Talk:Álfheimr

Talk

From the article: In that work, Jotunheim lies in the East, Muspellheim is clearly South, and Niflheim is just as obviously North, so one might infer that Alfheim is in the West, beyond the seas.

In what ways are these "obvious"? There aren't fire-giants in Middle-earth's south -- just a lot of Haradrim and elephants and such. --FOo 15:07, 20 Jan 2004 (UTC)

I think the wording referred to the world of Norse myth and legend, not to Tolkien's Middle-earth. But in any case, the only two references to Álfheim in Norse texts place it in heaven, not in the West, beyond the seas. Jallan 01:52, 17 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Two Different Concepts

Why exactly does this article address both the Norse mythological location of Alfheim, and the quite separate concept of fairyland? The former is a mythological location particular to Scandinavian culture, with its own place within the cosmology of their mythology, whereas the latter is a concept common to European folklore in general. To lump them together the way this article does is to commit a gross act of syncretism, particular to the modern tendency toward precise definition and elaboration that was not present in traditional belief. This article should quite definitely be split into two different articles, as, from a folkloric standpoint, it's completely illegitimate. M. H. L. in S. C. * Talk * Contributions

While the current article is admittedly in poor shape, the term itself (and, thus, concept) is specifically Germanic, no matter the later usage thereof. With this in mind, it is perfectly logical to handle the development of both here. :bloodofox: (talk) 05:21, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

Aobozu is right on this. If you actually looked at the source (Pitcairn), "Elf-hame (?)" was conjectural footnote readings that the editor gave to "Elfame", "Elfane", etc. The original wording did not contain this "-hame" stem. No linguistic work I can find, etymological dictionary etc., says it is cognate to Álfheimr, though one Scots dictionary rather recent did give it as "Cf.".

The form "Elphame" occurs in Pitcairn's index, used once in Chambers's Edinburgh journal, and used as standard by Robert Graves (probably explaining popularity of use among some readerships). Though I'm definitely against the use of "Elphame" spelling with respect to discussion of Child's Ballad # 37 Thomas the Rhymer because none of the mainstream scholars endorse that.

I'm going to move the §In English and Scots texts section in the article to Fairyland (Dictionary of the Older Scottish Tongue ([1]) gives elfame and elphyne glossed "Fairy land"). The mention in the lede will be deleted too. I might put a link under See also.--Kiyoweap (talk) 18:45, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress which affects this page. Please participate at Talk:Vanaheimr - Requested move and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RM bot 21:00, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Álfheimr/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Very nice article. 2 important things missing to consider adding: a picture, and the references.Goldenrowley 03:26, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Substituted at 01:16, 22 May 2016 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Älvalek.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 16:07, 2 October 2022 (UTC)