Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2012 March 17

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March 17

NCAA basketball in large stadiums

Thread retitled from "Why do NCAA college basketball tournaments sometimes take place in large stadiums?".

I've always wondered why large NCAA basketball tournaments take place in stadiums like the Lucas Oil Stadium, the Cowboys Stadium, the Edward Jones Dome or the Mercedes-Benz Superdome. Is college basketball as big as the NBA in America to hold events at stadiums like that? We don't see something like "Lakers vs. Celtics Best-of-7 Finals at the Georgia Dome" (but then again, the NBA finals, or any major American sport final except for the Super Bowl or the MLS Cup Final take place at neutral venues). Why does the NCAA even hold basketball games at those large stadiums? The NBA doesn't even usually hold games at large stadiums (the 2010 All-Star Game was actually more of an exception.) Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 00:14, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Seating capacity, bluntly. The NCAA has to allocate seats to teams, sponsors, people who win the right to buy tickets through public lottery, and the basketball coaches who have their conference alongside the Final Four traditionally. . Tickets were very tight when it was played in an arena.--Wehwalt (talk) 00:28, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Tickets are tight even when they're in a football stadium. They can't sell all those seats, as there would be objects in the way. If they had an actual basketball arena that could seat 100,000 for just that one weekend, they might be able to fill it. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 02:10, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

They don't fill the entire stadium, do they? Do they still close a portion of it off and use only half the building? The dimensions of a basketball court is considerably much less that a football field. Zzyzx11 (talk) 03:53, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Depends on the game. Sometimes, they only use half of it, sometimes they use the whole place. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 08:45, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

When they held the finals at the Metrodome a decade or so ago, they put the court on approximately the baseball diamond and set up temporary seating on two sides of it which approximated the outer edges of the infield. They then sold basically every seat in the upper deck all around, but not in the lower deck in the outfield because the temporary seating would have blocked the view of the court. I think many (though not necessarily all) stadiums are configured that way for the Final Four. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 09:46, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I know the Superdome in 1987 lacked temporary stands, as I was there for that one. But I agree, it is usual today, that way you get more "good" seats at the price, possibly, of some capacity.--Wehwalt (talk) 09:51, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

We missed answering the question: Yes, college basketball is as popular, or even more than the NBA. Rmhermen (talk) 13:05, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Well, I'm not certain what the ratings say, but I'd add to that the fact that traditionally college basketball tournaments are neutral site for the final rounds, unlike the NBA where they really have to play in the teams' arenas. Given the neutral site, the obvious temptation is to play in a large facility to maximize ticket revenues and the number of people able to attend. You have four participating teams. Not only do you have to satisfy as much of their fan base (the teams' fans, season ticket holders, boosters) but you have that laundry list of people I listed above.--Wehwalt (talk) 13:59, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I'll have to dig the numbers up from Neilsen, but in answering a similar question 1-2 years ago elsewhere (not the ref desks, it was for an ITN item, possibly), I found that the NCAA Basketball Championship Game is usually the second highest rated sporting event on Television after the Super Bowl, and the tournament as a whole crushes the NBA Playoffs in terms of TV viewership. By TV numbers, the NCAA tournament is a huge deal. Much bigger than the NBA. For non-Americans, who think that professional = more popular automatically, and who are confused by the notion that Americans might, as a society, find college sports to be worth watching, this is leads to frequent incredulity, but yes, the NCAA tournament is a huge deal in the U.S., and numbers back it up. --Jayron32 23:20, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

I am revising the heading of this section from "Why do NCAA college basketball tournaments sometimes take place in large stadiums?" to "NCAA basketball in large stadiums", in harmony with WP:TPOC, point 12 (Section headings). Please see Microcontent: Headlines and Subject Lines (Alertbox).

—Wavelength (talk) 23:36, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

gaga lip synchs

why does gaga proclaim to never have lip synched?? she did on sunrise morning program in australia...the hosts werent happy because on that show you cant you have to sing live58.173.104.190 (talk) 05:05, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

There's a difference between lip-synching in front of an audience who paid for the tickets, where it's considered bad form, and lip-synching as a guest on a show, where it may not even be possible to sing live, due to limitations of the equipment and not having all the band members present. StuRat (talk) 07:13, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Indeed - even if a particular performer always made a point of doing live vocals even in a TV studio appearance, they would still not do so when shooting music videos - repeatedly singing the same song and repeating the same lines for 1-2 days straight at full vocal power would wreck a voice in short order. Quintessential British Gentleman (talk) 19:40, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

