Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2022 June 24

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June 24

US presidential 3rd term?

If X were elected twice as US president, and then elected as VP to Y, and the president-elect Y died before taking office, would X then serve a full 3rd term as president? That would seem to work w the 22nd amendment. — kwami (talk) 23:39, 24 June 2022 (UTC)

Per the 12th Amendment, [b]ut no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.

You could find there's a possible quibble, given that the 22nd Amendment says that a person who's been elected twice before cannot be elected to the office, rather than that they can't hold the office; so are they really "ineligible"? I think the answer would be yes, especially since "ineligible" can be read as literally meaning "cannot be elected". Still, the argument could be made. --Trovatore (talk) 00:40, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

And I believe a person can be VP 1st, for 2 years, and successfully run 2 more terms as president. However, if he were VP 1st, for more than 2 years, he can only run 1 term as president. 67.165.185.178 (talk) 03:28, 25 June 2022 (UTC).

What would be the reason for that? — kwami (talk) 06:29, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

I guess I always assumed it was to set a maximum time (10 years) that any one person can be president. I don't have any link handy to back that up. I would be (mildly) interested to hear if anyone knows more specifically what was discussed. (That said, it's often a mistake to suppose there's any one "reason" for any given constitutional or even statutory prevision; the language of a law is what can get passed, and different legislators may have different reasons.) --Trovatore (talk) 06:33, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

Between the 12th, 22nd and 25th amendments, it would seem there's a loophole whereby someone could be appointed to VP an unlimited number of times. The House and Senate could block someone from playing that game, but they wouldn't necessarily have to. --←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:31, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

I don't think there's any limit to the number of times you can be vice president, even by the normal electoral process, unless you've been elected president twice (in which case the limit is zero).

Maybe your point is that you could be president an unlimited number of times, as long as you weren't elected president twice (or once plus two years of someone else's term), but became president by repeatedly succeeding from the vice presidency. I suppose that's true. Seems unlikely ever to come up, but formally it sounds like a valid point. --Trovatore (talk) 17:51, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

It's the Gerald Ford case extrapolated to an extreme. --←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:55, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

You could also succeed to the presidency by succeeding from house speaker, if the VP ducked out for some reason. That would bypass the VP eligibility requirements. Iirc, it is not clear that you have to be a member of congress in order to become house speaker. It's traditional, like the pope is in practice always chosen from the college of cardinals, but it's not required. So perhaps we can restore Trump to the WH, or alternatively install Hillary Clinton there, without having to deal with that messy electoral process. 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA (talk) 18:30, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

I think the 25th Amendment actually specifies that the speaker would become "acting president" rather than technically president. Originally it wasn't clear whether a VP who took over the office would be "acting president"; it was settled by John Tyler calling himself president and getting it to stick. I wonder if we'd have a replay of that. --Trovatore (talk) 18:59, 25 June 2022 (UTC)

There is still an "acting president." When the president is undergoing hospital-surgery for some time, the VP is the "acting president." And so if the president and VP both resign or die, then the House speaker is president, not acting-president. 67.165.185.178 (talk) 14:09, 26 June 2022 (UTC).

The "and so" does not follow. According to our article United States presidential line of succession, [t]he Presidential Succession Act refers specifically to officers beyond the vice president acting as president rather than becoming president when filling a vacancy. --Trovatore (talk) 16:36, 26 June 2022 (UTC)

Trovatore, acting-president means when the president is no longer in a hospitalized/surgery, the acting-president loses his presidency. Which would be the case if both the president and VP are both undergoing surgery at the same time. But if they both die, then the successor is no longer an "acting president." 67.165.185.178 (talk) 02:53, 27 June 2022 (UTC).

Temporary incapacity of the president is the only way anyone has ever been "acting president" till now (though not everyone agreed at Tyler's time). However, if our article is correct, the Presdiential Succession Act does stipulate that any successor other than the vice president would be acting as president. --Trovatore (talk) 03:19, 27 June 2022 (UTC)