Talk:Beauty and the Beast/Archive 1

Archive 1

The Royal Library of the Netherlands has some nice pictures of old B&B manuscripts available here. The copyright information they give is thus: Onderstaande afbeeldingen zijn vrij van rechten. Ze zijn gescand op grafische resolutie (300 dpi) en mogen met bronvermelding (foto: Koninklijke Bibliotheek Den Haag) bij uw berichtgeving geplaatst worden., which roughly translates as:

The images below are free of copyrights. They are scanned at a resolution of 300 dpi and they can be placed in your publication if the source is attributed in the following way: "Picture: Koninklijke Bibliotheek Den Haag".

— mark ✎ 15:22, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

Other settings

This is admittedly less important today, however there have been opera settings of the folktale: Spohr's "Zemire und Azor" is one. Perhaps this should be mentioned?

Any notable adaptation is a worthy entry. Goldfritha 23:52, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Is it appropriate to mention somewhere a Russian version, "Аленький цветочек" (Scarlet Flower) by Сергей Аксаков (Sergey Aksakov)? It's a classic of Russian literature. Ivan.Lt (talk) 13:25, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

Mothers and significiance

The fairy tale, as commonly known, is about the father. If the first version was about the mother -- and I'd need a reference for that -- still the father's overwhelming prevalence means that this is the story with the significiance to be discusssed. Goldfritha 23:52, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Under "Adaptations"

"...by the end of the story, the audience is so accustomed to and charmed by the Beast, that when he changes back into the prince, it is a disappointment to see him reduced to just another pretty face."

I can see where this is coming from, but I have to disagree. Is this really something that applies to most people? It should be taken out. Sounds more like a personal preference to me.

by Wild Mountain Thyme 23:58, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

You're completely right. And also, that sounds like a fairly uncommon personal opinion to me, and is therefore not representative. 80.47.182.39 00:49, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

"cavivan"

I just cleaned a number of misspellings, but I'm stumped on this one: "The set includes a spinning cavivan." This is apparently a typo, but I have no clue what for. "Caravan," maybe? It should be corrected by someone who can guess what it is, or deleted otherwise. --TJRC (talk) 22:00, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Beast of Gévaudan

Is it possible that the Beast of Gévaudan is an inspiration for the Beast in this story? You can find info on the aforementioned beast by searching for it on this page. Cyrus Beautor (talk) 23:57, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Plot summary

I believe that the part when the Beauty is in the Beasts palace should be emphasized more, after all it is the more important part of the story. 19:18, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Templates

I placed "unreferenced" tags on each subsection of Adaptations so that any one can be removed when it no longer applies while the other subsections would remain tagged for as long as they lack references. Also, I believe the "Trivia" tag is valid for the adaptations section, see the links in the template. PSWG1920 (talk) 20:39, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Non-notable Productions

I've removed some of the stage production info as it doesn't seem to be that notable. It's preserved below if anyone disagrees. This has the added bonus of removing the mysterious "cavivan".

• Beauty and the Beast has recenly been adapted by Mark Bodicoat, part of Broughton Players to perform as a pantomime in February 2009. Characters include, Prince, Beast, Belle, Vera (Bells Sister), Mon Alliotoin (Vera & Bells Father), Sid, Arty (comedy duo), Madame Flambet (Dame), Guy, tracie, Dolly, Molly, Baker, Greengrocer and Butcher. Visit the Broughton Players Website for more information on www.broughtonplayers.org.uk

• Beauty and the Beast was The Castle Theatre Wellingborough Christmas show in Nov-Dec 2007 with all new music. The Castle's version of Beauty and the Beast tells the original story, though a traveling theatre company. The set included a spinning cavivan.

• Beauty and the Beast, musical version, has recently (1-15 November, 2008) been performed by the Gilbert and Sullivan Society, in conjunction with Leiz Moore and Allan Jeffery in Tasmania. The ultimate love story was a great success with thousands over the two week period coming out to view local talent at it's very best in the 'tale as old as time'

Broken link "RSC"

The link to the RSC from the sentence:

In 2003, the RSC put a version on stage that was closer to the original story than the Disney version. It was so popular that the RSC repeated it in 2004 with additions and slight variations to their original script.

doesn't redirect to the right organisation that is mentioned. I don't know which link is meant so I haven't changed anything. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.90.9.82 (talk) 18:47, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Needs something about the origins

Quoting from: http://www.balletmet.org/Notes/StoryOrigin.html

Many experts trace similarities back to the stories of Cupid and Psyche, Oedipus and Apuleius’ The Golden Ass of the second century A.D. The tale of Beauty and the Beast was first collected in Gianfranceso Straparola’s Le piacevolo notti (The Nights of Straparola) 1550-53. MantraMongoli (talk) 22:38, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

This is ENGLISH Wikipedia!

