Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2012 November 8

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November 8

Dutch folk songs

What are some examples of authentic Dutch folk songs (especially work songs and/or children's lullabies)? I'm a big fan of traditional music, but I know mostly British and American folk songs. Thanks in advance! 24.23.196.85 (talk) 01:27, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Wikipedia has an article titled Music of the Netherlands which has some information on Dutch folk music. There's a page at Dutch Wikipedia titled nl:Volksmuziek in Nederland which has some information as well (Google Translate should give you the gist if you don't read Dutch). The Dutch Wikipedia article nl:Volksliedje has some examples of folk songs. --Jayron32 02:25, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

For children there is a nice list here that has almost all songs I can think of. A surprisingly high number seem to be related to Sinterklaas. I wouldn't know any work songs though they probably exist. Not for children per se, the most typical folk song would be Piet Hein, about Piet Pieterszoon Hein who managed to steal a lot of silver which apparently made him a hero. Piracy was perfectly legal at the time, similar to (this being the reference desk and not a forum) something else. Joepnl (talk) 02:33, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Well, I think I'll have to keep looking. Thanks anyway! 24.23.196.85 (talk) 07:04, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

On second thought, "Piet Hein" sounds like a good choice, although a bit too heroic for a simple worker to be whistling it casually. 24.23.196.85 (talk) 07:24, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Even better, "Heer Halewyn" sounds just like what I was looking for. Am I right that it's about a young maid getting kidnapped, like in the Irish song "Gypsy Davy"? 24.23.196.85 (talk) 07:52, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

That song doesn't sound like a work song to me (whistling this?). I don't know about Gypsy Davy, but this is about a real princess, not a maid, lured by beautiful singing "mr Halewijn" who for some reason wants to kill her. After asking several family members it's her brother who finally gives permission to go see him. She is also beautifully dressed, but many lines devoted to clothing is not unusual in medieval songs. As she is so beautiful she gets to decide how to be killled. She chooses the sword, which was the standard royal way, and tells Halewijn to take of his jacket because killing a virgin is a messy business (at least that's what she says). While he's taking his jacket of she gets to kill him instead. After dismissing a request by Halewijn's head to get ointment she takes his head home (after washing it of course). Her father, the King, is very happy about the outcome of this adventure so he organizes a feast, with Halewijn's head on the table (the last fact may not have been in the original song according to nl:Heer Halewijn zong een liedekijn). here's a database of songs. Joepnl (talk) 15:10, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for all the info! On second thought, I'll probably try to find something more cheerful and less creepy. And it doesn't have to be an actual "work song" (as in, one that was written to ease heavy physical work, like "John Henry") -- rather, I'm looking for an upbeat, cheerful and fairly rhythmic song that someone might whistle while his hands are occupied with something else. 24.23.196.85 (talk) 23:25, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

You might like Merck toch hoe sterck about the Siege of Bergen-op-Zoom (1622) which is pretty cheerful (obviously, as it celebrates getting rid of those pesky Spanish taxmen). I can imagine it being wistled while doing labor, in fact I'm whistling it now while doing laborious typing. You do get me wondering what you want it for. Joepnl (talk) 01:08, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

I love it -- not only is it cheerful and rhythmic, but it also ties in well with the plot of the book I'm writing. You can get a pretty good idea of what it's about by looking at the other question I asked today.  ;-) 24.23.196.85 (talk) 03:21, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

And this link. 24.23.196.85 (talk) 03:26, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Ah cool :) Joepnl (talk) 14:37, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

I don't want to give too much away, but the first part has to do with one of my secondary characters -- a common laborer (a chimney sweep, to be exact) who likes to whistle while working, and is doing just that when he sees an Allied plane get shot down and the crew bail out, and alerts the Resistance so they could go find the pilots and save them. And the second part, about children's lullabies, has to do with a subplot dealing with another operation to get Jewish families out of the ghetto -- this op (not a part of my book's plot per se, but only talked about by one of my characters) is run by a British agent posing as a babysitter, who has to sing the small kids to sleep before hiding them in a double-bottomed container (either her own bag, or one of her partners' toolboxes) and sneaking them out (the adults and the older kids are provided with cover stories and false papers to effect their escape). I was thinking "Amsterdam" (the Dutch version of "Greensleeves") is suitably soothing, but I don't know whether it's appropriate for children ("Greensleeves" might or might not be, depending on one's point of view). 24.23.196.85 (talk) 22:57, 10 November 2012 (UTC)

See http://ingeb.org/catnl.html.

