACBot (talk) 9 July 2021 [1].
- Nominator(s): The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:09, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
This article is about the single most valuable association football match in the world. This one, played two decades back, was in the "Millennium Stadium-era" and winning the game was estimated to have been worth around £30 million. I'll address all constructive comments as soon as practicable, thanks in advance for your time. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:09, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
Image review - pass
edit- Image licensing looks good (t · c) buidhe 20:45, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
Support from ChrisTheDude
edit- Comments
- "while the clubs placed from third to sixth place" - any way to avoid that repetition?
- "scored a third with a run from inside his own half and shot past David Lucas in the Preston goal" => either "scored a third with a run from inside his own half and a shot past David Lucas in the Preston goal" or "scored a third when he ran from inside his own half and shot past David Lucas in the Preston goal" but not what is there right now
- "rolled along the Preston's goal line" => either "rolled along Preston's goal line" or "rolled along the Preston goal line" but not what is there right now
- "West Bromwich Albion, the first leg of which" - it was not the first leg of West Bromwich Albion
- "They had also lost to Ipswich Town 7–5 on aggregate in the previous season's play-offs" - just "They had lost to Ipswich Town 7–5 on aggregate in the previous season's play-offs", I think
- Not so sure, it's to link back to the three appearances claim made in the previous sentence, so the "also" helps us know this is connected. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 19:34, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
- "Bolton last played in the top tier" => "Bolton had last played in the top tier"
- "with a 2–0 victory at home in August 2000 and winning by the same scoreline" => "with a 2–0 victory at home in August 2000 and a win by the same scoreline"
- "Eamonn McCann, writing in the Sunday Tribune called" - need a comma after Tribune
- Don't really understand why he called the match "a victory for tradition". Any ideas?
- Well Preston and Bolton are clubs with a "history" aren't they? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 19:34, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
- Don't need to wikilink Wembley again
- I'd also expand this sentence slightly to "had hosted fans of every winning side during the period when the final was played there as a substitute location for Wembley Stadium."
- "Presidents of both clubs" => "The presidents of both clubs"
- "Farrelly passed to Holdsworth whose guided shot" - what's a "guided shot" in this context?
- Well I suppose it's meaningless really, I think it means like a side-footed thoughtful placed attempt rather than a smash, but I've removed "guided". The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 19:34, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
- "Referring to last year's play-off final" => "Referring to the previous year's play-off final" (unless he got his crystal ball out and made a prediction about the 2020 final :-D)
- Actually, was he referring to the previous year's final? The quote that follows doesn't seem to bear that out.........?
- That's what I got :-) -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:00, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
- ChrisTheDude yo, thanks for that. I've addressed and responded to all the above. Let me know what you think and/or there's anything else I can do. Cheers. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 19:34, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
- Support -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 20:35, 23 June 2021 (UTC)
Support from Cas Liber
edit- Support from me WRT comprehensiveness and prose. Nothing glaring prose-wise is jumping out at me but I concede my eye is not the most thorough - a nice read Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:37, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
Source review - pass
editWill do one soon. Hog Farm Talk 19:10, 4 July 2021 (UTC)
- I vaguely remember asking about this before at a football FAC, but I have no idea which one it was and don't remember what the answer was: what are the credentials for the Football Club History Database?
- Other sources are reliable for what they are citing
- Source formatting looks fine.
- I spot checked five or so citations for source-text integrity and copyright and saw no issues.
Aside from the question about FCHD above, the sourcing here looks fine. Hog Farm Talk 05:26, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- FCHD is brought up periodically, it's considered reliable, see this archive. It's non-controversial stuff it's used for in any case. Cheers. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 10:34, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
Support from Amakuru
edit- Route to the final
- The first sentence says "football league" twice in quick succession; you could pipe the first one to First Division perhaps.
- Point taken but as it's the first time in the main body that the idea of the division has been introduced, I'd prefer to keep the formal name in place. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:22, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- "struck the home side's crossbar but in the 59th minute, Geoff Horsfield gave Birmingham the lead overall" - I think both these shots were by Birmingham so perhaps "and" rather than "but"?
