Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2014 February 12

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February 12

Portugal in Africa

What current-day countries in Africa were once colonies of Portugal? --71.251.175.227 (talk) 02:09, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Portugal long ago had trading posts in many parts of Africa, such as Elmina, but these were not true colonies. The present-day African nation-states that were previously colonies of Portugal are Cape Verde, Guinea-Bissau, Equatorial Guinea, São Tomé and Príncipe, Angola, and Mozambique. We have an article called Portuguese-speaking African countries. Marco polo (talk) 02:28, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Portugal also once controlled large parts of modern Morrocco. See The Algarves of either side of the sea in Africa or Tangier#History or Morocco–Portugal relations, all of which covers it all-too-briefly. I'm rather surprised we don't have an article on Portuguese Tangier since they ruled it for some 200 years. --Jayron32 10:59, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

As a related point, the U.S. almost got a First Lady from Portugese Africa: Teresa Heinz Kerry. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 19:57, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Who crowned Henry V?

That is, Henry V, Holy Roman Emperor. Maybe I'm missing it, but I can't find it in the English or the German wiki article. It happened in Aachen, that's clear--but who did it? Thanks, Drmies (talk) 03:09, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

This book, page 178, says that he was crowned by The Pope in St. Peter's Basilica in Rome in 1111; it doesn't say which crown, but my guess is this would be the Iron Crown of Lombardy (though our article states it was traditionally invested at Pavia); it may have also been the Imperial Crown of the Holy Roman Empire (though I believe this was traditionally invested at Aachen). However, that book indicates that some coronation occurred at St. Peters on 12 February 1111, which is the date from which Henry is considered to be HRE. --Jayron32 03:34, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

I think Drmies means the earlier investiture as King, 1099 in Aachen, not as Emperor. According to his article on German WP it was Hermann III. von Hochstaden acting as Archbishop of Cologne. This brief English text from the Cologne Cathedral's website agrees, but I don't know whether that's good enough for a reference. I couldn't find the coronation mentioned in those German WP references I was able to access.---Sluzzelin talk 03:42, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Yes, Sluzzelin, thanks, that's the one I was referring to (sorry Jayron32 for being vague). So it was Cologne who had that privilege in those days...I wonder when Mainz lost it. Sluzzelin, this prompted by Franz Staab, "Die Mainzer Kirche: Konzeption und Verwirklichung in der Bonifatius und Theonesttradition" (Die Reichskirche in der Salierzeit, Sigmaringen, Thorbecke, 1991) and, incidentally, the Theonest business is interesting, since our Theonistus states how "our" Theonistus is often confused with another Theonistus, and that other Theonistus is what the linked article on the German wiki is about. Drmies (talk) 04:21, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

It looks like Aribo (Archbishop of Mainz) crowned Conrad II in 1024.

One year after Conrad became Holy Roman Emperor, his 10-year-old son Henry III was crowned King by Pilgrim (Archbishop of Cologne and also Aribo of Mainz's nephew). The article states that he possibly received the right to crown the King of Germany in 1022 from Pope Benedict VIII while also receiving his pallium and dignity of bibliothecarius.

Next, 6-year-old Henry IV was crowned by Hermann II, again Archbishop of Cologne. His colleague from Mainz, Luitpold I was miffed and insisted that the right to crown the King was a privilege of the Archbishops of Mainz. Soon things got quite a bit messier, of course.

Over two centuries later, the regulatory Coronatio Aquisgranensis, attributed to Henry VII's coronation, defined the Archbishop of Cologne as the only legitimate coronator, though he was to be accompanied by the Archbishops of Mainz and of Trier (see also Krönung der römisch-deutschen Könige und Kaiser). Yet the Archbishop of Mainz still appears to have been the Primas Germaniae. I remember having read a whole book on nothing but the Investiture Controversy, and remember being fascinated by it too. As I learned while researching this question, that's about all I remember :-|. ---Sluzzelin talk 09:45, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Anne Seymour Damer and the Walpoles

Was the sculptor Anne Seymour Damer related to Horace Walpole, or just a friend? Our article about her father, Field Marshal Henry Seymour Conway, describes him as a "cousin" of Horace Walpole, whereas the article about Horace Walpole just describes Anne as his "friend"; the article about Anne refers to Horace as "friend and guardian" with no mention of a family relationship. The Strawberry Hill article says "After the death of Walpole, the house passed first to his cousin Anne Seymour Damer". Can someone clarify the relationship, if any?

