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September 4

Zhu Cilang

What happened to Zhu Cilang, the son of the Chongzhen Emperor, during the Transition from Ming to Qing? How did he die? -- 02:49, 4 September 2021 67.170.133.177

What is the best Bible book available?

What would be the best book available dealing with the question of the actual meaning and authenticity of the events referred to in the Bible, meeting the following criteria (in descending order of priority):

main objective: reconstructing the historical truth as far as possible, implying:
- a factual, sober, rational stance as unbiased / neutral as can be, not requiring religious faith by the reader
- an empirical–historical approach, i. e. with strong focus on verifiable archaeological or other reliable extrabiblical sources
- a strictly historical, chronological approach (i. e., for instance, no retrospective interpretation of events from the Old Testament in the light of the New Testament)
the best possible reputation of the work itself and/or its authors (ideally several luminaries) in terms of the broadest possible recognition and consensus among the international academic community of the relevant evidence-based (!) sciences (such as archaeology, religious studies, ancient Near East studies, Egyptology / Assyriology etc.)
as up-to-date as possible
as concise and comprehensible as possible, but as sophisticated (meaning complex) as necessary (it needn't be extremely detailed)

In fact, it wouldn't even have to cover the whole (Christian) bible as such – my main field of interest is actually approaching the best-documented theories about the truth of

the events in the Second Book of Moses (Exodus), and
the life of Jesus – including the question what most probably mobilized his followers after his death.

However, as I seem to be looking for something like the "Holy Grail" of a [historical-critical] bible introduction, I would also be okay with two books if necessary. (As German is my mother tongue, German would be ideal, but I guess my understanding of English is more or less reasonable – so this is a secondary criterion only to consider in case all the requirements above are fully met – but I guess the best of the best will be in English, and that would do totally fine as well!) Hoping for your kind, profound advice--Hildeoc (talk) 08:28, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I have some uninvolved (being Wiccan) interest in this subject, and have various books dealing with particular aspects of this very large and hotly disputed topic, but I can't think of one (or two) that really deal with the whole issue comprehensively. I'm sure you've already read our article Historicity of the Bible.

Others will have suggestions, but the UsefulCharts YouTube channel has recently made a series of 4 "Who Wrote the Bible" videos which deal with this topic and which I found useful: Episode 1 is here. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.122.0.2 (talk) 13:15, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

As a German, you're in luck! German proficiency is almost necessary in this field, since the Germans are so prominent in it. You will have access to many of the latest papers. But you're not going to find one book about the whole bible that's academically rigorous and current. There are good books on early Christianity (I haven't heard of any good ones on Exodus in particular but there might be one meeting your criteria.) One of the best places to ask for these book recommendations is Reddit's r/academicbiblical. Their basic stance on scholarly honesty/legitimacy is the same as yours. I would also ask them to point you to a third forum where people would know about German-language books, if they don't know any. Temerarius (talk) 19:22, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Hildeoc: Well, it depends. The New Jerome Biblical Commentary of 1990 is a superb work of Catholic biblical exegesis of the entire Bible. A new, revised, version of the Commentary will be published in 2022 and it will be called The Jerome Biblical Commentary for the 21st Century.

If you want to go on the specific, I suggest you these books: OLD TESTAMENT

Who Were the Early Israelites and Where Did They Come from? of William G. Dever
Has Archeology Buried the Bible? of William G. Dever (the title is a provocation, but the book is not provocative at all)

These works are only in English and not in German, unfortunately

NEW TESTAMENT On Jesus

The Birth of the Messiah of Raymond E. Brown
The Death of the Messiah of Raymond E. Brown
A Marginal Jew: Rethinking the Historical Jesus by John P. Meier
- Volume 1: The roots of the problem and the person
- Volume 2: Mentor, Message and Miracles
- Volume 3: Companions and Competitors
- Volume 4: Law and Love

On Paul the Apostle

I don't have a "best book" about Paul, but I intend to read the works of Joseph Fitzmyer and Jerome Murphy-O'Connor.

On Saint Peter

Again, I don't have a "best book", but I intend to read the works of Rudolf Pesch about him.

