Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2020 November 21

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November 21

Keyboard without Windows logo?

Ten years ago I bought a Cherry Linux keyboard which has an image of Tux the penguin in place of the Windows logo on the "Windows" key. But it's getting old and dirty now, and one of the tilt supports just broke. So I am looking for a new keyboard to replace it, but there's one condition that doesn't seem to be available. I don't want the "Windows" key to show the Windows logo. I would prefer it to show some other symbol, preferably Tux the penguin. The actual key can, and should, still be there, it just should have a different picture on it. I have searched over and over on Google for it but just can't seem to find one that's available any more. Do such keyboards still exist? JIP | Talk 00:40, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

JIP, scope out this list of Linux system vendors. If one of them doesn't have a Tux keyboard for you, there has got to be a custom-keyboard manufacturer that can fake up keycaps for anything your heart desires, and put it on a bog-standard keyboard, even a nice one. Elizium23 (talk) 00:51, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

I don't want to buy a new computer. My old one works all OK and I can't afford a new one. I just want to buy a new keyboard without a Windows logo. JIP | Talk 00:53, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

JIP, did you browse those manufacturer websites? I didn't, but surely at least one of them sells a la carte keyboards. Elizium23 (talk) 02:08, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

For example, System76 is a leader in Linux systems. They are expensive so you will pay a premium. This link sent me to a standalone keyboard item which I added to my cart for $129.00. And that's just the first vendor I tried. Dig a little, the a la carte options are not on the main page. Elizium23 (talk) 02:15, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Another option would be to replace the key cap - that may be easier. Also, you can get keyboards without the key (like mine): Unicomp. Bubba73 ^{You talkin' to me?} 02:38, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Bubba73, as I said, custom-keycap makers are great at what they do, and you'd have the keyboard of your choice. The only barrier would be the need to design the image that goes on it. You'd need some graphic work, not much but a little, so it looks good. Luckily, Tux is a freely-licensed image. Elizium23 (talk) 02:46, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Here a company offers Tux keycaps to replace the Windows keys on a standard Filco keyboard.  --Lambiam 11:45, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

I asked an expert, and here's what he told me:

so 'too expensive', but precisely the tux keycap is available as part of the DSA profile granite keycap set sold by pimpmykeyboard (it is a 42 dollar set for the bonus back of 34 keys that includes it and he'd have to be ok with DSA profile

That set is here:

https://pimpmykeyboard.com/dsa-granite-keyset-sublimated/

There are lots of keycap profiles, and 'keycap profile' image searches get you some ok links to general types:

https://switchandclick.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/keycap-profiles-768x527.jpg

you may be able to find a tux keycap on its own on etsy/amazon though a quick search is obviously fruitless. you can 3d print keycaps, there are designs around for doing so, you could do a tux design that way

maxkeyboard do custom art keycaps, I have no idea how they end up looking:

https://www.maxkeyboard.com/shop/cherry-mx-keycaps/custom-color-printed-keycaps/

all of this is assuming he has switches under the keycap that work with the keycap (e.g. mechanical switches w/ cherry mx style + stems or whatever)

looks like you could potentially get a single win key for 9 bucks (assuming 1.25u win key) from maxkeyboard if you have artwork to upload

— Elizium23 (talk) 16:13, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

Expert part II:

the main pain point is really 'what are you replacing' because most of the custom keycap community stuff is around usual cherry profile switches so if the stem is wrong that's a headache (and idk of much to offer except 3d printing).. also if the profile is wrong it can look really weird, and most custom single keycap stuff is one profile due to cost.

Full keycap sets provide some ability to choose a color/icon scheme + profile you like, but are usually community sourced group buys that take months to get off the ground and also one-time so you end up either making it into the group buy through sitting watchign the geekhack forums for months or you have to buy on the aftermarket from people who may or may not sell to you at a reasonable price

there are various folks on etsy or with their own stores who do 'artisan' keycaps with wild designs/materials etc. but I doubt that is a good route for this request.. plus idk of any specifically who do commissions you can also just buy a blank key, get some printer paper and do it

diy style: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-scV7LLvdh8&vl=en

but idk anything about printers that work with sublimation paper or how easy actually getting the heat right for dye sub actually is I think that's the end of the info dump

— Elizium23 (talk) 16:16, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

I took the liberty of reformatting your quotations in line with what I infer to be your intent. —Tamfang (talk) 03:06, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

WASD keyboards sells custom keycaps for Cherry MX switches, including a range of just the "os" keys, which you should be able to apply to just about any keyboard (from anyone) with MX switches. As you're already used to the feel of Cherry MX, I'd imagine you'll want to stick with one (from whatever vendor) with the same switches. -- Finlay McWalter··–·Talk 12:37, 21 November 2020 (UTC)

If you're talking about a regular sized mechanical keyboard, there must be like hundreds if not thousands of sellers who sell keycaps on AliExpress. Finding a blank one is trivial. E.g. this search finds 9800+ results. https://www.aliexpress .com/wholesale?SearchText=keycap+blank Probably many of those are incorrect search results, but I'm sure many of them are also real blank (including translucent) key caps e.g. https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32788123136.html https://www.aliexpress .com/item/4001320400310.html https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001658206337.html

If blank doesn't do it for you, I found this from a 5 second search that has code https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001453414509.html and this one for Mac https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32922168081.html and this random anime (or something) one https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001490358763.html and this one which seems to be some kind of bird https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001683203713.html and there are surely plenty of other already customised options. I didn't find a Linux option but didn't search that hard.