Horace Walpole's mother, Catherine Shorter, was the older sister of Charlotte Shirley Shorter, Henry Seymour Conway's mother and Anne's grandmother. ---Sluzzelin talk 11:01, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

As a follow-up question, how was Hugh Walpole related to Horace (or Sir Robert) Walpole? Does his second name, Seymour, indicate any connection to the Seymour Conway family? --rossb (talk) 10:48, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

OK - I've done some rooting around on Ancestry, and so this is mainly from primary sources, but: Hugh Seymour Walpole was the son of the Revd George Henry Somerset Walpole, who was the son of the Revd Robert Seymour Walpole (1821-1902). He in turn was the son of the Revd Robert Walpole of Itteringham, Norfolk, and his wife Caroline Frances nee Hyde. This Robert Walpole (1781-1856) has an entry in the Dictionary of National Biography, which gives him as the son of Robert Walpole (ambassador) and his first wife Diana Grosset. The elder Robert Walpole was the son of Horatio Walpole, Sir Robert Walpole's younger brother, and thus a first cousin to Horace Walpole, the Gothic revivalist. I leave the calculations of how many greats an uncle, and how many times removed a first cousin, they each were to Hugh as an exercise for another reader. AlexTiefling (talk) 11:54, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Many thanks for the information| --rossb (talk) 00:23, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

winter olympics nations that have snow

Which nations have snow even though they are seen as summer nations? So far, Iran and Turkey have snow and they are seen as summer nation. Who else? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.29.32.106 (talk) 15:57, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Your premise is incorrect. The Olympics are hosted by cities, not nations. μηδείς (talk) 16:54, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

It's also a little unclear as to who is doing the seeing and what is meant by "summer nation". Turkey and Iran both have varied climates (as do most nations of any size). Matt Deres (talk) 17:20, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

In the temperate zone, suitable climate for winter sports is mostly a function of altitude; just about anywhere in that area which has mountains could host the winter games. As an extreme example, Squaw Valley (site of the 1960 Winter Olympics) is about 100 miles from Death Valley, the hottest place on Earth; one is high, the other is low. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 17:33, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

FYI, google maps gives 375 miles as the driving distance (fairly direct) from the olympic site to the middle of Death Valley national park. SemanticMantis (talk) 20:07, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Famously, this winter there was snow in Egypt for the first time in over 100 years. --Theurgist (talk) 20:25, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

It seems to me that the question is "Which competing nations in the Winter Olympics would you not expect to have a snowy climante?" (or words to that effect). So obvious ones to me are Australia, New Zealand, Tonga, Greece, Argentina, and maybe Great Britain.--TammyMoet (talk) 20:46, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

2014 Winter Olympics#Participating National Olympic Committees provides a list and a map of the participating nations. One could also mention countries like Brazil, Zimbabwe, Thailand, Jamaica, and some others. --Theurgist (talk) 21:01, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

New Zealand's South Island is world-famous for its ski fields and glaciers. (The North Island with its boiling sulphurous mud pools, not so much.) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:51, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

I don't know if Morocco has anyone competing in this year's Olympics, but it has a couple of ski resorts in the High Atlas. Lebanon also has snow, even though it's located in the Middle East. --Xuxl (talk) 08:24, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

While I live on its outskirts, I'm seen by most people who know me as living in Melbourne, Australia's second biggest city with 4¼ million people. (That's one fifth of Australia's population.) In winter I can drive to Australia's most up-market cross country ski area in a little over an hour. Unfortunately, the snow is pretty crap at times. It's a four hour drive to more reliable snow. HiLo48 (talk) 10:09, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

I mostly agree with Jack that I don't see New Zealand as being seen as 'not a snowy climate'. Sure most of the main urban areas may not have much snow at all, but as Jack has said, the glaciers and snowy mountains are fairly famous and a common part of portrayals of NZ and of course also featured in the Lord of the Rings films by Peter Jackson. Similarly Skiing in New Zealand isn't an uncommon tourist activity. As Jack has said, for international tourists this would mostly be in the South Island, but there are several in the North Island which cater to locals and those less demanding. As I understand it, at least for the ones closests to Auckland, their snow isn't very good and at least some of it is artificial but these aren't Snowplanet by any means. And

It's probably a bit relative, it may be that to a Canadian like the OP, NZ doesn't seem like a snowy place at all. But this is likely an odd view to someone from Malaysia since some places in NZ clearly do get a fair amount of snow and are commonly depicted with it.