Most of the scholars I pointed out here are Roman Catholics, but are widely appreciated by non-Catholic scholars as well.-Karma1998 (talk) 12:35, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Doris Webster, author, 1885-1967

What do we know about Doris Webster, co-author of Consider the Consequences! (1930)? We have an article about her co-author, Mary Alden Hopkins, with whom she wrote several books. I can find a number of these books, and her solo works, listed online, but no biographical information, other than that, according to this (paywalled) article she was the wife of Samuel C. Webster, with whom she collaborated on the novel Uncle James' Shoes, was a director of the Rider Press, and of the Cumulative Digest Corporation (whatever that was). OCLC has her dates as 1885-1967. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 11:37, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The husband may be Samuel Charles Webster, son of Charles Luther Webster, in which case, Doris was née Webb. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:48, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

confirmed via [1]. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 13:00, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

According to the ISFDB, a Doris Webb wrote two reviews of Oz books by L. Frank Baum in 1914 and 1915, which were reprinted in the (rather well-produced) fanzine The Baum Bugle in its Autumn 2014 and Winter 2015 issues. Hope this helps! {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.122.0.2 (talk) 13:28, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:04, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Webb-3 and (more reliable) sources quoted there. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:04, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"Wooden goods" might be a misreading of "woollen goods". AnonMoos (talk) 16:06, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Do you have any specific reason to suspect a misreading? (And, given the American context, if a misreading, then more likely of "woolen".) --Lambiam 07:28, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Just that I remember having seen the phrase "wool(l)en goods" a number of times, but not the other one... AnonMoos (talk) 06:57, 7 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is there any site that allow me to see the market cap of coin X at coin Y?

Most sites show only the market cap of coin X in BTC or a fiat currency (many allow only BTC and dollars), is there any sites that allow you to compare with market cap of lets say NXT (or any other coin)?191.250.232.243 (talk) 18:16, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you're meaning the exchange rate between two cryptocurrencies, then WolframAlpha has some of them, but not Bitcoin Next. For example for WolframAlpha indicates that at somepoint on 4 Sept 2021, 1 Bitcoin would by 13.12 Ethers. LongHairedFop (talk) 12:34, 6 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Ethnicity statistics for American Library Association (ALA) Council

What are the ethnicity statistics for all members of the American Library Association Council as of 2021? Note, I am not referring to members of the American Library Association (ALA) as a whole, but members of the ALA Council specifically. -- 18:41, 4 September 2021 12.27.66.4

I don't know, but it's likely that, for example, the ALA affiliate the Black Caucus of the American Library Association could tell you if you contact them – their wbsite is linked in their article's infobox.

If not them, perhaps one of the other relevent affiliates listed at American Library Association#Affiliates could do so.

This is of course assuming that the ALA themselves aren't forthcoming with the information. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.122.0.2 (talk) 19:21, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Precolonial confederations like the Iroquois Haudenosaunee on other continents?

Not finding much of anything at List of confederations. I'm looking for a confederation of half a dozen or so peoples, speaking different (though possibly related) languages, rather than a tribal confederation within a single nation, or a union of just two nations. Somewhere other than North America or Europe, unless maybe for Europe it's pre-Roman. Any ideas? — kwami (talk) 18:49, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

How about the Sea Peoples? Or if they're too mysterious for you, perhaps the Rus' people? Card Zero (talk) 22:01, 4 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Good ideas, but this is for a naming proposal, so I need to know what their languages were, and those need to be reasonably well attested. — kwami (talk) 01:30, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

What is this naming proposal about? Should the confederation be defined by the languages of the participating peoples? The Delian League was one of several military alliances of Ancient Greek city-states, all speaking different dialects of Ancient Greek. A later but still pre-Roman example is the League of Corinth. --Lambiam 07:16, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It's kind of a weird project. They'd be names taken from the same word in each of the languages, so the languages would need to be reasonably distinctive. The Iroquoian languages are distinct enough that they'd work (though barely in a few cases), but I'm trying to think of other possibilities. I know I said maybe pre-Roman Europe, but I should avoid Greek, as it's part of our classical tradition, and anyway I suspect that individual words in Doric, Attic, Aeolic and Ionic wouldn't be that far apart. I should probably also avoid confederations created for the purpose of conquest and subjugation, like the Huns (not that we know which languages the Huns spoke). — kwami (talk) 08:21, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Golden Horde? It was not created for the purpose of conquest but resulted from the division of Genghis Khan's Mongol Empire, and we have a better idea of the range of languages of the involved tribes. --Lambiam 22:23, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is it pretty much just Mongol and Kipchak? I'd need half a dozen languages. Also, it's the result of disintegration rather than unification. — kwami (talk) 09:12, 6 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I keep thinking of the Hanse, but you specified pre-Roman. Oh, there's Category:Former confederations. Card Zero (talk)

The Hanse is quite a good idea, apart from being European and being cities rather than nations that joined together. I don't see anything else in the category where peoples speaking more than just a language or two came together in near-equality to build something greater, in a union that was more than just a temporary alliance. — kwami (talk) 08:53, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Does the Muisca Confederation fit your purposes? --Jayron 32 17:53, 7 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, @Jayron32:. Was it a confederation of more that one people, speaking different languages? From the article, it sounds like a confederation of Muisca-speaking people, which would give me only one language to work with. (There was a table with words in different Chibchan languages, but no source or indication that these had anything to do with the Muisca confederation.) — kwami (talk) 22:56, 10 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2021 September 4

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