Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2020 November 9

Welcome to the Wikipedia Computing Reference Desk Archives
The page you are currently viewing is a transcluded archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current reference desk pages.

November 9

Lots of screenshots in Fedora 32 Linux

My strange problems with Fedora 32 Linux continue. I lately reinstalled the Openshot video editor (which got wiped out when I reformatted the entire root partition when upgrading the system, only my home partition was kept) and it took over half an hour, but finally finished. During the update, I pressed the PrtSc key a few times. As a result, the system took over 53 thousand screenshots, taking up over 19 gigabytes. Luckily I noticed this and deleted them all before my next rsync backup, as that would have taken quite a lot of time. How is it possible this happened? JIP | Talk 21:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

I do that all the time because of the stupid autorepeat function. Something presses down on the print screen key and holds it there, and soon your disk is full. I've never actually filled a disk that way, but sometimes have taken a few dozen screen shots by accident before noticing that it was happening. 2602:24A:DE47:BB20:50DE:F402:42A6:A17D (talk) 23:51, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

One problem is keeping your home directory. You say you update the system, but not your home directory. There are many settings files in your home directory. I doubt you examine the rpmsave files after updates to see what settings are redundant or changed meaning between updates. If you really want to save your stuff, leave your home directory on the partition you update. Make another partition that you save stuff on. Synlink the top folder of that partition to your home directory. For ease, you can symlink Documents and Downloads and Images separately if you like. The point is that all the hidden settings files will be created fresh when you upgrade. If you actually have customizations, you should take note of what they are and how you set them. Then, after a major update, you can recreate them. I once had random lockups that nobody could solve so they were blamed on the hardware. It was because I upgraded everything but my home directory. When I upgraded my home directory as well (making all the settings the default ones), the problems went away. 97.82.165.112 (talk) 04:08, 12 November 2020 (UTC)

The problem with this seems to be that many applications, such as Mozilla Firefox, store their configuration files on the home directory. If the home directory gets wiped out during a system upgrade, I pretty much lose my Firefox profile and have to build another one from scratch. JIP | Talk 15:03, 12 November 2020 (UTC)

Every piece of software has its own configuration files. Look in ~/.config/openshot or ~/.local/share/openshot or even ~/.openshot or something like that, one or more of such folder(s) should have openshot configuration files. Maybe duck "openshot configuration directory" if that doesn't work. Then you can delete those files or move them to trash and see if the program will work properly again. 93.136.22.169 (talk) 17:20, 15 November 2020 (UTC)

The Openshot configuration files don't have anything to do with this as it happened when I was installing Openshot with dnf, and had not even run it yet. JIP | Talk 10:13, 16 November 2020 (UTC)

Netflix download

There's a Netflix show I'd like to see but I'm not a subscriber. I have a family member who I think subscribes, but the show is long enough that watching it at her house isn't practical. Is there a reasonably legit way (i.e. don't suggest bit torrent) for a subscriber to download a Netflix show for later viewing? It is ok if the resolution is reduced or whatever. I don't really care about that. It is ok if they charge for the download (I don't mind paying a few bucks) if the amount is not too steep. Thanks. 2602:24A:DE47:BB20:50DE:F402:42A6:A17D (talk) 23:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

No. It will violate their Terms of Service and you will be in possession of a copyrighted work without permission. Elizium23 (talk) 00:00, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

No, this is illegal. The only way to download is through Netflix's proprietary app. Ed talk! 00:10, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Netflix added offline viewing a few years ago, though not all of its content is included. Web search for "Netflix offline" for guides. If it's not a Netflix exclusive, you also might be able to purchase digital or hard copies elsewhere. Try a Web search for the show name. --47.152.93.24 (talk) 04:39, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks everyone. It's a netflix special but I'll figure something out. 2602:24A:DE47:BB20:50DE:F402:42A6:A17D (talk) 06:43, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