It's also worth remembering that 'summer nation' and 'have snow' will not even be seen as clear cut antonyms to quite a few people. Sure a 'summer nation' whatever you mean by that, may not be seen as having snow. But a place like New Zealand, even with winters in many places that are generally considered mild do have clearly defined winters and these are cold enough to people in some places that they're not going to think of them as 'summer nations' regardless of whether they are seen as snowy places. (You do need snow or ice for sports in the winter olympics, but that's a different thing again.)

Nil Einne (talk) 13:19, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

I just want to correct what Finlay McWalter said above. It isn't true that suitable conditions for winter sports are necessarily a function of altitude in the temperate zone. The region where I live is squarely within the temperate zone—well to the south of Great Britain, for example—but, even close to sea level, we have had some snow on the ground continuously since December, and temperatures mostly stay below 0 Celsius during January and February. Except along the western edges of continents, where prevailing westerlies blow relatively warm ocean air some distance inland, anywhere above about 40°–45° latitude has conditions suitable for winter sports during winter, even at sea level. Marco polo (talk) 13:21, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Some countries, such as France, have hosted both the Summer and Winter games. CS Miller (talk) 21:00, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

And without wanting to get into the politics of USSR vs Russia, we've now had summer Games in Moscow and winter Games in Sochi. HiLo48 (talk) 21:19, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

It's not a rare thing: Canada, the USA, Germany, Italy and Japan, off the top of my head, have hosted both summer and winter games. South Korea will join the list in four years' time, and both Spain and Sweden have been candidates to host the winter games after having hosted the summer ones. --Xuxl (talk) 21:35, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

List of Olympic Games host cities tells us the countries that have hosted (* scheduled) both Summer and Winter Olympics are: Canada (1, 2), France (2, 3), Germany (2, 1), Italy (1, 2), Japan (2*, 2), Russia (1, 1), South Korea (1, 1*), USA (4,4). -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:38, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Closest spot to equator to regularly get snow ?

Per the above Q, it might be interesting to note the closest spot to the equator to regularly get snow. How about Mount Kilimanjaro, at just over 3 degrees from the equator ? Is that the spot ? StuRat (talk) 18:29, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

I've always heard that. InedibleHulk (talk) 18:51, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Cayembe in Ecuador is less than half a degree north of the equator, and has a permanent snow cap. Rojomoke (talk) 19:05, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

That's what I was going to say ;-). Indeed, it's less than half a tenth of a degree north of the equator. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 19:11, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Guess I've grown up around fools. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:38, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Doesn't Kilamanjaro pretty much stand alone and visible from a long distance? Probably better known to the average student than one of the many peaks in the Andes. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:48, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Isn't this just another way of reinforcing Hulk's claim? See Dunning–Kruger effect and all that. ;-) --Stephan Schulz (talk) 20:57, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

The self-deception discussed in that article reminds me of a segment of The Way of the Weasel, in which Dilbert's author Adams points out that we are no bigger weasels to anyone else than we are to ourselves. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:26, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Chimborazo at 1°28' North, has snow. CS Miller (talk) 21:02, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

How many people had personal computers with Internet connection in 1997?

I am wondering how many people back in 1997 had personal computers with Internet connection, and how many children were on the Internet at that time, and what were the popular children's websites, and whether or not people were concerned with Internet safety and privacy, or how many computer users were programmers versus non-programmers. 140.254.227.63 (talk) 20:22, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

The web was still in its very early days. The internet at that time was not yet synonymous with the web, and people still probably used the internet more for email than for web browsing. Websites were text-heavy because of many users' lack of bandwidth and memory. I don't think that there were "popular children's websites", or, if there were, I don't know how we would identify them now. People were certainly concerned about internet safety at the time. A disproportionate number of users at that time were students and academics accessing the internet from university facilities, since universities had the best connections. Users outside of universities generally had to make do with very slow dial-up modems. A graph in our article Global Internet usage shows about 15 million internet "hosts" in 1997. This source indicates that there were 70 million "users" that year. If I am right that many of these users had access through university computers that they did not own, then these numbers do not directly answer your question. Marco polo (talk) 20:50, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

What about PBSKids and Barbie.com? 140.254.227.63 (talk) 21:19, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