George Lorrison in The Bad and the Beautiful

In The Bad and the Beautiful, Georgia Lorrison's apartment contains a shrine to her father, the late actor George Lorrison. This includes photos, movie publicity shots, and records. Whose image was used for the photos of George Lorrison? You can see some of them in the still photo here. --Amble (talk) 06:55, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure it's Gilbert Roland, at least in the photo on the left with him in uniform (it looks familiar, but I can't recall the film). Maybe an in joke, since Roland played "Gaucho" in the movie. Clarityfiend (talk) 09:43, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I was gonna say (and in fact did say before you edited your post, causing an edit conflict) that Gilbert Roland played Victor "Gaucho" Ribera in the film, and so, to have his photo representing someone else would have confused the viewers. It does sort of look like him, I grant you, but is it really him? -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 09:53, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I also thought it looked similar to Gilbert Roland, which is probably what made me wonder about the identity of the face in the shrine. IMDB lists Louis Calhern as the voice of George Lorrison on the record, but doesn't mention the photos. Maybe that information is lost to us? --Amble (talk) 18:43, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm no Louis Calhern expert but the photo could easily be an early one of him. He was a very well-known actor in his day, and to have had anyone else's photo would not have matched his disembodied but still very recognisable voice. -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 19:55, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Ah, of course! The only photos I found of Louis Calhern were as an older man, but it does look like him. The military (naval?) photo on the left looks quite a lot like him in this still from Duck Soup, with a cap and snappy coat pasted in. Well done, JackofOz, I think you have solved the mystery. --Amble (talk) 20:19, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Thank you. You have my permission to use me as a reliable source.  :) -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 23:11, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Foreign (Non-American or Canadian) American Football players raised and played abroad who are/were non-kickers in the NFL?

As everyone knows, the NFL is not that popular outside of North America. There are many foreigners in the NFL then and now, from places are far-away as Australia and Samoa. However, almost all of them (except the Samoans) are kickers. I am wondering if there are any foreigners (except for the Samoans) who are quarterbacks, running backs etc... And among them, is/was there anyone who did not play College football in the US and played American football elsewhere before going to the NFL? (This includes the now-defunct NFL Eurpoe). And Tim Tebow does not count - he may have been born in the Philippines, but he's a pure-blooded and proud American. This does not include people who played in the CFL, because the games are very similar. Narutolovehinata5 ^tccsdnew 11:13, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

There aren't very many cases like that. Almost all professional football players (except some kickers) have played the game at the college level somewhere, in the United States or Canada (the latter being quite rare for NFL players, but not unheard of). Football is a game that demands very specifically-honed skills, which are impossible to learn without playing a high level of competition. You can't just take a good athlete with the right physique and plug him into the NFL and expect him to compete. That said, Richard Tardits is a close case, though. He grew up in France, attended the University of Georgia as a rugby player, and tried out for the football team , playing as a linebacker. He proved to be very good at the new game and reached the NFL - while also playing top-level rugby. Also, in the short-lived World League of American Football, there was a provision that the European teams could use a few extra roster spots for local players who were "learning the game". I don't think any of them amounted to much, though, and even in the WLAF, these players would only be used at the end of games that were already decided. --Xuxl (talk) 10:10, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

This chap, John Smith almost fits your criteria - except, unbelievably, he didn't play American football anywhere before signing for the NFL. And he had a fantastic career. --Dweller (talk) 16:51, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

Quite a story. He did play soccer, though, as an amateur, so he knew how to kick. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 22:54, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

Another close one, which meets the "non-kicker" rule, but who first played the game in college (not NFL) would be Christian Okoye, aka the Nigerian Nightmare, who was raised in Nigeria, and only was introduced to the game when he was in college. He was sent to the U.S. to be a track-and-field athlete at Azusa-Pacific University, as he was a hopeful for the Nigerian Olympic team. When he didn't make the Olympic Squad, he took up football on a whim, and was drafted by the Chiefs. There were about 3 years in the late 80s/early 90s when he was one of the most feared running backs in the league. Sadly, as with many runners, injuries ended his career too soon. --Jayron32 23:12, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

What is the name of the piece of music that ocassionally plays before the videos of HowTheWorldWorks?

Also, what is the music that plays at the end? (Link to a video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2jEnaZSP3E). Thank you for your time. Marcus Lupus (talk) 20:10, 17 March 2012 (UTC)