Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2020 November 4

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November 4

Electoral - pronunciation

I've been watching US presidential elections for a long time, but this year for the first time I'm hearing some people pronounce the word "electoral" as ə-lek-TOR-əl rather than ə-LEK-tə-rəl.

Is this a new pronunciation, or have I just been not as observant as I thought I was. Is it perhaps a Southern thing? Are they making a distinction between the ordinary voters and the members of the Electoral College?-- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 22:09, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

M-W gives options with the stress on either of those syllables: [1]. Their version with the stress on TOR has a long vowel in the first syllable, which is a difference from what you described. I believe I first heard the word pronounced with the stress on TOR (and probably with initial long E). This would have been in a Southern US dialect. I don't believe I heard the word used in any other context than the phrase "Electoral College" for many years. This pronunciation may be connected with a traditional preference for phonics and spelling-based pronunciations in US education. --Amble (talk) 23:06, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

What about "electorate"? Surely it's never pronounced with the stress on the TOR? -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:11, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

I have only heard "electorate" with the stress on LEK. I believe I first encountered the fixed phrase "Electoral College" much earlier than either "electorate" or other uses of "electoral". --Amble (talk) 23:15, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

The Merriam-Webster pronunciation of electoral was recorded as early as 1961 and "apparently sprang up sometime after World War II". [2] The pronunciation you asked about, with initial schwa and accented third syllable, is described as having been "voguish" in America in 1992. [3] In Britain I've been hearing it occasionally for many years, but I wouldn't venture a guess how many. --Antiquary (talk) 11:16, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

• I've just been watching an interview with a former governor of Nevada, who used the non-word "elecTORIAL" at least a dozen times. How mischievious of her. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 19:45, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

  Those might be the kinds of folks who say "nucular". ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:51, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

  For all intensive purposes it is clear what they mean irregardless of how they say it.  --Lambiam 21:14, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

  Ain't it the truth! ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 03:37, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

Coincidentally, while Jack was hearing the ex-governor of Nevada speak, at 7:03 PM another lady, Louise Easton, (the newsreader on Magic radio) was doing exactly the same "The American election is on a knife-edge, with Trump supporters alleging electorial fraud" (Biden has just been called the winner). She pronounced the first vowel as in "he" and placed the primary stress on the third syllable. 194.35.119.92 (talk) 17:39, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

I hope this doesn't ruin your day, folks, but the OED has an entry for electorial as a synonym for electoral with citations going back as far as Edmund Burke. I'm afraid it's English, and English as good as two centuries of usage can make it. --Antiquary (talk) 22:10, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

I was quite young when I first heard a TV commentator use the word "electoral" votes, pronounced "ee-LECK-tor-al", and since I didn't know what electoral votes were, I thought he was saying "electrical". Although I cringe when I hear "ee-leck-TOR-al" (or worse yet, electorial), at least it avoids sounding like "electrical". ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 00:09, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

@ User:Antiquary: (Your hopes are dashed. That did ruin my day.) But seriously, sometimes people make up a pronunciation that is wrong as far as the spelling goes, but just happens to be a legitimate word. I mean, there's an Electoral College, not an Electorial College. Anyone pronouncing Electoral, in this context, as if it were Electorial is clearly mispronouncing, and hence clearly making a mistake. The fact that electorial just happens to have citations in other contexts doesn't alter that. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 00:41, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

I assume that electorial was formed (or reinvented) by analogy with senatorial. —Tamfang (talk) 10:04, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

Or dictatorial or editorial or factorial or sartorial or tutorial or any number of "-orial" things. Fun with English! ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 10:57, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

Well if you're gonna be that way – motorial sutorial tutorial amatorial auctorial castorial doctorial editorial factorial flotorial historial lectorial mentorial oratorial pictorial raptorial rectorial sartorial sectorial suctorial tectorial tentorial textorial vectorial viatorial adaptorial auditorial aviatorial curatorial electorial equatorial gemitorial genitorial haustorial janitorial juratorial lavatorial legatorial minatorial monitorial natatorial praetorial proctorial senatorial tinctorial venatorial visitorial volitorial agitatorial ancestorial assertorial clamatorial crematorial decretorial dictatorial directorial escritorial executorial feudatorial fundatorial gestatorial institorial inventorial mediatorial mercatorial migratorial offertorial piscatorial prefatorial purgatorial quaestorial raptatorial receptorial redactorial reductorial refectorial repertorial reportorial reptatorial saltatorial scriptorial sensatorial servitorial territorial accusatorial ambulatorial conductorial consistorial coronatorial dedicatorial excavatorial exercitorial exhibitorial expositorial gladiatorial glossatorial grallatorial imperatorial inspectorial involutorial irrigatorial jaculatorial judicatorial laboratorial precentorial preceptorial provostorial quizzatorial redemptorial spectatorial sussultorial visitatorial combinatorial compositorial examinatorial gubernatorial inquisitorial legislatorial observatorial permutatorial praefectorial praepostorial prepositorial procuratorial proprietorial repugnatorial requisitorial translatorial commentatorial conspiratorial contributorial disquisitorial nomenclatorial percontatorial improvisatorial investigatorial subpreceptorial prestidigitatorial, and that's after I removed 52 with prefixes or pre-/prae- variation. —Tamfang (talk) 01:46, 10 November 2020 (UTC)