In 1997, really? I was already an internet addicted teenager then and I had the impression that I was a latecomer. There was ICQ, and I hung out on several websites and chat groups with other teenagers, many much younger than me. Everyone had a Geocities page full of blinking text and gifs. Web browsing was essentially the same as it is now (except you were stuck with Altavista or whatever). Even the concept of online dating already existed although it was certainly not accepted like it is now. Browsing was pretty slow though...I remember when we got a 28.8k baud modem and it seemed blindingly fast. Adam Bishop (talk) 22:17, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Note that this will depend significiantly on where you lived. I first got internet access in 1995 and IIRC in early 1996 I was the only one in my class of ~40 who had it (the internet came up in a class). In 1997 I recall a few more people used the internet in one way or the other and some minor usage in some school projects. It really took off in late 1997 and in 1998 and by 1999 probably most of my ~50 classmates had email addresses (although obviously not all had internet access from home, some wouldn't have even had edit:regular access to computers). Most parents in my school were probably in the low to middle income brackets for a suburban area in Kuala Lumpur, I imagine things were different for those in wealthier areas as they were for those in rural and poorer areas. (Also in 1998-1999 I was in the only full science and also top class for my year.)

Nil Einne (talk) 04:01, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

AOL.
Sleigh (talk) 21:32, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Ultima Online.
Sleigh (talk) 21:41, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Prodigy (online service). Heck, I live in the boonies, and we were on the net before Clinton's second term (before we got cable TV, IIRC). 1997 would've been around the time I started sneaking on in the middle of the night to visit sites my folks didn't want me to visit and also download stuff I wouldn't've had time to before someone needed to use the phone (like the demo for Hexen, a whopping 5 megs!). By 2001, all my friends had email, even if we didn't use it to communicate with each other.

I don't know what anyone else was doing in 97, but around 98 and 99, most of the kids at church were into Neopets, and my brother, our friends, and I would talk about fan sites for Pokemon and Dragonball Z we found on Dogpile. Ian.thomson (talk) 04:18, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

I can't answer the question directly, but I do know that I was teaching adults how to access the Internet in 1996 in the UK, so we weren't technologically backwards then... --TammyMoet (talk) 11:07, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Sorry for my apparently inaccurate response above. I was in my mid-30s in 1997, and a substantial majority of people, even in the United States, did not have Internet access at that time. The people I knew who did (including myself) mostly had access through academic institutions, though a non-academic friend of mine who is an early adapter had home access. But I'm not a digital native, and I wasn't a child or adolescent during the 90s, so I lack that perspective. Still, while clearly there were sites that young people frequented in 1997, it's important to remember that, even in the rich countries (US, Canada, western and central Europe, Japan, Antipodes), a minority of households had any Internet access at all, and household Internet access was exceedingly rare in the developing world. Marco polo (talk) 13:33, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

• I learned how to program BASIC on a TRS80 before I was a teen. That's my only computer training. I was using a modem to access chat boards in 1987. It was a direct computer-to-server phone call, and you had to know the phone number of the server. My brother in law and my sister were pestering me to get email in 1994, when they were at graduate school. I got internet access in 1996. (LIke Ian, this was before I could get cable, either in my apt building in NY, or in my childhood home in NJ.) I shortly heard of Yahoo which made surfing easy, and joined some e-lists, one of which had Jimmy Wales as a member. I set up a rather large (about 100 page) website along with a blog-like feature where other people could add comments if I emailed them a password to upload to the server. I went and chatted with the campus IT guys regularly, who were brilliant yet very unbusy, given most people weren't using their University account.

I never had AOL or Compuserve', and feel bad for people who have to deal with those companies as legacy email providers. In 1999 I made my first purchase at Amazon. That was my first commercial use of the web. I was in Manhattan on 9/11. Phone calls went to a fast busy or a "your call cannot be placed" message. I was able to email everyone I knew that I was safe at home, since my shift that day wasn't scheduled until noon. Nowadays I have cut off my cable service, and other than Jeopardy, Wheel, the local news, and special events like the Olympics, all my TV and movies are on the internet. μηδείς (talk) 17:32, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

You can watch the Olympics online. Just ask Jeeves about a "first row". Jeopardy's much more elusive. I've been missing it since 2010. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:11, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

You can get pretty incredible over-the-air HD reception with a new TV now. Much better than what you get from cable. If Jeopardy is local, you shouldn't be missing it. μηδείς (talk) 00:25, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

I can see the CBC repeater tower from my window, and used to get clear reception just using the coax cable itself as an antenna. But since they've gone to digital, it's all or nothing, and 77% (rabbit ears) strength doesn't cut it. The government mailed me an satellite boxtop for FTA channels, but insisted I couldn't get the dish unless I let their guys install and connect it. I keep telling myself I'll find my old StarChoice dish tomorrow, but then I get distracted by every single show except Jeopardy at my fingers. Hard to stream in HD, though. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:55, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

