Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2007 October 6

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October 6

Breathe in HEBREW

hi :)

how do you write BREATHE in hebrew?

many thanks :) --202.175.29.2 02:04, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

What form of the word do you want? The citation form (which you'll find in dictionaries) is נשם nasham, the infinitive "to breathe" is לנשום linshom, the imperative/command "breathe!" is נשום neshom to a man or נשמי nishmi to a woman. Is one of these what you want? Macnas 15:13, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

this is great .. thanks :) you've been super helpful. --202.175.29.2 06:57, 8 October 2007 (UTC) like breathe... when you're stress you say "breathe... wusaah" something like that.

That'd be the imperative - you're commanding the person to do something (even if the command is very gentle) --Dweller 10:00, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Verb much?

Where did this irritating type of question come from? For example, you trip while walking, and someone says "walk much?" I never thought about it when it was just something young people said, but now my father has picked it up...does it even have a definite origin? Adam Bishop 02:44, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know its origin, but I remember hearing it at least twenty years ago when I was in university. - Eron ^Talk 02:45, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

If this is "walk much?" used to mean "do you walk much?", then it's just a form of verbal shorthand which all languages seem to develop to some degree. This clipped use of language became normal in the British Army in the nineteenth century, if not before. Probably you'd have heard "walk much?" even then. Also, perhaps the staccato headlines of newspapers and the invention of the telegraph and later the Marconigram (with the message being charged at so much a word) promoted such forms of language. Xn4 13:22, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I've also heard it in the form of "adjective much?", for example in the movie Heathers, where one character says to another, "Jealous much?" meaning "Are you very jealous?" —Angr 13:53, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I always took that as a play on the "Walk much?" sarcastic rhetorical question. Dismas|^(talk) 13:57, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Agreed, to me this form of question connotes sarcasm/deprecation. 38.112.225.84 20:00, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I remember hearing "walk much?" in Waynesboro, Virginia, in the mid-1970s from one of my friend's fathers. We then picked up the "much" part and expanded it in a number of ways: "Drive much?", "talk much?", etc. Definitely a sarcastic jibe at someone's skill level in whatever activity is undertaken.

Are you a patient even if you're just in for routine medical exams?

If a person is not being treated for any illness, etc., but is simply going for routine checkups, are they still considered a patient of their doctor? I know a broad term would be clientele, but that, to me, is the whole group. ("The doctor refused to consider lying to his clientele.") And yet, saying the person is the doctor's client makes it sound more like the doctor is a lawyer. I suppose the parent of a child could be a client of the pediatrician, or part of the clientele, but the child would be...what? A patient anyway?

Maybe it's one of those times where words just don't look right, but it seems a little odd, as I'm used to thinking of patients only in hospital settings. Thanks.4.68.248.130 12:49, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

According to Chambers 20th Century Dictionary, a patient is "one who bears or suffers: a person under medical or surgical treatment: a physician's client". Xn4 12:59, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm, that's kind of what I was thinking - but that's where it's confusing, becasue is a person under medical treament if they are simply in for a checkup. If the doctor dismisses the person and says, "You're fit as a fiddle," and prescribes nothing for him/her, has he really treated the person by that standard? Or is being checked as a precaution stil considered treatment? I guess the doctor has, in a sense, prescribed something - for isntance, saying to continue the regular course of action the person has been taking to stay fit, etc.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.68.248.130 (talk) 13:06, 6 October 2007 (UTC) 4.68.248.130 13:07, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

By its origin the word suggests bearing suffering. However, "a physician's client" (see above) doesn't. In the UK, the word is used in all medical contexts, including GPs' surgeries. I can't think of another one we use here, so someone going for a routine check-up is a patient. Indeed, here you are called a GP's patient if you are registered on his or her list, so you can be a patient without ever having a day's illness. Xn4 13:10, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I, an American, would also call them a patient. Going in for a check up does provide care for the patient, it's preventative care. Dismas|^(talk) 13:14, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Let's assume that a patient is a person "under medical treatment" (Advanced Learner, SOED). This does not necessary imply he is ill: a check-up may be considered to be medical treatment (after all, in countries where health services are not free, it has to be paid for). The etymology of "sufferer" is distinct from its present-day meaning. Bessel Dekker 13:18, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Etymologically, a patient is a passive party, as an agent is an active party. Thus it is perfectly appropriate for somebody undergoing tests. SaundersW 22:08, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