—Wavelength (talk) 23:40, 10 November 2012 (UTC)

I never noticed the fact that "Amsterdam" really has the same (or very similar) melody as Greensleeves, thanks for that. I'm not too sure about chimney sweeps during WW II. If you mean to depict a chimney sweep just exiting the chimney to see a plane shot down I think you're describing 19th century technology where it was necessary to actually enter the chimney. My guess is that they didn't do that anymore in the 1940s. (but I'm not sure about that). "Amsterdam" (which, for the record, is not Dutch but a Flemish song) is made to be sung in a bar at a very late hour (if the guests know the lyrics which I really doubt), and certainly not something one would sing to a child (do check Youtube to hear for yourselve). Worst of all, the song was written in 1964. If it has to be Dutch, the "official" song would be Slaap keendje slaap which just elaborates on a sheep outside having white feet and drinking milk like he should, and tells the child to go to sleep. Joepnl (talk) 03:48, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Of course I know that chimney sweeps did not actually climb into the chimney since about 1875 -- rather, they used a special brush on a long flexible handle to clean it out while standing on the rooftop. In any case, a full-grown adult could not squeeze through a chimney -- that's why in the old days (up until the 1870's) they used to use climbing boys to actually do the dirty work, until that practice was (rightly) outlawed. And thanks for clarifying about "Amsterdam", I'll forget about using that song. I'll go with either your suggestion of "Slaap keendje slaap", or perhaps "Op de Groote, Stille Heide" (which is also pretty soothing, at least to my ears). Thanks a lot! 24.23.196.85 (talk) 07:29, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Which tune is this?

youtu.be/PTScpAaBE14?t=1h54m8s Thanks. 67.243.3.6 (talk) 04:41, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

I can't make that into anything like a URL. Can you be clearer about which video you're interested in? -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 19:12, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Jack of Oz: youtu.be is a domain name registered by Google and used as a URL shortener for YouTube videos. The URL is valid, just paste it into your web browser address box. --Bavi H (talk) 02:10, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. I guessed as much, and I tried various things but nothing worked for me. Now, it does. Magic. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 04:58, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

That video is two hours long. Is there a specific part that you're referring to? What I heard in the minute or so that I watched seemed to be just incidental music which generally isn't named in the usual sense. Dismas|^(talk) 03:51, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Dismas: the ?t=1h54m8s at the end of the URL instructs YouTube to start playing at 1:54:08. I assume this is the segment 67.243.3.6 is asking about. --Bavi H (talk) 01:53, 10 November 2012 (UTC)

The initial chords do sound like Love Story (probably the most requested identification of "classical" music) but later it changes. I agree that it is probably just some generic music composed for the show.184.96.226.214 (talk) 08:25, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

MadTv

I have always wondered about this. Frequently, segments are parodies of shows,movies,soap operas,etc. or just making fun of individuals like politicians or celebrities. My question is do the producers ever get sued because some parodies can easily be called libel or slander? Do they get permission to use things that may be copyrighted like names, logos, phrases or do they just go ahead and use them? I am not talking about obvious references like "The Addams Family" being referred to as "The Adnauseum Family". I am talking more about making fun of Obama, Oprah, Beyonce by name or Walmart or shows like Jeopardy or The Price is Right or Scrabble which are mentioned by name (not just an obvious reference). Thanks.184.96.226.214 (talk) 07:48, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

The US Supreme Court ruled 8-0 in Hustler Magazine v. Falwell that, even if a parody is deliberately intended to be insulting, a public figure cannot collect damages. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:39, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

As to the second part of your question, about copyright, etc., see Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music, Inc.. Shadowjams (talk) 22:24, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Jeopardy

On Jeopardy, when an adjustment to a score is made for an answer a contestant gave a few questions ago, what is the rule for the amount added/subtracted from the current score? I always thought that it was just whatever the wager amount of the question originally was but it looks like it is always more than that. Thanks.184.96.226.214 (talk) 07:48, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

It should be double the amount. If a contestant was credited for an answer/question that was actually wrong, they would lose the money they won by mistake, and also be penalized for giving an incorrect response. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:32, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Question about Final Destination 6 and 7

I read an earlier question on whether the films are going to be produced soon or not. My question is where and who should I contact to know whether or not the movies are coming soon. Thank you. Netwwork (talk) 22:52, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

WW2 bio

Hello all, where can I find biographies/autobiographies of the following people: Helene Deschamps, Odette Sansom, Peter Churchill, and Adolf Galland? Thanks in advance! 24.23.196.85 (talk) 23:30, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Oops, I meant Helene Deschamps Adams... 24.23.196.85 (talk) 23:32, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Well, she wrote Spyglass: An Autobiography in 1995. Seems to be available from Amazon, new or used. Alansplodge (talk) 23:44, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks! And the other three? 24.23.196.85 (talk) 23:47, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

All three of those articles point to biographies. Books on Odette by Tickell and Starns; Galland's authorised biography by Baker, and the Setting Europe Ablaze site. Rojomoke (talk) 07:24, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks once again! I'll try to find them on Amazon. 24.23.196.85 (talk) 22:41, 10 November 2012 (UTC)