The Netflix terms of service may allow multiple logins, from different members of the same family. So check if this is permitted, and whether there is a spare unused count of allowed devices logged on. Then you just watch it using Netflix, without downloading. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 07:28, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Yes, this is what everyone in the world does, especially within families. Your Netflix credentials can be used by multiple people; what you're buying is the number of concurrent streaming connections (at whatever quality). For example, I subscribe to the top tier so that multiple members of my family can watch at the same time in HD. However, there's no sense "downloading" the show unless you specifically need to watch it offline (for example, if your internet connection is poor); if your subscriber changes their login or the show gets wiped from the Netflix slate, your downloads automatically get removed as well. Matt Deres (talk) 13:50, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Netflix login sharing is supposed to be for users in the same household only. While they've generally taken a sometimes openly blind eye to those who are clearly sharing their accounts with people beyond their households, they've continually threatened to crack down on such abusers recently [1] [2] [3] [4] [5]. Sharing with your own family who live in the same house hold is fine. I think this includes members who are living away temporarily e.g. a child who is is temporarily living away for study. But for family members and friends who are clearly in different households, not so much. (It's true that considering modern IP allocation especially on mobile devices, and fact that they do believe allow sharing even for extended times spent away, detecting sharing in violation of the ToS is often not as simply as it seems, probably one of the reasons why the crack down doesn't seem to have been noticed much.) Nil Einne (talk) 02:46, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks! That does help. It sounds though like I'd have to install some special software to watch it? I usually just download mp4 files and view them with mplayer if I want to watch a video on my Debian box. My family member uses a Macintosh so maybe I can borrow it over a few evenings. The show is 7 hours long so I don't want to sit through it all at once. I generally prefer to download stuff so I can look at it later but I don't feel likely to want to watch this thing twice. How do the different youtube reviewers manage to put clips from the show into their reviews? The show is The Queen's Gambit (miniseries) if that helps. 2602:24A:DE47:BB20:50DE:F402:42A6:A17D (talk) 02:04, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

There's no need for any special software to watch Netflix at 1080P 720P or lower. If you want the offline downloads for slow connections or 4k perhaps you need a Netflix app, but if your connectingconnection supports streaming you can just use your browser. You will need to make sure your browser and OS supports DRM. I believe on most *nix distros, simply using Chrome (and I mean Chrome, not Chromium) is enough but I'm not an expert [6].

Edit: This is mentioned in the earlier link but I didn't mention it before since I was less confident however some further reading including while researching below and I think I now know enough to mention it. You can also often use Firefox but need to make sure the DRM plugin is enabled and installed. I say "often" since I'm fairly sure there are still some situations where it's complicated especially Raspberry Pis or probably all non Chromebook ARMs where you can't get Chrome either [7] [8] [9] [10] [11].

It seems like Kodi v18 also has a Widevine add-on that is supported on most platforms including ARM [12] and I think also a Netflix plugin, so maybe this is easier on some platforms especially Pis or other non Chromebook ARMs. If you're using neither some version of x86 or modern ARMs, you're unfortunately probably SOL on a desktop OS.

Edit 2: I noticed Widevine has a verified media path option which verifies the browser framework for added protection. Unsurprisingly, this isn't supported on any Linux browser. [13] Most streaming providers still don't require it, some have tried for whatever reason, but then abandoned it [14], one of the most recent ones is HBO Max who did keep it for over 2 months [15] [16] [17]. Per those earlier links, if Netflix does ever decide to require the verified media path, you may need to use a VM with Windows or run Chrome via Wine. This very old Netflix page does claim Linux support albeit it's up to you to get it working [18]. I assume one reason why no one has bothered with the VMP is they've found it useless. It hasn't stopped web-dl releases and what they're doing already is enough to prevent most users from saving the original stream.

Edit 3: I just found a major error in my original post, apologies. Netflix doesn't support 1080P streaming on Chrome (any OS except Chromebooks) and Firefox. (4k is even stricter as I did imply.) I initially thought this is because they required Widevine level 1 (which is only available with certain Android devices and I guess Chromecasts and stuff) or some other hardware based solution (probably Playready or Fairplay) but it seems like it's more complicated. It seems in some cases the limitation was artificial so you can actually use a plugin to bypass it [19] [20] [21] although at least for Chrome, these have been banished from the app store.

Reading between the lines, I think what happened is Netflix wanted to support 1080P on Chromebooks, I assume because they're very popular among students in a number of places, who are a key demographic. But plenty of Chromebooks only support Widevine level 3. So they implemented code to check for Chromebooks and enable 1080P. For Windows, they have Edge or the Windows store app so they don't consider it necessary. For Macs, they have Safari or I assume some app. For Linux, well they're SOL.

Further, it seems like the Widevine implementation on Chromebooks is different enough that you can't simply playback the stream via the normal browser Widevine. But since the limitation was implemented clientside, you can just modify the player to so it does check for Chromebooks. But some streams also do other weird things you need to cope with.

Note, even with the plug in, there's still some limitations (other than when it breaks or stuff it doesn't know how to cope with). While Netflix is fine with their original content being available with Widevine level 3/software only DRM, some content owners want stricter DRM probably Widevine level 1 or some other hardware DRM for 1080P. Therefore you still can't get 1080P on all streams which you can with other solutions like Edge or the Windows app. See also [22] [23]. [24] [25] [26].