I had Internet at home in 1995, but it wasn't a year before my mom decided it wasn't worth the price, especially since the school had it. Wasn't long before they got their T3 line, and I graduated from reading dirty jokes to looking at actual(ish) boobs. Basically all I remember learning there. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:25, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

As has been mentioned, lots of people who were computer enthusiasts were using pay-for bulletin board systems before the internet came along. No-one's mentioned America Online and Compuserve yet, and they were very big at the time. In 1993 (I think) AOL allowed its users on to the internet, which meant Usenet and Gopher servers rather than the world wide web at the time, although web access did follow. Compuserve also followed a few years later. In addition there were some very early internet service providers. I happened on the internet while at university, then after graduating in 1994 got a modem and an account with one of the first British ISPs, and am still with them.

Incidentally, I would put the year in which internet use became mainstream as early 1994 - this was when newspapers started covering it and The Net was on BBC TV. Most people were referring to the information superhighway at this time. Sam Blacketer (talk) 21:58, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

I did mention both AOL and Compuserve. AOL was also mentioned and linked to by Sleigh. I bolded my mentions so they are not lost in the text. μηδείς (talk) 22:16, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

We first got internet at uni in about 1994, when there were only a few dozen pages, and our version of Windows was 3.1.... KägeTorä - (影虎) (TALK) 19:47, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

Same-sex marriage among indigenous people in Canada

Reading over Same-sex marriage under United States tribal jurisdictions and Same-sex marriage in Canada, I wondered if Canada's legalization of same-sex marriage applied to First Nations, Inuit, and Métis jurisdictions or not. I'm not too familiar with aboriginal governance in Canada compared to that in the United States; this question may be obvious to a Canadian. Paging resident expert Skookum1. --BDD (talk) 20:29, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Same-sex marriage in Canada#Same-sex marriage by province, Same-sex marriage in Nunavut and Same-sex marriage in the Northwest Territories all indicate that marriage licences were issued starting July 20, 2005. That would apply to Inuit, Métis and First Nations because the NWT and NU are not Aboriginal jurisdictions. The only two Inuit jurisdictions (Nunavik, Nunatsiavut) are still part of their provinces so would be required to abide by those laws. This (quote: "When it comes to same-sex marriage, tribes across the U.S. are in a much different position than in Canada because tribal justice systems are sovereign from state laws and can determine many of their own regulations.") would seem to indicate that the marriage laws would also apply to on reserve First Nations people. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 01:46, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

It would seem so. Thanks for the info. --BDD (talk) 17:41, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Blazons

I have a black-and-white photo of a banner with a lion rampant, superimposed on an X, which is itself inside a square; everything else in the banner (surrounding the square) is the same dark color. What would be the blazon for this? I'm assuming the X to be a saltire (although again, it's a square, not a rectangle like the flag of Scotland), and I have no idea about the color of anything in the photo. The picture is of a group meeting, with a speaker talking to listeners, and there are several of these banners on the wall. I don't know anything more about the circumstances of the scene; for example, although the banner looks like it's being used as a logo, I don't know what the group was. Nyttend backup (talk) 21:30, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Almost certainly something to do with the Royal Regiment of Scotland. If you scroll down to the bottom of the page, I think that you will find your banner in colour. 86.183.79.240 (talk) 07:19, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

If it is that flag, then the blazon is Azure, a saltire argent, overall a lion rampant or. —Tamfang (talk) 01:49, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

At the risk of stating the obvious, it is the superimposition of the lion rampant from the Royal Standard of Scotland, over the Flag of Scotland, the saltire of Saint Andrew. Alansplodge (talk) 17:10, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

Why is Astronaut Group 20 called "The Chumps"?

Group 20 from 2009 is called "The Chumps." Chump is commonly defined as an incompetent person (Wiktionary source). Doesn't really seem like the kind of thing an astronaut would be called. 75.75.42.89 (talk) 22:04, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

My guess is that it's some form of self-deprecating humor. Other nicknames, like "The Hairballs," aren't very flattering either. --BDD (talk) 22:18, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

See http://www.collectspace.com/news/news-100809a.html. This is the source cited in the article. Group 19 got to choose the name. RudolfRed (talk) 22:20, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

I see now how 19 got from Chimps to Chumps. Is it known why 20 wanted Chimps for any specific reason? 75.75.42.89 (talk) 23:44, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Perhaps a reference to monkeys and apes in space. --BDD (talk) 23:56, 12 February 2014 (UTC)