"Treatment" is any (appropriate) attention paid by a doctor to their patient, including checking them out and saying "You're 100% fine. Come back for another check-up in 6 months". -- JackofOz 03:50, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Is that the usage among medical professionals? (In my layman's usage, I distinguish between consultation and treatment.) I think "patient" has acquired, through usage, a modern meaning of "client of a medical professional"; the modern meaning is not a reinterpretation of the literal meaning(s) of its etymological roots. --71.175.68.224 10:30, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree "patient" means simply "client of a medical professional" regardless of the form of treatment or the nature of the visit. In fact, I'd say a client of a medical professional is a patient even if there is no visit: if you see your doctor by chance at the movies and say hello, when the doctor goes home he may well tell his wife, "I saw one of my patients at the movies", even though there was no medical investigation going on at all. —Angr 11:05, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

This is surely correct. Etymology does not, after all, tell us anything about the true meaning (usage) of a word: it relates to its true root or true provenance. Bessel Dekker 12:49, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Sign language curiosity

I was reading the sign language article and was curious about a few things, so if anyone happens to know...
1. Does the interior monologue of a native signer consist of visualized signs?
2. Could one "mutter" in sign?
I'm genuinely curious. Thanks! Bhumiya (said/done) 15:04, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm afraid I don't know the answer to either of these questions, but I can answer one you didn't ask, namely, "Can babies babble in sign?", to which the answer is "Yes". Babies of people who use sign language "babble" with their hands in the same way babies of parents who use spoken language babble by saying "ba-ba-ba-ba-ba" or "ga-ga-goo-goo". This is true regardless of whether the baby in question himself is deaf or hearing. —Angr 15:34, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe one could mutter in sign. When a friend showed me some sign language once, and I tried to copy, he noted that the signe symbols has to be very crisp and clear, for one to get the message. If one does a halfhearted sign with their hands, perhaps that would be considered muttering or mumbling.209.244.30.221 16:51, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Right, and just like spoken language has places of articulation and manner of articulation, the hand shape, the hand position, and the movement of the hands are all factors which influence meaning. Sign language#Linguistics of sign has more details. --Kjoonlee 17:13, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the responses! Bhumiya (said/done) 06:30, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm afraid this isn't an answer to your questions either, but I thought you might find this interesting as well. SignWriting is a way of transcribing sign language onto paper, using simplified pictures as symbols. SignWriting users tend to find writing more comfortable if the pictures are from the signer's point of view, not from an onlooker's point of view. --Kjoonlee 21:06, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Oops! We have SignWriting at Wikipedia as well. The note about comfort might not be true; they just say it's better[1] about 3 minutes into the video here. --Kjoonlee 21:14, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

It's quite common for signers to sign to themselves, in the same way people with a spoken native language talk to themselves. Signers also have been known to sign in their sleep, just as others talk in their sleep. It's one of the proofs that sign language is a true language, because it locates itself in the same part of the brain (as I'm led to believe). Steewi 01:00, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Song Translation

Can someone please translate this song into English? It's "Motteke! Sera Fuku" (Take It! My Sailor Uniform):

Aimai 3 cm sore PUNI tte koto kai? chou! na kyuubunka seifuku na furitte koto nai? BOON! ganbacchau? yacchacchau? son tokkya KYACCHI ANDO RIRI-SU yo! I SAY! WHOO! I SAY! WHOO! no tanima ni DARLING! DARLING! PLEASE!

nan kataru nanka deru aishiteru! are? ikko ga chigatterun run! nayaminbo, koutetsubo, oishinbo! iikagen ni shinasai! tondetta aisu mo moteru ka na, datte iwayuru futsuu no onna no ko! odoroita! atashi dake! tonkotsu, harigane, okawari! DA-DA-DA-DA-DA!

BON! BON! ouendan! LET'S GET CHERRY PIE! RAN! RAN! kangeikai! YOU HAVE SENSATION! HIGH! sonzaikai, tenten shouwakusei! butsukatte! tokemashita! bouzen! ooi ni utatte! SING AND DANCE!

motteike, saigo ni waracchau no wa atashi no hazu! SE-RA- fuku dakara desu ketsuron! getsuyoubi na no ni kigen warui no, dou suru yo? natsufuku ga ii no desu! KAWAII!

seifuku in 3 PI-SU! sorya matette chuucho da! YAN! ganbatte! YEAH! harikitte! YEAH! MY DARLING! DARLING! PLEASE!

mori jou ga rin mori ka ga rin koishi tarin mada naisho ni shi te tte rin rin amaenbou youjinbou tsuushin bo choushi koi te gyokusai! fun de tta aitsu ni koyubi itai tte oogesa chira ri kuro niihai zettai jan ryouiki jan sei ashi tsuru pika o nedari DADADADADA

MON - MON mousou den Let ' s Go! paru shinden YAI - YAI sooran bushi What ' s UP tenputeeshon oi! soushitsu kan ( zen zen) arubaito sagashi tara mitsukatte to zen jinsei maru tto kenennaashi

yatte mina! shinki ni neracchau no ha atashi no chousen Sera fuku gi ga e te mo atashi shuumatsu ha dou yo chira mise nante ari ki tari! seifuku ha kan ta n yo rakuchin

fuusoku 3 meetoru dakitsui te gaman da GYU mune dokkin koshi zukkin I'm Sugar sugar SWEET!!

