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Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2015 May 31

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May 31

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What has Wat got in his hand? (17th Century portraiture)

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Walter Ralegh and his Son

What has Wat Ralegh (son of Walter Ralegh), got in his right hand in this picture? DuncanHill (talk) 01:14, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

His ding-a-ling? --Jayron32 01:36, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
It don't look like any ding-a-ling I've ever seen. DuncanHill (talk) 01:47, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Looks like a glove to me—and, assuming that the same portrait is being described, to the Devonshire Association for the Advancement of Science, Literature, and Art. - Nunh-huh 02:28, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I think it's the same picture (can only see snippets of the book). DuncanHill (talk) 02:36, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, yes it is the same picture - the book says "in the possession of Sir J. F. Lennard" and the National Portrait Gallery page about the picture says it was given by the Lennard family. DuncanHill (talk) 02:40, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
They're also both dated 1602, so glove it is. - Nunh-huh 02:43, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • The thing is, if it is a glove, is it one of his father's? The colour matches his father's jacket, not Wat's. Would their perhaps have been some symbolism to a son carrying his father's gloves? DuncanHill (talk) 02:53, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
It doesn't seem like a terribly allegorical painting to me, so I wouldn't look for any deeper meaning. I know YMMD. The glove is closer in color to WR père, but it doesn't really match the outfit of père or fils. I'd sooner ponder the question of 'who has the other glove?' - Nunh-huh 03:16, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
He might be holding a pair of gloves, but who knows? Alansplodge (talk) 08:49, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
It's a primitive early baseball glove. Who's on first base, and Wat's on second. Clarityfiend (talk) 10:19, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Wat (born 1593) looks here like a 9 years old alright, and a pretty frail one too. Does anyone know what happened to him? He must have died young, as it was his younger brother, Carew, who inherited his father's titles. Contact Basemetal here 17:52, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
According to this source Wat lived until 1618, when he was killed in an engagement with the Spanish in the Guianas with his father (which engagement proved to also be the cause of his father's execution). Dwpaul Talk 18:00, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • My immediate thought on seeing the picture is that it reminds me of a strap with a "blind" spur. This would be consistent with Walter Raleigh being a knight (he was knighted in 1585, I think) and his son therefore being his esquire (the boy who carries his armour and his spurs - the right to bear spurs was of particular significance in Devon). This would be consistent with the formal nature of the portrait. Unfortunately, I'm not an expert, so this is simply an observation as a "fresh pair of eyes". RomanSpa (talk) 16:36, 1 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

fictional scarecrow

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I remember that when I was seven years old, there was a book about a scarecrow who had friends, especially with a human girl and they go to different places around the world like India. Does anybody remember that story or that particular character? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.29.35.69 (talk) 03:03, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

'Go to different places around the world like India'? India doesn't travel to other countries, or do you mean he travelled to countries similar to India? KägeTorä - (影虎) (もしもし！) 16:37, 2 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Sounds very much like the Oz series of books, although they don't actually go to India (but may have gone to a place that resembles it, in the fictional land of Oz). You're probably familiar with The Wizard of Oz, but there are many other books in that series. Depending on the book, the girl could be Dorothy or perhaps Princess Ozma.
Here's an example of some of the Oz characters in an "India-like" place (actually Arab, but probably close enough for a 7 year old): [1]. StuRat (talk) 03:23, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
See Category:Fictional scarecrows.—Wavelength (talk) 03:54, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
My search turned up this series of educational books for young readers (which fits with you being seven years old) featuring Trek the scarecrow and his journeys around the world - one of which is to India. Here is a PDF copy of Trek Learns to Fly that might spark your memory. MarnetteD|Talk 03:56, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Worzel Gummidge. 81.141.215.133 (talk) 10:22, 1 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Yes....there we go. Trek the Scarecrow. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.31.17.135 (talk) 16:11, 3 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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