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Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Frank Berryman/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by GrahamColm 08:02, 6 October 2012 [1].

Frank Berryman

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Frank Berryman (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): Hawkeye7 (talk) 09:03, 14 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

An Australian general of World War II. Hawkeye7 (talk) 09:03, 14 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comments. As always, feel free to revert my copyediting. Please check the edit summaries. - Dank (push to talk)

  • "After the war, he spent nearly twenty years as a major.": On a quick read, I didn't see that in the text.
  • "Lieutenant General Sir Frank Horton Berryman ... rose to the rank of lieutenant general ...": repetition. Also, since he was a major later, was this a brevet rank?
  • "in 1913. Graduating early due to the First World War, he served on the Western Front with the field artillery.": I think everyone is disallowing this use of "due to" at FAC now; most style guides say it can modify a noun, and not for instance "graduating". "in 1913, graduating early to serve with the field artillery on the Western Front of the First World War."
  • "Major General General Staff": Not a lot we can do about militarese, but what do you think of "Major General, General Staff,"?
  • Otherwise fine in the lead. - Dank (push to talk) 23:07, 14 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Mentioned in Despatches": Roughly speaking, there's no such thing as a "proper verb", outside of militarese and a few proper nouns used as verbs. I changed this to "received a Mention in Despatches", and if you want to go with that, then make the capitalization consistent throughout ... you write "mention in despatches" later on, and either capitalization is fine. - Dank (push to talk) 20:41, 16 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • "schmozzle": colloquial
  • "prepared appreciations of the situation": I don't know what that means.
    • It's a military term. This had not occurred to me until I checked with the dictionary. In my time stationed in your country I had never heard "appreciation" used in any other sense. eg. "Mission command that conveys intent and an appreciation of all aspects of the situation guides the adaptive use of Army forces." (FM 3-0) "Understanding the parts of a situation is necessary; however, alone it does not provide an appreciation of the relationships among the parts. That appreciation requires synthesis. Synthesis is thinking about how the parts of a situation work together as a whole rather than in isolation." (FM 5-0) This led me to TRADOC 525-5-500 "Commander’s Appreciation and Campaign Design" which provides a definition:

Appreciation is the act of estimating the qualities of things and giving them their proper value. It is essentially an understanding of the nature or meaning or quality or magnitude of the situation before you. For the purposes of military operations, an “appreciation” allows the commander to design, plan, execute, and—most importantly—adapt his actions within the operational environment, through learning about the nature and context of the problem as the campaign unfolds. (p. 20)

The manual then goes on to describe the procedure than an officer like Berryman would follow to produce an appreciation today. Hawkeye7 (talk) 19:10, 17 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Images: several files need PD-1996, for which they qualify, in order to indicate their status in the United States. Otherwise fine. Grandiose (me, talk, contribs) 15:23, 15 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Source review - spotchecks not done

I am working through this article now. I have no knowledge of this subject matter. Comments as I go:

Lead
  • he entered Duntroon in 1913; unclear what Duntroon is to the uninitiated - consider using Royal Military College, Duntroon for full context
  • His class graduated early after the First World War broke out; I might just be nitpicking but.. this reads oddly to me. Did they graduate early because of the First World War or are you merely stating they graduated just after the outbreak of war (it's only a slight incongruity, I guess the former is right from later sections). Might be worth rephrasing.
  • Berryman commanded Eastern Command; nit picking. Is there a good synonym for commanded to use here?
  • As a personal preference I usually look for a sentence about the particular thing that makes this individual notable or interesting in the very first paragraph. It's not a big deal, but I feel it helps the lead hook the reader.
Education and early life
  • 1903 Railway Strike; no article? If not then more context may be needed (and "the" feels misplaced, implying the reader should know what was being talked about).
    • There is no article, but it is notable and one could be written. I did not red link it though, because I have no intention of doing so, and know of nobody else who intends to write it either. I think the reader gets the idea that it was a major strike, and the workers lost. It provides information about Frank's working class socio-economic background. It also ties in with his role in the more famous 1949 Australian coal strike. I did gather material to expand that one, but never got around to it. Hawkeye7 (talk) 21:02, 4 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Of 33 members; missing "the"? "of" is used many times in the last couple of sentences, and it sticks the prose up a bit. Consider a rephrase.
First World War
  • Berryman's Duntroon class had not yet completed its military training at the outbreak of the First World War; basically a restatement of the previous sentence. I'd suggest something like "Early graduation meant that Berryman's Duntroon class had not yet completed its military training"
  • First AIF; as the first instance of this acronym I recommend writing it in full.
  • the result of an AIF policy; redundancy, previous sentence should make it clear enough this is an AIF policy.
  • aimed at giving them a broad a range of experience, which would benefit the post-war Army, while not allowing the young officers of high rank to outnumber the posts available for them.; it took me a while to wrap my head around this. Perhaps rephrase: "a policy intended to benefit the post-war Army, by giving the young officers a broad range of experience without promoting too many to high ranks (who might outnumber the available posts in peacetime)."
  • The Mention in Despatches does not look like a quotation due to the placement of the image messing with the indentation. In addition the image squeezes the article text between itself and the infobox (contrary to MOS:IMAGELOCATION). Suggest moving the image to the right, below the infobox, to solve this.
  • He returned to Australia in October 1919; is there a particular reason?
    • Because the war had ended. With the war over, he returned to Australia in October 1919. I am used to AIF files that list everyone's RTA date. Hawkeye7 (talk)

That's it for now. Be aware I am a reviewer newbie, and may be too nit-picking in my comments :) Generally Support as reviewed to the bottom of First World War. --Errant (chat!) 09:27, 4 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]


The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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