Articles in the English Wikipedia should not require capabilities in other languages to be understood!

If foreign language is used (in this case I presume it is French) – for instance as titles of published works beeing discussed – then an english direct translation should be provided at the spot! (I.e. not just the English title used on eventual corresponding English editions of the work in question, but a direct translation of what the foreingn words mean.)

In the current introduction to this article, the following two appears without any translation:
«La jeune américaine, et les contes marins» and: «Magasin des enfants, ou dialogues entre une sage gouvernante et plusieurs de ses élèves»

It is not satisfactory to just brush this off with: "Oh, that is just a title of a book (which never got published in english)"!
The reader will want to know what it says and what it means   including explanation of any idioms and so forth!

I feel confident that this must be stated in the wikipedia guidelines somewhere: ("English Wikipedia is not for polyglots only!. Therefore keep its content 100% accessible for English(only) speakers!").

Could someone please add tiny translations for the french-worded parts in this article? 89.9.144.46 (talk) 17:52, 8 May 2010 (UTC)

You don't have to be a polyglot to understand that something is a title, nor should it be required to translate all titles unless the translated title is also well-known by a name in English. Indeed, there are a number of works of literature and otherwise that are routinely named in a foreign language and rarely if ever translated. Examples: Decameron and Les Miserables, named in Latin and French respectively. A quick look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Literature shows some are translated and some aren't - likely because the ones that are translated are well known to english speakers by the English name (often a translation, but The Hunchback of Notredame is most certainly not).

Giving a translation for a work not known by its english name is not actually helpful nor does it make the material more accessible. Rather, it gives English speakers the impression that they can find it by its english name, when chances are that would be a very inefficient way to look for it, if not impossible.

FWIW, my rusty french is assembling 'the young american, and tales of the sea' and 'Shop for children, or dialogs involving a wise governor (in the sense of governess - manager of a household?) and several of his students'. I'm sure someone could do better.

--00:32, 12 April 2011 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.105.48 (talk)

The Pig King

Is there any reference that clear states or refers The Pig King is a variant or adaption of Beauty and the Beast? Or I will move it into "See also" section. --TX55^TALK 18:49, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Why no definite article in "Beauty"?

Does anyone know why the title would be "Beauty and the Beast" rather than "The Beauty and the Beast"? The original French has the definite article, and dropping it in English would seem to defy grammatical convention. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 00:37, 8 July 2015 (UTC)

• Never mind, I found the answer: "Beauty" was capitalized in the French original, so it became her name in English translations and therefore doesn't take the definite article (although, "la Bête" was also capitalized ...) Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 00:46, 8 July 2015 (UTC)

Modern uses and adaptations

The only thing found to the support the Super Mario universe idea is this theory. [[1]]

The story also certainly draws from the Hades and Persephone myth. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.203.140.218 (talk) 22:52, 13 November 2016 (UTC)

Cupid and Psyche some similarities (but not really the same lessons at all) but Persephone ? That's more than far-fetched. Do you even know the story of Persephone ? 116.231.73.114 (talk) 06:07, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

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Villeneuve's and Beaumont's version

The article is a bit confusing, I assume the first paragraph on the Villeneuve's version accidentally contains some facts that only apply to Beaumont's version. Having read neither, I cannot edit to clear it up, only point out the discrepancies:

Villeneuve's version

A widower merchant lives in a mansion with his six children (three sons and three daughters). All three of his daughters are very beautiful, but the youngest, Beauty

[...]

even her father threatens to disown Beauty if she refuses to marry his younger and wealthier cousin next week, a wedding which was arranged for his youngest daughter instead

Beaumont's version

Beaumont greatly pared down the cast of characters and simplified the tale to an almost archetypal simplicity. The story begins in much the same way, although now the merchant has only six children: three sons and three daughters of which Beauty is one.

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Anne Anderson05.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:12, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

Pornographic Link

I wasn't sure of the best way to edit this, so maybe someone with more experience can help. But I accidentally clicked on the original link for reference 1 instead of the archive, and the original link now sends you to a page with a pornographic image at the top. Is there a good way to remove the original link?

Fixed. Thanks for catching this. MarnetteD|Talk 18:14, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

Beauty and the beast

I don't know 41.4.0.44 (talk) 16:11, 4 August 2024 (UTC)