- "send the match into extra time" - a Wikilink for the first mention of extra time here, and remove the one from the following section.
- "Lazaridis' late shot" and "Rob Edwards' effort also went awry" - the MOS doesn't like this sort of possessive, does it... It is supposed to be either the awkward "Lazarisis's", or reword.
- "West Brom" - a bit colloquial there.
- Background
- "This was Bolton's third appearance" - since this is the start of the section, and nothing else has been mentioned yet, "this" seems a bit out of place. Maybe "The match" or something instead?
- "in the 1994 Football League Third Division play-off Final" - consider piping to remove "Football League"
- "every winning side during the period when the final was played there as a substitute location for Wembley Stadium" - is this in all three divisions, or just the first? Might also be worth saying over what time period it was played in Cardiff.
- Summary
- Just as a general point, the first half seems to have quite a bit less text than the second. Are there any other events of note from the half that aren't mentioned?
- I don't believe so. I have scoured contemporaneous sources and current day discussions and that is the sum total. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:25, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- Details
- Are there no kit colours? We usually see those on articles of this nature. We sometimes see little flags next to the players too, to indicate their nationality, although I don't know if any of that's a formally agreed part of the FOOTY style guide.
- I'm dead against the inclusion of trivial and decorative flags which form no part of critical commentary. They are often unreferenced as well. As for kit colours, sure I'll need to find someone to do that for me as I have had no joy doing it myself. Unless you want to help?? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:25, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- Post-match
- "I can't quite put what I feel into words ... I feel like the world has come off my shoulders. It is a phenomenal achievement". - the full stop should probably be inside the quote, since it terminates a complete sentence.
- "clean sheet" - wikilink to a glossary term?
- I seem to recall wikilinking inside a quote is generally frowned upon in case it puts a different meaning to that which was meant originally. But I've linked it to our own Wikipedia article. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:22, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- "The Guardian reported that Holdsworth was the man of the match" - was he the official man of the match? If so, it probably isn't necessary to say that "The Guardian reported..." and if it was a Guardian specific award, then should probably clarify that too.
- Well you've identified it perfectly and hence that's why it's worded as it is. No sign of official-ness and no sign of Guardian-specific. Just that the Guardian said it was Holdsworth... The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:22, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- "Nat Lofthouse, described by the BBC" - do we need his first name on the second mention?
- "won the FA Cup in '58" - you could link to an appropriate article here
- See above re linking inside quotes, but sure, why not. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:22, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- "to postpone his retirement from professional football to follow a legal career in Iceland" - I mis-parsed this, and thought that he did move to Iceland rather than that didn't. Maybe rephrase along the lines of "Bolton's Bergsson had intended to retire at the end of the season to follow a legal career in Iceland, but after securing promotion....."
- Lead
No issues that I can see. — Amakuru (talk) 17:58, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- Amakuru kit detail aside (can you help?) the rest has been addressed or at least attempted to be talked away...... Cheers! The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:25, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- I've added a couple of kits, based off photos of the event. We can tweak the colours a bit if you think they're off, but otherwise all your fixes look acceptable. Re detail of coverage, I could probably dig some more facts out if I were to get back on to the British Library's microfiche reader as I did with the Swindon Advertiser, but it's a matter of judgement anyway so I'll not let that get in the way. Happy to support, good work. — Amakuru (talk) 19:51, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- Amakuru kit detail aside (can you help?) the rest has been addressed or at least attempted to be talked away...... Cheers! The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 18:25, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
Query for the coordinators
edit@FAC coordinators: with three supports and both an image & source review passed, could I list another nomination? Cheers. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:00, 5 July 2021 (UTC)
- Gog the Mild you appear to be the only FAC delegate making more than the odd sporadic edit, what do you reckon? The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 20:46, 6 July 2021 (UTC)
- I reckon that you may. Gog the Mild (talk) 20:49, 6 July 2021 (UTC)
- Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FAC/ar, and leave the {{featured article candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Gog the Mild (talk) 16:24, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.