Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/Jeopardy!/2
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
- Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch • • Most recent review
- Result: Seems to be consensus to keep. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 15:15, 1 November 2024 (UTC)
The article seems to be suffering from a great degree of scope creep. It's bloated considerably in size since the GAN in 2014, and further changes within the show in the 2020s have only bloated the article out further. Last GAR was closed as "kept", but it's only gotten worse since then as more changes have ensued in the show's history (e.g., the tournament spinoffs, Michael Davies taking over, Mayim Bialik being fired, etc.). Also, I think the gameplay description and host changeover sections are way too verbose and detailed. I should also note that Claire McNear's 2020 book has not been integrated into the article and is only listed under "further reading". I do have a copy of the book, but the rest of the article needs a severe trim first. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 04:24, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
- I took a quick skim of the article, and while at first glance I think it seemed quite long for a tv show. But after further thought it does seem to be necessary for how much information of a show of that caliber should maintain. I don't quite know what information I would cut. Eruditess (talk) 22:40, 16 September 2024 (UTC)
- I think there's way too much technical cruft about the ins and outs of tournaments, for one. The section on host changes could also be massively tightened up and do without all the quotes. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 23:10, 16 September 2024 (UTC)
- Pinging @SethAllen623: This was 10 (!) years ago now, but Seth and I worked together a bit on bringing this and Millionaire (also recently delisted as a GA, unfortunately) up to GA standards. If I recall correctly, the same reviewer took on both articles and admittedly didn't cover as much detail in their reviews as they probably could/should have. I don't know how much time I have to try to save this one at the moment, though I do have the updated 2022 paperback version of McNear's book and would be happy to at least try to incorporate that into this article where appropriate later this week. FWIW, I donated my copy of the original 2020 hardback version to my college's library, but given I currently work at said library...I can almost certainly get access to that as well if necessary. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 03:40, 17 September 2024 (UTC)
Note: Seems to be being worked on currently. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 14:49, 8 October 2024 (UTC)- @SethAllen623 and Bcschneider53: do you intend to contine working on the article? No worries if not. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 13:28, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29: Hey, sorry, this completely fell off my radar. It looks like Seth's made a few edits just now, so I'll wait a bit to avoid risking an edit conflict...like I said, I do have the McNear book, but as TPH said from the opening, it's probably best to take care of the rest first. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 20:10, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
- Exactly! I have removed about 10,000 bytes off of the bloat that's come into this article. This has included removing the quotations and various other details from the discussion of the host changeovers, and trimming the discussion of special tournaments in the "Tournaments and Events" section. These were the two major points of contention that you people have said needed to be taken care of. Have I done enough now, or is there more to be removed? --SethAllen623 (talk), October 16, 2024, 06:02 UTC.
- @SethAllen623: I think it's trimmed down a bit. Still pretty long. My only other concern is adding info from the McNear book. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 17:39, 21 October 2024 (UTC)
- The uncited passages are also an issue; since an RfC a couple of years ago, the GA criteria require that all prose in the article are verified by inline citations. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 09:50, 22 October 2024 (UTC)
- The only unsourced segments I see are under "gameplay", which is treated like a plot summary and therefore falls under WP:PLOTREF. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 18:42, 22 October 2024 (UTC)
- @TenPoundHammer and AirshipJungleman29: Alright, just skimmed back through the McNear book and added inline citations where appropriate. I also updated the citation to the 2022 paperback version - didn't realize there were some updates in there beyond just the afterword. How are we feeling about things at this point? --Bcschneider53 (talk) 00:15, 23 October 2024 (UTC)
- No, WP:PLOTREF comes under the writing about fiction guideline—a general knowledge quiz show is not fiction. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 00:52, 23 October 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29: In other GA-class game show articles such as Wheel of Fortune (American game show) and Press Your Luck, a summary of the rules was deemed as being equivalent to a plot summary in an episodic series, and therefore the show itself is implied to be the source. So there is precedent here that not every rule of gameplay necessarily needs a citation. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 00:55, 23 October 2024 (UTC)
- The only unsourced segments I see are under "gameplay", which is treated like a plot summary and therefore falls under WP:PLOTREF. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 18:42, 22 October 2024 (UTC)
- The uncited passages are also an issue; since an RfC a couple of years ago, the GA criteria require that all prose in the article are verified by inline citations. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 09:50, 22 October 2024 (UTC)
- @SethAllen623: I think it's trimmed down a bit. Still pretty long. My only other concern is adding info from the McNear book. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 17:39, 21 October 2024 (UTC)
- Exactly! I have removed about 10,000 bytes off of the bloat that's come into this article. This has included removing the quotations and various other details from the discussion of the host changeovers, and trimming the discussion of special tournaments in the "Tournaments and Events" section. These were the two major points of contention that you people have said needed to be taken care of. Have I done enough now, or is there more to be removed? --SethAllen623 (talk), October 16, 2024, 06:02 UTC.
- @AirshipJungleman29: Hey, sorry, this completely fell off my radar. It looks like Seth's made a few edits just now, so I'll wait a bit to avoid risking an edit conflict...like I said, I do have the McNear book, but as TPH said from the opening, it's probably best to take care of the rest first. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 20:10, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
- Pinging @SethAllen623: This was 10 (!) years ago now, but Seth and I worked together a bit on bringing this and Millionaire (also recently delisted as a GA, unfortunately) up to GA standards. If I recall correctly, the same reviewer took on both articles and admittedly didn't cover as much detail in their reviews as they probably could/should have. I don't know how much time I have to try to save this one at the moment, though I do have the updated 2022 paperback version of McNear's book and would be happy to at least try to incorporate that into this article where appropriate later this week. FWIW, I donated my copy of the original 2020 hardback version to my college's library, but given I currently work at said library...I can almost certainly get access to that as well if necessary. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 03:40, 17 September 2024 (UTC)
- I think there's way too much technical cruft about the ins and outs of tournaments, for one. The section on host changes could also be massively tightened up and do without all the quotes. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 23:10, 16 September 2024 (UTC)
I feel the issues I raised in the GAR have been addressed. Pinging @Bcschneider53:. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 21:05, 27 October 2024 (UTC)
- @TenPoundHammer: It's definitely much better than it was. I will note that I have always tried to cite the gameplay sections of my game show GA and FA articles, but I think we have a good amount of inline citations in that section here as well. --Bcschneider53 (talk) 02:18, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.