Assuming you are happy with something besides a windows key that isn't a penguin, if you have some weird profile ([1]) or keyboard that is common enough, I'm sure you can find some option e.g. https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32895127912.html If you were just replacing a normal size key you could trivially get weird stuff e.g. https://www.aliexpress .com/item/4000060940519.html or https://www.aliexpress .com/item/4000068821506.html .

Anyway, since I guess you don't want to replace all your keycaps, it's probably worth looking at just those key caps. Searching for windows keycap didn't work very well, be 1.25u https://www.aliexpress .com/wholesale?SearchText=1.25u+keycap or 1.5u https://www.aliexpress .com/wholesale?SearchText=1.5u+keycap seem to work better as this is the size of the key you're looking for. (Probably 1.25u. You can tell by comparing your key length, you'll probably find it's 1.25x a normal key [2] unless it's a gaming keyboard [3] .)

From that, I found this one includes two different Mac keys (the option and command symbol) is https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001730973636.html then there's this card set keys https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001315506992.html or this blank but weirdly coloured ones https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001457766199.html or these different style Mac https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32928649077.html (Apple logo and option). I think there may be more options for 1.5u given their frequency in gaming keyboards and that such users are more likely to want these sort of things.

Searching for modifier keycap https://www.aliexpress .com/wholesale?SearchText=modifier+keycap also sorta seemed to work although none of the results I found were different from before that I noticed. There may be other better search terms.

As always on AliExpress, if you can't find something that interests you or works for your keyboard, it's probably worth contacting a few sellers who seem to sell a lot of that sort of stuff and see if they have what you want.

But also, you should be able to find sellers who offer customised printing services for keycaps https://www.aliexpress .com/item/1005001489440582.html or https://www.aliexpress .com/item/4001138258521.html (warning a bunch of dodgy anime pictures may show for either of those) or probably this https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32858624762.html (that's basically for paying after you come to an agreement) or https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32771555932.html (well it mentions contacting them for a different design, I'm not sure if they many any different design but possibly) or again just contact a reputable seller who offers that sort of stuff.

It's possible some of those laser engraving or other printing options also let you use your own design if you're not happy with whatever those sellers are offering. (From some of the details, I don't think all of the examples are actually already pre-printed anyway. Some of them mention a lead time etc. E.g. https://www.aliexpress .com/item/4000689106041.html or https://www.aliexpress .com/item/32951340097.html . Some of these may just be because they're buying it off Taobao or whatever as needed but I think some are really probably just made to order. This is China we're talking about after all.)

Remember if you do decide to go the AliExpress look a bit into the seller and what any of their reviewers say, be prepared to wait (especially at this time of the year), and recognise there's a chance you won't be happy with what arrives and will need to contact the seller about it or worst case file a dispute (but most sellers try very hard to avoid them, just make sure you don't let the dispute timeout time expire e.g. ask for an extension if it hasn't arrived).

To be clear, I haven't used or looked into any of those sellers AFAIK, and am not recommending them specifically. Also I tried to exclude any examples which appear to be using someone else's trademarks or copyrighted works, except for the Apple/Mac stuff and the customised options. However I wasn't sure about some of those weird examples but did exclude stuff like Fortnite, PUBG, LOL, Steam, Dragon Ball Z, WOW, DOTA, Spongebob (okay that was a weird key with a Spongebob which seems a bad idea for any key except one you hardly ever use that is out of the way i.e. maybe the printscreen row depending on how your usage profile), Peach Girl (after some searching on WTF that was) etc.

Nil Einne (talk) 14:43, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks to Elizium23 for pointing out my reply is confusing. Due to Wikipedia's spam blocklist, I had to purposely break the AliExpress links by adding a space between the aliexpress and .com. If you just want to open one or two URLs, I recommend just copying the whole url and then removing the space. If you want to open a few of them, you can take my post from this pastebin [4] and paste it into any edit window then show preview. Alternatively just search and replace my original post. Either way, after previewing you open the URLs easily. (The problem is when you try to submit you'll be blocked by the blocklist.)

There's no easy way around the blacklist that I can I see since generic URL shortener services etc are banned precisely to avoid them being used in that way. I've sometimes wondered if it's worth asking for a bunch of stuff to be whitelisted for the RD (including youtu.be) but I get the feeling asking for whole domains is likely to be difficult even if it's specific to the RD. I guess I could link to some external website that let's me add links or even a website under my control but that sort of seems against the RD ethos.

Nil Einne (talk) 09:39, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

Could always get a used Optimus Maximus keyboard. Hey, you never mentioned cost! Or a laser projection keyboard. If you're concerned about supporting Microsoft financially, honest question, does Microsoft even get royalties for Windows keys? In any case I'm sure the budget Chinese manufacturers don't pay them even if they're supposed to. --47.152.93.24 (talk) 20:00, 22 November 2020 (UTC)