BON - BON MON - MON Day Let's get! Uh Uh Ah! RAN - RAN chop chop kick look up! Fu Fu Ho! HI! Education!! Love is ABC un da ka da un da ka da uni unya hare tte hore tte hire n ra

motteike, saigo ni waracchau no wa atashi no hazu! SE-RA- fuku dakara desu ketsuron! getsuyoubi na no ni kigen warui no, dou suru yo? natsufuku ga ii no desu! KAWAII!

yappari ne saigo ni waracchau no ha atashi no hazu SE-RA- fuku dakara desu ketsuron!

aimai 3 senchi sorya punitte koto kai WAO! ra ppinguga seifuku yo shi furi tte ko ta nai pon ganbacchaccha yacchaccha an to kyaa ppu & jaaji de ha

I say ( Hoo!) I say ( Hoo!) ase de suke tara Darlin ' darlin ' A M U S E!! Kikiluvscheese 23:15, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

(non-serious answer) I suspect the song, as a whole, translates to this. rspeer / ɹəədsɹ 17:06, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

From a quick search, this is the Lucky Star OP, is it? I don't suppose you've got it in Kanji at all? It's amazingly hard to translate some things from romaji. (Not that I'm saying I can or will translate, but kanji/kana would make it easier.) Confusing Manifestation 06:27, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Thank you,Confusing Manifestation. I'll do just that:

曖昧3センチ　そりゃぷにってコトかい？　ちょっ！ らっぴんぐが制服…だぁぁ不利ってこたない　ぷ。 がんばっちゃ　やっちゃちゃ そんときゃーっち&Release ぎョッ 汗(Fuu)々(Fuu)の谷間に Darlin\' darlin\' F R E E Z E!!

なんかダるー　なんかデるー あいしテるー　あれ一個が違ってるんるー なやみン坊ー　高鉄棒ー おいしん簿ー　いーかげんにシナサイ

飛んでったアイツの火照るカラダって 所謂ふつーのおにゃのコ 驚いたあたしだけ？　豚骨ハリガネおかわりだだだ

BON-BON　おーえん団 Let\'s get!　チェリーパイ RAN-RAN　かんげー会 Look up!　せんせーしょん はい！存在感・・小惑星 ぶつかって溶けましたぼーぜん 大いに歌ってシレンジャー

もっていけ！ 最尾後に笑っちゃうのはあたしのはず セーラーふくだからです←結論 月曜日なのに！ 機嫌悪いのどうするよ？ 夏服がいいのです←キャ？ワ！イイｖ

接近3ぴくと　するまでってちゅーちょだ　やん☆ がんばって　はりきって　My Darlin\' darlin\' P L E A S E!!

もりあガりー　もりさガりー 恋したりー　まだ内緒にしといて倫理ー つうしん簿ー　ちょーしこいてギョクサイ

踏んでったアイツに小指イタイって 大げさちらーり黒ニーハイ 絶対じゃん領域じゃん？　生足ツルピカおおねだりだだだ

MON-MON　もーそう伝 Let\'s go! パル神殿 YAI-YAI　そーらん節 What\'s up?　テンプテーション おい！　喪失感￥￥アルバイト さがしたら見つかってとーぜん 人生まるっとケネンナーシ

やってみな！ 新規に狙っちゃうのはあたしのはず セーラーふく着替えても＝あたし 週末はどうよ？ チラみせんあんてありきたり！ 制服はかんたにょ＝ラクチン

風速３メートル　抱きついてがまんだ　ぎゅ☆ 胸どっきん　腰ずっきん　I\'m Sugar sugar S W E E T!!

BON-BON MON-MON Day Let\'s get! Uh Uh Ah! RAN-RAN chop chop kick Look up! Fu Fu Ho! Hi ! Education!! Love is ABC うんだかだーうんだかだーうにゃうにゃ はれってほれってひれんらー

もっていけ！ 最後に笑っちゃうのはあたしのはず セーラーふくだからです←結論 月曜日なのに！ 機嫌悪いのどうするよ？ 夏服がいいのです←キャ？　ワ！　イイｖ

やっぱりね 最後に笑っちゃうのはあたしのはず セーラーふくだからです←結論 曖昧3センチ　そりゃぷにってコトかい？　わお！ らっぴんぐが制服…よぉし不利ってこたない　ぽ。 がんばっちゃ　やっちゃっちゃ あんときゃーっぷ＆ジャージで　ハッ 汗々で透けたら Darlin\' darling\' A M U S E!!