BTW (this is how I uncovered the above) it sounds like Disney+ originally had some requirement which stopped Linux accessing it. I think this was VMP (someone here also suggested the same [27]) since it sounds like it was fine in Chrome on Windows, but I'm not sure [28] [29]. The original person who reported it seemed to think it was because of Widevine level 3 [30] but I'm fairly sure this is wrong since all evidence I've seen suggests Chrome and Firefox only support level 3 on all OSes yet it sounds like they were fine with Disney+ before the change.

This reminds me that it's possible some Netflix streams do actually require the VMP for certain qualities. Maybe some require it for any quality, although I expect not. So it's possible that you will have a lower quality stream on Linux, even if you have the plugin. And of course even with the plugin, you may not be able to get 1080P only all streams even on Windows, which you can with Edge or the Windows app etc.

This ended up being longer than I planned, but TLDR version remains if you don't care about quality, you should be able to simply use Chrome or Firefox or Kodi with appropriate addons for Netflix on Linux. For ARM, getting Chrome or Firefox to work requires a little more effort, so it may be better to simply choose Kodi. If you do care about quality, running Windows 10 on a VM or possibly on Wine does I believe mean you have a verified media path (if that's ever an issue, which I'm not sure) and you could also try the plugin for Netflix's artificial limitations. Beyond that, running Windows 10 on a VM may with GPU passthrough may be enough for the app or for Edge to support 4k but I'm not sure. [31] [32] Nil Einne (talk) 02:49, 11 November 2020 (UTC) 07:22, 11 November 2020 (UTC) 09:51, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

BTW, as for 'how' that will likely depend on the reviewer. Some reviewers are probably given special, sometimes even early access to shows in some manner. These would potentially not be DRM protected.

Some reviewers probably simply do screen captures. Despite the Widevine DRM, this is generally still possible [33] [34]. (They will need to make sure their usage in any video they produce complies with relevant law where they live, and probably US fair use lest their review gets copystriked.) The desktop browser DRM, as sort of shown by the fact it can I believe run on most *nix distros only requiring the right browser, is mostly only trying to stop people getting the original stream. AFAIK you can actually play Netflix in a browser on a VM. [35]Edit: fairly sure that article is wrong. You can't get 4k on a VM except maybe with GPU pass through, indeed some of the comments mention this. However I still believe you'll pass Widevine level 3 on a VM as per above, and also the verified media path. Also I think Edge/Playready and Fairplay and whatever the Netflix app does will probably stop screen captures.

Of course pretty much all versions of High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection are broken. So you can simply capture the display edit: output anyway, and as I understand it this extends to 4k. And isn't that hard if you're willing to spend the money. [36] [37]

AFAIK, Netflix DRM (or possibly it's the Widevine DRM chain) is also still broken at least for 1080P although possibly not for 4k [38] so it is possible to obtain the original stream unencrypted. While I think the hows aren't widely known outside releaser groups probably in part to make it more difficult for them to be killed hence I think why this [39] wasn't just a case of 'no shit mate, I can go to xxx.com and download Y software to do it', there is a slight possibility some reviewers actually have access to such tools.

More to the point, some reviewers may have no qualms about using bittorrent or usenet or sharing websites or whatever to download the content (be it a webdl, or a webrip or whatever) for their reviews. Especially if they have legitimate access to the content on Netflix anyway and are only doing it to make it easier to make their review.

Usenet or sharing websites are an interesting case here since unlike with bittorrent where you generally have no choice but to share and so contribute to the redistribution, in those cases you may not really be doing anything other than perhaps paying for a general content hosting service. I imagine plenty would question whether screencapping the content, or for even downloading and deDRMing it yourself is actually morally better than simply getting what someone else already did. And while this isn't legal advice, there's the ironic fact that the DMCA means deDRMing is often legally problematic in the US and some countries with similar laws. But if someone else already did it for you, well....)

Nil Einne (talk) 04:29, 11 November 2020 (UTC) 10:09, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, the reviewers I'm thinking of are unlikely to have gotten any special access from Netflix and they do show video clips rather than just stills, so they aren't simple screen shots. Maybe they are vid caps of some kind. I don't know if DRM is available for Linux but I wouldn't want to install a DRM plugin anyway. Oh well no big deal, I'll figure something out. It's not that important to me to watch this show anyway. I just saw some online discussions about it and it sounded interesting. 2602:24A:DE47:BB20:50DE:F402:42A6:A17D (talk) 04:03, 12 November 2020 (UTC)